CV Rework Discussion

[KillStealBoss]

2 minutes ago, Eddy209 said:

No amount off DDs suffering will ever quench the thirst for revenge for what they did to noob BBs on the lower tiers. ;)

To be honest though - it could be a little more air detection  on kamikaze and her sisters. And Asashio . No real justifacation for Asashio to be fair - just pure spite ;)

Nope. It should be even smaller. Like 1.8km air detection.

[Eddy209]

But,...But that would be reasonable. I prefer to lobby against anything that is good for DDs. ;) The DD mafia is to be crushed. You will not stop it with your balanced ideas and suggestions. Fight against the sympathy for the small boats - you will only be dissapointed by them. 

All hail the CV/BB superiority with their cruiser servants. Its the only way.....the only way...think of the meta we got so used to - it might change and then the sky will fall down - wich is bad for radar antennas, we cant have that. 

[159Hunter]

13 hours ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

Which is - quite frankly - not a very smart idea. IF spotting is an issue - which I would strongly challenge - one could think about some delaying mechanism as proposed multiple times now 

 

 

While I would like to overcome this “them vs us” the part you guys miss us that it isn’t only about the absolute power level of CVs but that the changes are contradictory to the CV mechanics making it  to play 

OFC spotting is an issue, look up the numbers. CVs spot more than double what any other class can spot. Combine that with the damage and it is an issue.

Delay doesn't work, as mentioned before, because there is no time limit on CV planes.

 

FYI, I also play CVs, so I'm by no means a "them", as for the changes contradicting the mechanics: they aren't, unless you call: "a class that roflstomps any other class" a valid mechanism. Otherwise: nope, all changes up to now (cba to look into the future) make CV players think before attacking and add some sort of counterplay for other ships. So yeah, that's called balance and I like it.

 

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

I never said that the should not nerve CV's in the first place. I always said that unreasonable non stop Nerving Patch after Patch is totally (how should is say) inappropriate. I can't imagine that everything is already Tested etc...

You can choose between: constant small nerfs or one time russian hammer (as they have done in the past). Think before you say you don't like constant small nerfs...

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

and if we look at balancing. Certain ships in the game still are redicoulus op *cough* Conq *cough* but yeah no one did anything about that. But hey it's just a BB that has currently the highest average DMG in the game. Even higher then the RTS CV that where apparently sooo OP and that ships does not get nerved. (i dont count bourgogne since its more like an exclusive ship)

And they are working on Conq as we speak. And if you want to dismiss Bourgogne, GG. It's not because it's somewhat rare that it isn't strong.

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

Now CV's are just getting hammered and hammered patch after patch without any mandan Reason why. I understand the where OP in regards of when the came out. But after Nerf and Nerf that is just to much.

Read above.

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

No most of the consumables that you have are useless and skills are also usless. You had adrenalin rush on your captain well sucks to be you because its now useless. You have heal on TB? OH really well its now totally useless. Dont even bother pressing the heal button on TB except you want to recall them and hope that the 5 sec's are enough to save most of them.

I respectfully disagree, fighter, speedboost, even heal are still usefull. You also have tons of cpt skills that you can use, there is even variation possible.

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

Oh you paid 50 euros for a New CV called GZ? Nice thx for the money we will nerv it now THX (if you dont know what i mean with nerving then check the GZ AP bomb drop angles and you will see what i mean). OR best how about we remove 10-20 knots speed of ALL planes of every CV? Brilliant!

As I stated before: all people who quickly bought CVs after 0.8.0 have only themselves to blame. They were blatantly OP and were bound to get nerfed (as a class).

If you didn't see that, then I doubt you'll notice any difference in gameplay with all the nerfs.

If you did see it : well, you gambled and you lost.

( or you should have bought Big E and still continu farming )

13 hours ago, DragonstrikerOrigin said:

The list just goes on and on. Did you realize that currently the most successful ships in CV's are Enterprise and Kaga? Do you know why? The can throw there planes against you without paying to much attention since the will get the planes back pretty fast or have a huge reserve

Yes, and is that a token of skillfull - good - balanced gameplay? No it isn't, and that's how all CVs were before the nerfs as AA didn't hurt them. Now AA hurts and CVs need to start thinking.

12 hours ago, L0V3_and_PE4CE said:

snip

I too can make such an argument, about a random potato (won't even do naming and shaming) that can't play surface ships and gets outplayed by CV every single time.

Should we thus cater to that guy and nerf other ships (aka CVs)? 

[KillStealBoss]

27 minutes ago, Eddy209 said:

But,...But that would be reasonable. I prefer to lobby against anything that is good for DDs. ;) The DD mafia is to be crushed. You will not stop it with your balanced ideas and suggestions. Fight against the sympathy for the small boats - you will only be dissapointed by them. 

All hail the CV/BB superiority with their cruiser servants. Its the only way.....the only way...think of the meta we got so used to - it might change and then the sky will fall down - wich is bad for radar antennas, we cant have that. 

YY will get torp reload buff, finally! 

[B051LjKo]

3 minutes ago, 159Hunter said:

I respectfully disagree, fighter, speedboost, even heal are still usefull. You also have tons of cpt skills that you can use, there is even variation possible.

Can you please describe how adrenaline rush is useful after 8.5? What other ''ton of capt skills'' we can use, and who will pay for the respec?

[1MajorKoenig]

40 minutes ago, MacArthur92 said:

Nope. It should be even smaller. Like 1.8km air detection.

 

1.8 km is ridiculous. And absolutely unneeded 

[KillStealBoss]

1 minute ago, B051LjKo said:

Can you please describe how adrenaline rush is useful after 8.5? What other ''ton of capt skills'' we can use, and who will pay for the respec?

AR isn't useful anymore.

[KillStealBoss]

1 minute ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

1.8 km is ridiculous. And absolutely unneeded 

They have no AA at all. They need it. 

[1MajorKoenig]

7 minutes ago, 159Hunter said:

OFC spotting is an issue, look up the numbers. CVs spot more than double what any other class can spot. Combine that with the damage and it is an issue.

Delay doesn't work, as mentioned before, because there is no time limit on CV planes.

 

FYI, I also play CVs, so I'm by no means a "them", as for the changes contradicting the mechanics: they aren't, unless you call: "a class that roflstomps any other class" a valid mechanism. Otherwise: nope, all changes up to now (cba to look into the future) make CV players think before attacking and add some sort of counterplay for other ships. So yeah, that's called balance and I like it.

 

You can choose between: constant small nerfs or one time russian hammer (as they have done in the past). Think before you say you don't like constant small nerfs...

And they are working on Conq as we speak. And if you want to dismiss Bourgogne, GG. It's not because it's somewhat rare that it isn't strong.

Read above.

I respectfully disagree, fighter, speedboost, even heal are still usefull. You also have tons of cpt skills that you can use, there is even variation possible.

As I stated before: all people who quickly bought CVs after 0.8.0 have only themselves to blame. They were blatantly OP and were bound to get nerfed (as a class).

If you didn't see that, then I doubt you'll notice any difference in gameplay with all the nerfs.

If you did see it : well, you gambled and you lost.

( or you should have bought Big E and still continu farming )

Yes, and is that a token of skillfull - good - balanced gameplay? No it isn't, and that's how all CVs were before the nerfs as AA didn't hurt them. Now AA hurts and CVs need to start thinking.

I too can make such an argument, about a random potato (won't even do naming and shaming) that can't play surface ships and gets outplayed by CV every single time.

Should we thus cater to that guy and nerf other ships (aka CVs)? 

 

We are going in circles and I am not in the mood to repeat everything so I keep it short & sweet: no

[1MajorKoenig]

1 minute ago, MacArthur92 said:

They have no AA at all. They need it. 

 

DDs no AA? And no teammates with idiot proof-auto-win-AA? And don’t they get a monkey button themselves to auto-shoot down some planes next? 

 

Are we playing the same game?

[1MajorKoenig]

2 hours ago, NikolayKuznetsov said:

If that 4th option appeals most to you, you're probably not very fun at parties.

 

If you find your joke funny you have probably never been to a party yourself 

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

51 minutes ago, Eddy209 said:

No amount off DDs suffering will ever quench the thirst for revenge for what they did to noob BBs on the lower tiers. ;)

To be honest though - it could be a little more air detection  on kamikaze and her sisters. And Asashio . No real justifacation for Asashio to be fair - just pure spite ;)

Spoiler

[B051LjKo]

1 hour ago, MacArthur92 said:

You want it to be more? Are you an evil person? 

 

Naah, DDs should be able to hide, and 2.5 km is point blank. People think it is easy to find a dd hiding, but it is not.

[Eddy209]

40 minutes ago, Europizza said:

  Hide contents

Burn it with fire!!!!

 

[B051LjKo]

51 minutes ago, MacArthur92 said:

AR isn't useful anymore.

Some would say players are to be blames for selecting ''overpowered captain skill'' that was bound to get nerfed in the first place. Therefore, they should not whine, but grab their doubloons, and pay for another respec.

[El2aZeR]

1 hour ago, MacArthur92 said:

AR isn't useful anymore.

 

That'd be implying AR was ever useful in the first place. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Seriously, if the skill is to be retained it should be redesigned. Even in its original iteration it was more of a hindrance than anything else.

[KillStealBoss]

1 hour ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

DDs no AA? And no teammates with idiot proof-auto-win-AA? And don’t they get a monkey button themselves to auto-shoot down some planes next? 

 

Are we playing the same game?

Asashio and kamikaze have any kind of AA? That's what I meant then. To make no AA DDs more stealthy by air. 

[KillStealBoss]

3 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

That'd be implying AR was ever useful in the first place. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Seriously, if the skill is to be retained it should be redesigned. Even in its original iteration it was more of a hindrance than anything else.

It was useful before 0.8.5 when continuous DPS AA was damaging planes randomly thus the squadron was loosing hp and gaining some speed. Now AR should be redesigned.

[El2aZeR]

1 minute ago, MacArthur92 said:

It was useful before 0.8.5 when continuous DPS AA was damaging planes randomly thus the squadron was loosing hp and gaining some speed. Now AR should be redesigned.

 

No it really wasn't. Because 

- you really don't want to be flying around with a damaged squadron

- you want the fastest turnaround times possible when attacking multiple times, as such AR actually hindered you by decreasing your reengagement window

- the last thing you want to do when flying through flak is speed up due to the way it is tuned

 

As such this skill was absolutely worthless in the great majority of situations. You'd be much better off picking other skills than this one.

[B051LjKo]

35 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

That'd be implying AR was ever useful in the first place. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Seriously, if the skill is to be retained it should be redesigned. Even in its original iteration it was more of a hindrance than anything else.

It was quite good on the Saipan, with not a lot of planes and a high HP it really made a difference. 

[B051LjKo]

28 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

No it really wasn't. Because 

- you really don't want to be flying around with a damaged squadron

- you want the fastest turnaround times possible when attacking multiple times, as such AR actually hindered you by decreasing your reengagement window

- the last thing you want to do when flying through flak is speed up due to the way it is tuned

 

As such this skill was absolutely worthless in the great majority of situations. You'd be much better off picking other skills than this one.

You are incorrect, it was good and useful. Not for flying around with damaged squadron but to get out of AA range once the attack was completed. The more AAA you take, the lower the HP, the faster you go out of the AAA cloud... 

[Panocek]

46 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

You are incorrect, it was good and useful. Not for flying around with damaged squadron but to get out of AA range once the attack was completed. The more AAA you take, the lower the HP, the faster you go out of the AAA cloud... 

Something you do with accelerated bailout, which is faster than AR will ever get you.

[El2aZeR]

1 hour ago, B051LjKo said:

It was quite good on the Saipan, with not a lot of planes and a high HP it really made a difference. 

 

AR is based on HP percentage. That means lower HP planes benefitted the most as their HP would get reduced faster.

 

1 hour ago, B051LjKo said:

You are incorrect, it was good and useful. Not for flying around with damaged squadron but to get out of AA range once the attack was completed. The more AAA you take, the lower the HP, the faster you go out of the AAA cloud... 

 

Trying to save a damaged squad by flying out of AA is bad for several reasons.

One, it wastes your time as too few planes (if any) will make it out to be worth it. If you have enough time to do that, you have enough time to make a second attack so that kinda defeats the point of trying to manually save your squad.

Two, accel bail will do the job much faster with fewer casualties, effort and time wasted.

Three, flak renders extremely late if you're not looking at the ship shooting to the point where taking invis flak is not only common, it is the ing norm.

[Eddy209]

2 hours ago, MacArthur92 said:

Asashio and kamikaze have any kind of AA? That's what I meant then. To make no AA DDs more stealthy by air. 

But those are the ones you need a counter for , If you leave them alone they will flank your team and then its torp city. They can Shine at that in the 9 out of 10 their games when they face no CV - if they play well. If they dont - its on them.

If they face a carrier they have to learn that their game should be close to friendly AA or close to cover at least until late game. Sure that game might suck for them, but so does a 4 DD game for BB , or a 5 BB game for Cruisers. And those are far from being rare.

And DDs rushing for the cap in a CV game on the flank where planes were spotted? Its not the smartest move they can make. They become predictable and therefore easier to find. Why would they do that? because the Enemy DDs do that too?

Nobody stopps them from smoking up and waste a CVs time, especialy those that actually have AA. Sure they might not do much for a minute - but well - the CV either goes for something else or also wastes a minute or how long the smoke goes. Yes they used a smoke they might need later - so what - torp a BB and he might usel a heal he might need later , bait a Radar ship into using it and he lost a charge he might need later.

 

[zordage]

Droping my 2 cents on the current update.

First of all the casualty's on plains is way out of control and to be honest if you expect us to buy this crap then get a handle on it and that fast.