CV Rework Discussion

[Panocek]

2 hours ago, Rionnen_marksman said:

I wonder, what would happen if they increased Alpha of higher tier CV’s (but lowered fire/flood chance) and brought back “no fly zone” ships? 

Flood chance is already next to zero, if was nerfhammered with first hotfix of the REEEwork back in February (?)

[El2aZeR]

1 minute ago, Panocek said:

Flood chance is already next to zero, if was nerfhammered with first hotfix of the REEEwork back in February (?)

 

That was only for IJN CVs. Because when flying Shima Haku exists, everything must be nerfed.

And for Midway eventually for whatever reason.

But hey, at least Enterprise TBs got buffed?

 

The ways of balans are unfathomable.

[MrBourpif]

Il y a 19 minutes, BLUB__BLUB a dit :

So far I haven't managed to really "crossdrop" a DD. I dunno why:

- The planes on Ark Royal are just a little bit too slow/DDs too fast?

- I sort of think the turning radius of the Swordfish is slightly bigger than in T4?

(but I'll keep trying).

 

When you hit them right and RNGesus accepted your sheep, yes. Half the DD gone. Rarely happens. 

However most of the time it is more like 1-2K for a rocket strike ( OK you have 3) and 2-3 for a carpet-bomb whack.

or perhaps mine always zig when they should zag, anyway the times I hit a DD for 4-7K can be counted with one finger... OK maybe five.

 

True, but there's also those that you hit full on with HE bombs and then nothing much happens.

It will also cost you more planes, plus they have heal so percentage-wise you hurt them much less. 

 

Well... ehh... How about +3 then? Still above average... 

  Révéler le contenu masqué

 

Yes a TIV IJN CV will do better, because they recently gave them double torps... 

Yet the server average is still <25K for Hermes and Langley. 

 

My average on Ark Royal is 42.500 or so. A bit above average but I'm not THAT good... check the Ranger. 

I'm still learning the best ways to exploit Ark Royal... so studying. And usually I leave the fat ones to my div-mates, not being greedy. 

With div-mates I have almost 70% WR, damage 41.5K. Solo I manage a bit more, over 43K. However... 48K for Ryujo, which is only gonna get better.

Must say most of it due to games ending really really quick (weekend player). I just cannot get enough damage in fast enough (better with Ryujo AP bombs).

But why CVs are OP, well, here is why:

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Bismarck is my favourite food...if I can't find one I'll just tear a North Carolina apart. T8? What heavy AA? Heavier than Bismarck? No problem....

  Révéler le contenu masqué

 

 

This depends. Most CV players are potato. If you get a good one (and we get more of those, as potatoes are giving up CV), he is right.

The average-to-good DD player has absolutely NO CHANCE against an average-to-good CV player, assuming equally skilled.

One potato vs the other, well, it is a matter of who potatoes the most... of course.

 

Any T8 BB can get 3 torps up the rear, depends which one it is if I can do it a second time with same squad.

And that's just me and I am not that good, really. 

Very interesting, but .. You are not the typical CV player aren't you ? 

My problem at this time is untrained Captain and playing solo. Once i get better, I'll tell you about ARK, but so far i'm not impressed.

Once I played Furious, seemed easier to turn when aiming with her. AR is really stiff to turn when you try to evade AA with weapons armed. 

[Bear__Necessities]

3 hours ago, MrBourpif said:

Actually, only OP CV i know, is Hosho at tier IV, every torp hits, big damage and it's citadel fair with AP bombs. And protected MM makes her a really OP CV.

there is no others !

 

[Rionnen_marksman]

1 hour ago, MrBourpif said:

I sincerely doubt that. I'm not as new on game that you seems to Believe.

That’s probably because I have nothing else to go off other than your name and 92 battles? 

 

Either way, it doesn’t really matter, CV’s are in general overpowered, it doesn’t matter whether you have 92 battles or you’re a second account and have 50,000 battles on that one, they’re still overpowered.

[BLUB__BLUB]

1 hour ago, MrBourpif said:

Very interesting, but .. You are not the typical CV player aren't you ? 

No I'm not. But I am not very good either. 

 

1 hour ago, MrBourpif said:

My problem at this time is untrained Captain and playing solo. Once i get better, I'll tell you about ARK, but so far i'm not impressed.

Once I played Furious, seemed easier to turn when aiming with her. AR is really stiff to turn when you try to evade AA with weapons armed. 

Well,  playing in div doesn;t really make it better. Except for the WR...

You tend to help your teammates, and your own damage count goes down. 

Furious is way easier. You should try that thing in T9 then you realise how easy it is with fast planes.

[Blixies]

5 hours ago, MrBourpif said:

As i told , (but you didn't read), And that's funny historically speaking, an Ark Royal tier VI squad can't even approach a Bismarck.

Cv damage is very low, planes are papermade and playing +2 is just a joke. It's like playing with a Phalanx system shooting down your shells.

Hello again, fren.
I came back to show you the result of a game I played today. As soon as I saw the MM during the loading of the battle, I was reminded of you. Here goes:
Ark Royal vs your favorite example, the Bismarck and an infamous AA fortress, the Vladivostok:

Spoiler

The first kill of game was none other than the Bismarck.
Notice that I had to get around his platoon-mate Tirpitz and a Vladivostok.
I also was in the AA of both of them at some points of the attack.
 

 

Moments later... This:

Tier 6 CV, and specifically AR do just fine in tier 8 MM:

 

 

[Bear__Necessities]

5 minutes ago, Blixies said:

Hello again, fren.
I came back to show you the result of a game I played today. As soon as I saw the MM during the loading of the battle, I was reminded of you. Here goes:
Ark Royal vs your favorite example, the Bismarck and an infamous AA fortress, the Vladivostok:

  Reveal hidden contents

The first kill of game was none other than the Bismarck.
Notice that I had to get around his platoon-mate Tirpitz and a Vladivostok.
I also was in the AA of both of them at some points of the attack.
 

 

Moments later... This:

Tier 6 CV, and specifically AR do just fine in tier 8 MM:

 

 

I can only assume a player who finds Ark Royal is due weak to L2P issues...

 

It’s fun sinking Bismarck’s, I’ve done it twice so far :P

[Sunleader]

Have you seen the Patchnotes xD

 

WG has given up on Balancing CVs Gameplay.

Instead they have apparently decided to just Reduce the Reward they get.

Especially for High Tier CVs and even more so Defeats.

 

Given that Average CV Players Generally do extremely Bad in Winrate thanks to how much Influence a CV Wields in a Match.

This will be a nice way of Correcting Spreadsheet. After all the Average Value will this way actually go down Considerably as more CVs tend to have Bad WR than Good WR.

So on Spreadsheet CVs will actually earn roughly the same Average Exp as Battleships of the same Tier.

 

Needless to say that the Reward Nerf wont change anything about CVs still mopping the Floor with a Battleship in actual Gameplay.

 

 

However. A Nice Side Effect will be that thanks to Average Potato Players having their Reward Nerfed quite a bit. This will Encourage more Players to not Play CV anymore thanks to having to Grind even more.

 

[Yedwy]

Not enough players buying the T10 permacamos for cvs and the T8 prems it seems, well since i net about 300-500k profit (thats after the service costs) with them in an average battle I guess slight reduction wont mean sqat to me esp since I play less cvs then other classes... 

[El2aZeR]

8 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

Not enough players buying the T10 permacamos for cvs and the T8 prems it seems, well since i net about 300-500k profit (thats after the service costs) with them in an average battle I guess slight reduction wont mean sqat to me esp since I play less cvs then other classes... 

 

It's not even the credits income they're nerfing. In fact Midway is getting a buff in that regard for whatever reason.

They're nerfing only base exp income.

 

Rip my dreams of getting a 6k base exp match someday. T_T

[Yedwy]

6 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

It's not even the credits income they're nerfing. In fact Midway is getting a buff in that regard for whatever reason.

They're nerfing only base exp income.

 

Rip my dreams of getting a 6k base exp match someday. T_T

Well as the only T10 I play regurarly is Midway I guess its yay? I mean it makes life even easyer... 

 

As for base xp nerf, well I guess well just have to focus even more of our love twards our little buddies to compensate... 

[CptBarney]

55 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

Well as the only T10 I play regurarly is Midway I guess its yay? I mean it makes life even easyer... 

 

As for base xp nerf, well I guess well just have to focus even more of our love twards our little buddies to compensate... 

Yay income buff for midways.

 

 

Yay r.i.p smoll boutes.

[DrMechano]

1 hour ago, El2aZeR said:

 

It's not even the credits income they're nerfing. In fact Midway is getting a buff in that regard for whatever reason.

They're nerfing only base exp income.

 

Rip my dreams of getting a 6k base exp match someday. T_T

 

So is this them saying that CVs earn too much exp...so...that's them basically, indirectly, saying that CVs played by good people are TOO good because they're earning more XP so that needed a nerf but didn't actually do anything to balance CVs despite them earning too much exp or am I reading this completely wrong?

[MrBourpif]

Il y a 9 heures, Blixies a dit :

Hello again, fren.
I came back to show you the result of a game I played today. As soon as I saw the MM during the loading of the battle, I was reminded of you. Here goes:
Ark Royal vs your favorite example, the Bismarck and an infamous AA fortress, the Vladivostok:

  Masquer du contenu

The first kill of game was none other than the Bismarck.
Notice that I had to get around his platoon-mate Tirpitz and a Vladivostok.
I also was in the AA of both of them at some points of the attack.
 

 

Moments later... This:

Tier 6 CV, and specifically AR do just fine in tier 8 MM:

 

 

I can show this kinda of funny picture too, game with close to 100K damage and Bismarck kills. And I can show you a Bismarck with a guy who know how to play AA vaporizing my entire squads. 

Where is the Truth ? AR Average damage is close to 40K : THIS IS NOT OP ! If you do this all games (80K damage Killing Tier VIII one hand), you are not the rule, you are the exception. 

[1MajorKoenig]

32 minutes ago, DrMechano said:

 

So is this them saying that CVs earn too much exp...so...that's them basically, indirectly, saying that CVs played by good people are TOO good because they're earning more XP so that needed a nerf but didn't actually do anything to balance CVs despite them earning too much exp or am I reading this completely wrong?

 

No they are not saying CVs are too good. They finally found out that the XP gain factor is too high on CVs so they receive too much XP for their actions. 

 

It was pretty clear since 0.8.0 that the XP factor was chosen too high after rework. However I think WG wanted it to be high for the initial round of grinding honestly.

 

Now they bring it in line - that’s good

[El2aZeR]

7 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

And I can show you a Bismarck with a guy who know how to play AA vaporizing my entire squads. 

 

You do realize there is no "playing with AA" beyond pressing one, maybe two buttons, right?

Here's a question for you tho:

[Blixies]

8 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

I can show you a Bismarck with a guy who know how to play AA vaporizing my entire squads. 

No you can't. There is no such thing in this game.

[MrBourpif]

Il y a 19 minutes, Blixies a dit :

No you can't. There is no such thing in this game.

There is people using 0 key and other people who Don't. People who knows how to arrange their captains skill for AA, people who knows how to evade air attacks. 

So one guy can be executed and the other one won't get a scratch.

 

Execute bad players, i can do that in a JB or a Yamato way easier (just 1 fkg salvo and boom), and you Don't call them OP. I Don't feel you are objective on this subject, that's just pure CV hate. 

 

@El2aZeR

come on dude if you want to troll, try Something better than this.

[El2aZeR]

5 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

There is people using 0 key and other people who Don't. People who knows how to arrange their captains skill for AA, people who knows how to evade air attacks. 

 

Sector reinforcement has minimal impact on plane losses.

Most AA enhancements center around flak and as such are entirely useless. DPS enhancements do too little have much impact even in combination with the other mechanics and as such aren't worthwhile.

Air attacks cannot be evaded unless the CV messes up.

[rnat]

6 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

There is people using 0 key and other people who Don't. People who knows how to arrange their captains skill for AA, people who knows how to evade air attacks. 

So one guy can be executed and the other one won't get a scratch.

There are people that will make a good CV player loose a few planes per 1-2 runs and those who don't,

people who know how to make life marginally or even relatively annoying for them.

So one guy can be executed in a jiffy and the other actually won't survive much longer if the CV wishes so.

 

edit: crap, beaten to the punch by a good CV player (TM)

[El2aZeR]

11 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

@El2aZeR

come on dude if you want to troll, try Something better than this

 

I'm not trolling, just telling the truth.

Perhaps you're just not as good as you believe you are?

[Blixies]

14 minutes ago, MrBourpif said:

There is people using 0 key and other people who Don't. People who knows how to arrange their captains skill for AA, people who knows how to evade air attacks. 

So one guy can be executed and the other one won't get a scratch.

 

Execute bad players, i can do that in a JB or a Yamato way easier (just 1 fkg salvo and boom), and you Don't call them OP. I Don't feel you are objective on this subject, that's just pure CV hate. 

Since El2azer already answered your other arguments (I couln't have said it better myself), let me ask you why the hell would I hate on CVs, when they are my favorite, and in fact most palyed calss since the rework?
Everyone who does not agree with you is hater? Come on now...

Also, wanna do some training room tests? You can pick the Bismarck up (full AA, undamaged), I'll take Ark Royal and I will show you exactly how "untouchable" you are.
Hopefully that would cure you of your delusions.

[Saltface]

5 minutes ago, Blixies said:

Also, wanna do some training room tests? You can pick the Bismarck up (full AA, undamaged), I'll take Ark Royal and I will show you exactly how "untouchable" you are.
Hopefully that would cure you of your delusions.

can I watch?

 

My thoughts.

If the CV player is average you are dead the moment they decide you are.

Do you want me to tell you what happens when the CV player is good?

Exactly the same. Only faster.

 

 

 

[MrBourpif]

Ok, i'm not going to fight the whole Unicum Cv hater bunch.

 

CV are OP, AR is such a threat it could fight tier X etc … why this 40k average so … ? I suppose i will never have an answer on this.  

Or maybe your opinion is the opinion of people NOT representative of most players reality and CV are OP in your hands and not in 99% of players in this game.

 

Doesn't mean CV are more OP than a Yamato, a Sinop, or some DM you never mention being OP.

 

@Saltface Turn broadside to a Yamato, even faster, not OP, OS is just legit … Sure … 

 

Just another CV hater nonsense festival

 

Have a nice day !