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tappo01

Mirrored MM for Harugumo and Worcester

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Just had a game where the enemy team had 2 Harugumos and 2 Worcesters against our 2 Shimas and other non-worcester cruisers no divisions by the way. Guess which team won? That was a complete waste of time as it was obvious the game was lost from the MM screen... not that it lasted very long as we barely made it to 10 minutes mark thankfully.

 

Ships that have the greatest influence on the outcome of a battle (read: OVERPOWERED) just like CVs need to be matched in order to give both teams a fair chance to win.

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3 hours ago, tappo01 said:

Just had a game where the enemy team had 2 Harugumos and 2 Worcesters against our 2 Shimas and other non-worcester cruisers no divisions by the way. Guess which team won? That was a complete waste of time as it was obvious the game was lost from the MM screen... not that it lasted very long as we barely made it to 10 minutes mark thankfully.

 

Ships that have the greatest influence on the outcome of a battle (read: OVERPOWERED) just like CVs need to be matched in order to give both teams a fair chance to win.

Shima is probably the worst DD, especially because most of them pick 20 km torps.

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Shima can outspot Harugumo for half a km, maybe your teamates should have played a bit more safe :Smile_child:

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14 minutes ago, Bics93 said:

Shima can outspot Harugumo for half a km, maybe your teamates should have played a bit more safe :Smile_child:

Plus flood Haru's smoke with torps.

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I dont see the problem, had that in ranked yesterday 2 haru haru (one of them me) and a wooster (a very good player) against 2 shimas and a hindenburg.....match lasted about 7 min....was hilarious...... (note this is sarcasm).....

Harugumo and wooster r very strong but also new ships, if it becomes clear that they overperform they will be nerfed.....

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OP is correct though, I have seen this quite a lot myself in the ranked match line-ups and in a 7v7 competitive mode it becomes quite important in terms of maintaining a fair and balanced match that the team line ups be mirrored as much as they can mirror them. Sure I can kill them now and then, but offering text-book 'send torps into smoke', etc etc advice is silly since gameplay situations vary and involve other players. Textbook solutions seldom present themselves in matches. Mirrored MM is a must (in competitive mode like ranked where teams don't get to select their team mates).

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If you want to enjoy MMM, play co-op...go a step further and play operations if you want to always face the same composition of ships.

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1 hour ago, tappo01 said:

Just had a game where the enemy team had 2 Harugumos and 2 Worcesters against our 2 Shimas and other non-worcester cruisers no divisions by the way. Guess which team won? That was a complete waste of time as it was obvious the game was lost from the MM screen... not that it lasted very long as we barely made it to 10 minutes mark thankfully.

 

Ships that have the greatest influence on the outcome of a battle (read: OVERPOWERED) just like CVs need to be matched in order to give both teams a fair chance to win.

No, there have never been any Shimas who ever won vs Haragumos, no matter how good or bad player were.

Games are decided by ships, not by players, ever!!! :fish_palm:

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If your team cant kill or dmg set ships its your teams fault not the ships. 

 

Worchester is easily punished by 203 and up from broadside and haeugumo is so sluggish that torps are real counter to it. 

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2 hours ago, 22cm said:

Shima is probably the worst DD, especially because moat of them pick 20 km torps.

As a Shima player myself the DD is not the worst but it is poorly used by many players who have her.

It's like the player using 20km torpedoes doesn't realise that 20km torpedoes are detected 2.5km away and can only be successfully used if you're firing into a group of ships and then only to break up a group attack for they seldom hit, or if you have an afk target, which in my opinion doesn't count.

48 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

No, there have never been any Shimas who ever won vs Haragumos, no matter how good or bad player were.

Games are decided by ships, not by players, ever!!! :fish_palm:

I have never won a 1v1 engagement against Haragumo in my Shimakaze.. I see one I fire my 15 torpedoes, 2 wide 1 narrow and try to keep it spotted in the hope that someone kills it. The guns of the Haragumo are potent enough to even deter Cruisers and some Battleships.

35 minutes ago, Guillotine said:

If your team cant kill or dmg set ships its your teams fault not the ships. 

 

Worchester is easily punished by 203 and up from broadside and haeugumo is so sluggish that torps are real counter to it. 

Worcester has such an arc of fire and rate of fire that if they are well sited you cannot even get close for the kill shot without being heavily damaged. I don't know what there fire % rate is from their HE but no sooner is a fire out you get another...

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2 minutes ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

 

I have never won a 1v1 engagement against Haragumo in my Shimakaze.. I see one I fire my 15 torpedoes, 2 wide 1 narrow and try to keep it spotted in the hope that someone kills it. The guns of the Haragumo are potent enough to even deter Cruisers and some Battleships.

 

That is why this is no 1v1 game in the first place....

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8 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

That is why this is no 1v1 game in the first place....

Of course it is not but occasionally you end up in 1v1 situations and in this scenario a 1v1 Haragumo v Shimakaze always bodes ill for the Shimakaze...

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2 minutes ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

Of course it is not but occasionally you end up in 1v1 situations and in this scenario a 1v1 Haragumo v Shimakaze always bodes ill for the Shimakaze...

A Shima that ends up 1v1 vs a gunboat (no matter which) is doing it wrong...

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2 hours ago, tappo01 said:

Just had a game where the enemy team had 2 Harugumos and 2 Worcesters against our 2 Shimas and other non-worcester cruisers no divisions by the way. Guess which team won? That was a complete waste of time as it was obvious the game was lost from the MM screen... not that it lasted very long as we barely made it to 10 minutes mark thankfully.

 

Ships that have the greatest influence on the outcome of a battle (read: OVERPOWERED) just like CVs need to be matched in order to give both teams a fair chance to win.

Worcester and harogumo are not op ( worcester might need  an armour nerf), and as they are new lines, right now only above average players are playing them, you put them against the shimas that are usually driven by spectacular  potatoes. 

 

Going 1vs 1 at  close range against the highest dpm ships in the game is not a great idea, you are playing their game

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19 minutes ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

As a Shima player myself the DD is not the worst but it is poorly used by many players who have her.

It's like the player using 20km torpedoes doesn't realise that 20km torpedoes are detected 2.5km away and can only be successfully used if you're firing into a group of ships and then only to break up a group attack for they seldom hit, or if you have an afk target, which in my opinion doesn't count.

I have never won a 1v1 engagement against Haragumo in my Shimakaze.. I see one I fire my 15 torpedoes, 2 wide 1 narrow and try to keep it spotted in the hope that someone kills it. The guns of the Haragumo are potent enough to even deter Cruisers and some Battleships.

Worcester has such an arc of fire and rate of fire that if they are well sited you cannot even get close for the kill shot without being heavily damaged. I don't know what there fire % rate is from their HE but no sooner is a fire out you get another...

Cuz only idiot goes 1v1, you seek angles, if you let him farm freely team lacks push on other flanks. 

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1 hour ago, aboomination said:

If you want to enjoy MMM, play co-op...go a step further and play operations if you want to always face the same composition of ships.

I think we all know where we can find these features in their existing form, but where they definitely need to exist, they do not.

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9 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

A Shima that ends up 1v1 vs a gunboat (no matter which) is doing it wrong...

That comment cannot be applied to all situations. There will invariably be times when this standoff could easily occur, and to make it sound like it's always a choice is not correct. I'm sure you could imagine in which situations this could present itself. A player that knowingly embarks in a gun fight with a ship he knows easily outguns him is of course really silly, but accidentally finding yourself alone versus a stronger opponent end game is not necessarily anyones fault.

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the only mode currently available for all players were a harugumo has such a high impact is ranked.....and sry but ranked is not about fighting the enemy, ur fighting ur team, the enemy just provides moving targets....

 

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14 minutes ago, Flavio1997 said:

Worcester and harogumo are not op ( worcester might need  an armour nerf), and as they are new lines, right now only above average players are playing them, you put them against the shimas that are usually driven by spectacular  potatoes. 

 

Going 1vs 1 at  close range against the highest dpm ships in the game is not a great idea, you are playing their game

Can you qualify the bolded text above for us? Surely anyone with enough free xp, real xp and / or enough money can unlock and buy these?

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Why do people forget, or are ignorant of, or choose to ignore, the FACT that the stock Shima has the 20km torps and you need to grind the xp to unlock the other options (unless you free xp them). That of course does not excuse people from keeping them on board once the other options have been researched.

 

As for the spotting difference between Harugumo and Shima, given that both ships are not the most nimble, combined with rendering times, it amounts to very little warning if any for the Shima (especially if you are both heading towards a similar destination point)

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3 hours ago, tappo01 said:

Just had a game where the enemy team had 2 Harugumos and 2 Worcesters against our 2 Shimas and other non-worcester cruisers no divisions by the way. Guess which team won? That was a complete waste of time as it was obvious the game was lost from the MM screen... not that it lasted very long as we barely made it to 10 minutes mark thankfully.

 

Ships that have the greatest influence on the outcome of a battle (read: OVERPOWERED) just like CVs need to be matched in order to give both teams a fair chance to win.

Well, when it comes to the DDs you're comparing... You see, thing is - Shima is actually Harugumo's worst nightmare. Not in direct combat, of course, but a Shima needs to f*ck up big time to enter a direct fight with Harugumo. Her concealment advantage lets her easily outspot Harugumo without revealing herself. Her speed and maneuverability doesn't let Harugumo easily shake her and disengage. Her wall of skill can sweep Harugumo's smoke clean.

 

The reason why average Shimakaze isn't much of a threat to an average Harugumo player is because average skill level between Shima players is disastrously low (for a couple reasons that I won't be bringing up here) while Harugumo still enjoys the "recently introduced t10 on top of a not-that-popular line" effect. People who play Harugumo are mostly experienced players who enjoyed Akizuki - hardly all unicums, of course, but the general skill level is above average for WoWs standards.

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8 minutes ago, philjd said:

Why do people forget, or are ignorant of, or choose to ignore, the FACT that the stock Shima has the 20km torps and you need to grind the xp to unlock the other options (unless you free xp them). That of course does not excuse people from keeping them on board once the other options have been researched.

 

When I tell them not to use the 20 km torps, most idiots replay it s 16 km, so they even specced their captain with TA, so what you say is not valid.

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10 minutes ago, 22cm said:

When I tell them not to use the20 km torps, most idiots replay it s 16 km, so they even specced their captain with TA, so what you say is not valid.

With all due respect,nothing you have said negates what I stated. Yes, probably most Shima drivers have unlocked the decent torps, but some are forced to use the 20km ones.

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OP, you could at least give us a screenshot of the line up when you are trying to make some kind of statement... Currently it feels like you guys lacked in providing support.

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49 minutes ago, eliastion said:

The reason why average Shimakaze isn't much of a threat to an average Harugumo player is because average skill level between Shima players is disastrously low

GmAWA2u.gif

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