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Mr_Snoww

Guide for ranked games with CVs in them

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I have noticed that not many people know what to do in a ranked game when cvs are present and often moan about having to deal with them. I am going to give you guys some tips if you want to win cv games and help your friendly cv player making his life easier. 

 

1. Try to stick together as a team and don't yolo off by yourself, especially not into hostile AA ships where your cv cannot support you. Ranked is 7v7 therefore it is very easy for a cv to isolate someone sailing alone and force an attack through even if that ship has good AA. 

 

2. If you are an AA ship vulnerable to AP bombs please avoid using def AA on torp bombers if you can help it as the cv will just kill you after def AA has gone down. These ships in ranked include: moskva, des moines, Henri, zao, and stalingrad. 

 

3. If there are ships with heavy AA on the enemy team please focus them first so that your cv can be more effective and is able to give better fighter support. 

 

4. Do not flame or harrass your cv for not doing what you want e.i protecting you or dropping a certain ship that you want dead. Usually he will have a better understanding of what is going on in the game and knows what he has to do. Flaming him will just make him play poorly. Now you can him him helpful information and request support but don't get angry if he says he can't because that will usually mean that you are out of position or in enemy AA bubbles which he can't drop through or defend you in. 

 

5. If enemy fighters or any planes come I. Your aa range please ctrl click on them to help kill them faster. It may be a small difference but I can make the difference between a ship dying and not dying. Even if you are a dd and planes are hovering over you especially fighter locked in a duel turning you aa on for that duel can make all the difference. Only if they are spotting range of course. If they are not spotting you or you are not in smoke in a dd leave your aa off. 

 

6. Cvs are not your personal bodyguards so don't just expect cover all the time especially if you are off by yourself. We can only be in so many places at once. 

 

That's all of the main points I can think of. Please remember you cannot play the same as you usually do if a cv is in your ranked game because that will just get you killed. So please respect the presence of cvs and adjust your play accordingly. Instead of moaning about having one in Your game :) 

 

If anyone can think of anything else they need to know ask bellow. 

 

Hope this helps. 

 

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Nice but as on the other thread.

 

Press Escape if you see any number other than 0 on the CV in queue for Ranked. Wait a few mins, go again. Repeat until you get a queue CV free.

 

Problem solved :Smile_child:

 

I'm not even being offensive, it's helped Rank me out on numerous occasions...

 

Until WG hide what's in the MM or tweak CVs then take it into your own hands and do the above.

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[ITA_C]
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Dd if you see torpedos plane coming at you do not smoke and stop your ship in smoke that will make you a dead dd

 

All others ,there are many factor that may influence an air fight some are out of the control of the player as example ui lagg , do not rage your cv if he lose one that doesn't help for the next one 

 

Hakuryu is not good for ranked compared to a midway but someone have only that t10 ship ( me ) so no he don't want to ruin your game he's just a poor bastard looking for steel

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Solid post. 

 

Really the #1 thing I'd say is the CV is not your personal air force. First you must help yourself -- consider your own AA and how much friendly AA support you'll likely need, and act accordingly.

 

Depending on CV matchup and plane loadouts, the CV might have limited map control and may need focus on guaranteeing his own strikes get through. As a luxury he'll then try to cover some friendly ships. Depending on situation this might not be your ship -- if this happens, be a grownup about it.

 

As a CV player there's also a prioritization factor. If I see friendly ship A doing something evidently stupid, such a sailing in glorious isolation in a BB with weak AA, while friendly ships B and C do something intelligent -- I'm likely to prioritize keeping ships B and C alive over ship A.

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Btw, cv should not sent his torp bombers at ships where a dd already dropped his torps against, it will force the ship to dodge and the torps dropped from dd will miss.

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The problem was and is AP bombs, they are not balanced, Wargaming was told they were not balanced, yet went ahead with them anyway and this is the result of that. They banned CV's in Clan Wars 7vs7 for a reason, but not in Ranked, where their influence is frankly even greater, why? 

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Just now, Arakus said:

Btw, cv should not sent his torp bombers at ships where a dd already dropped his torps against, it will force the ship to dodge and the torps dropped from dd will miss.

 

Depends. I've occasionally dropped a target to make him get hit by DD spreads. Funny stuff.

But generally speaking yeah, don't drop targets that are already "dead".

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2 hours ago, Mr_Snoww said:

If you are an AA ship vulnerable to AP bombs please avoid using def AA on torp bombers if you can help it as the cv will just kill you after def AA has gone down. These ships in ranked include: moskva, des moines, Henri, zao, and stalingrad

So for 6 of 9 tier X cruisers, however AA + defAA they would be, the only choice is: die from torps (either instantly, or flood + HE, or just citadel after you turn to avoid the first option) - or to die from AP bombs (either instantly, or soon, after being crippled by multiple "citadels"). What class counters CV, can anyone remind me pls?  :cap_hmm:

 

 

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Only Midway has AP bombs - and T8 TBs - you can shoot down most if not any of them without def AA with a lil AA specc on any CA.

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Problem isn't keeping the DFAA for AP DBs. By all means you shouldn't even have to if your own CV player is on the ball (and quite frankly if he isn't, your DFAA is probably not going to make much of a difference then unless the enemy CV player also just so happens to be a planless potato just flinging his squadrons around willy-nilly).

 

Problem is that with AP bombs on some ships like Moskva, Des Moines, Worcester, Henry IV. and Stalingrad you can get pretty damn good damage even through DFAA with just a bit of lucky drop RNG despite the panic effect. And if I could nuke a basically full HP Des Moines through his DFAA with Lexington's tier VIII AP DBs, then a Midway can do it just the same and better ...

 

To neutralize the damage threat from an AP bomb strike you literally have to shoot down every single of those DBs before they make it through, otherwise it's just rolling the dice and hope they fall in your favour.

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15 hours ago, Aotearas said:

Problem isn't keeping the DFAA for AP DBs. By all means you shouldn't even have to if your own CV player is on the ball (and quite frankly if he isn't, your DFAA is probably not going to make much of a difference then unless the enemy CV player also just so happens to be a planless potato just flinging his squadrons around willy-nilly).

 

Problem is that with AP bombs on some ships like Moskva, Des Moines, Worcester, Henry IV. and Stalingrad you can get pretty damn good damage even through DFAA with just a bit of lucky drop RNG despite the panic effect. And if I could nuke a basically full HP Des Moines through his DFAA with Lexington's tier VIII AP DBs, then a Midway can do it just the same and better ...

 

To neutralize the damage threat from an AP bomb strike you literally have to shoot down every single of those DBs before they make it through, otherwise it's just rolling the dice and hope they fall in your favour.

The cv cannot always protect those ship though. If he's for example re arming fighters or trying to push in a strike on something. Holding def AA for AP bombs is to mitigate the damage not completely stop it (unless you're a Worcester). 

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1 minute ago, Mr_Snoww said:

The cv cannot always protect those ship though. If he's for example re arming fighters or trying to push in a strike on something. Holding def AA for AP bombs is to mitigate the damage not completely stop it (unless you're a Worcester). 

Even a Worcester can get dropped for real hard damage through DFAA. Been on the receiving end of that (in randoms though) when an Essex apparently wanted me dead and send his entire strike force out to get me, the TBs died like flies, I got roughly half the DBs before they dropped and I still took ~25k from AP bomb citadels. Sure enough without DFAA I would've been gone for sure rather than just crippled, but there's little you can do in a Worcester once you got hit that hard and since AP bomb citadels are, well ... citadels, you can barely heal that damage back too.

 

 

AP bombs in general are simply hilariously broken. They either nuke ships or barely damage them at all (to the point that the raw alpha damage of the alternative HE bombs is higher, nevermind the fire DoT you can get as a plus from them). The fact that AP bombs can still outright nuke hightier cruisers even through DFAA with a lucky drop RNG roll is just icing on the cake.

 

Imho the entire idea should go back to the drawing board because the supposed intent (make them an effective weapon against BBs) has spectacularily backfired (by making them even better against hightier cruisers, plus more or less not delivering on the damage in regards to hightier BBs).

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Maybe AP bombs are WG's first steps in the rework (I read it as Dumbing Down) of CVs?

 

I fully expect something to be balanced by RNG and greatly lower any scope for skillful play. Like a bad dispersion BB where everyone does OK in it but can't push beyond that.

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20 hours ago, Negativvv said:

Nice but as on the other thread.

 

Press Escape if you see any number other than 0 on the CV in queue for Ranked. Wait a few mins, go again. Repeat until you get a queue CV free.

 

Problem solved :Smile_child:

 

I'm not even being offensive, it's helped Rank me out on numerous occasions...

 

Until WG hide what's in the MM or tweak CVs then take it into your own hands and do the above.

I do the same, see CV in the queue and I bail, I simply don't want to take part in the lottery of good vs spud CV players, they make enough of a mess of random games.

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4 minutes ago, BeauNidl3 said:

I do the same, see CV in the queue and I bail, I simply don't want to take part in the lottery of good vs spud CV players, they make enough of a mess of random games.

Yeah I've been there too many times in Ranked.

 

We can talk all day about how to deal with Ranked CVs but it all goes out the window when in your CV Ranked game you watch your CV do something really stupid like trying to snipe the opposite CV straight away or lose every fighter squadron in one fail control group strafe... :Smile_facepalm:

 

Press Escape in queue when you see CVs and enjoy your superior experience in Ranked  :Smile_child:

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2 hours ago, Aotearas said:

Even a Worcester can get dropped for real hard damage through DFAA. Been on the receiving end of that (in randoms though) when an Essex apparently wanted me dead and send his entire strike force out to get me, the TBs died like flies, I got roughly half the DBs before they dropped and I still took ~25k from AP bomb citadels. Sure enough without DFAA I would've been gone for sure rather than just crippled, but there's little you can do in a Worcester once you got hit that hard and since AP bomb citadels are, well ... citadels, you can barely heal that damage back too.

 

 

AP bombs in general are simply hilariously broken. They either nuke ships or barely damage them at all (to the point that the raw alpha damage of the alternative HE bombs is higher, nevermind the fire DoT you can get as a plus from them). The fact that AP bombs can still outright nuke hightier cruisers even through DFAA with a lucky drop RNG roll is just icing on the cake.

 

Imho the entire idea should go back to the drawing board because the supposed intent (make them an effective weapon against BBs) has spectacularily backfired (by making them even better against hightier cruisers, plus more or less not delivering on the damage in regards to hightier BBs).

If a cv wants a ship dead usually it will be dead unless its fully AA specced and plays smart (I have never been deleted in my des moines, Worcester, Salem or Henri by AP bombs). Buy tell me why shouldnt cvs have a counter to AA ships? All they have to do is press a button and bang that's half if not all your planes gone. U agree that AP bombs are imbalanced but not unjustified. 

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1 minute ago, Mr_Snoww said:

Buy tell me why shouldnt cvs have a counter to AA ships?

 

The same reason why DDs shouldn't be AA ships without massive investment and losses in most other areas. It breaks the balancing scheme the game is built upon.

Besides, cruisers are already being shafted hard, they don't need to get shafted even more by stuff they're supposed to counter.

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3 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

The same reason why DDs shouldn't be AA ships without massive investment and losses in most other areas. It breaks the balancing scheme the game is built upon.

Besides, cruisers are already being shafted hard, they don't need to get shafted even more by stuff they're supposed to counter.

If they didn't start to go crazy with AA ships then I may agree with you. But the fact is cvs need ways to counter AA ships if they make mistakes. Same way as aa ships counter cvs that make mistakes. It works both ways. 

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1 minute ago, Mr_Snoww said:

It works both ways.

 

It already does. A normal strike is more than capable of severely damaging or outright killing an AA ship in case of misplay. AP bombs on the other hand can punish AA ships even when said AA ship has done nothing wrong.

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9 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

It already does. A normal strike is more than capable of severely damaging or outright killing an AA ship in case of misplay. AP bombs on the other hand can punish AA ships even when said AA ship has done nothing wrong.

In the same way if a cv fly within a Worcesters aa whilst scouting with fighters and it clips a plane instantly (which is possible without even seeing the Worcester first) then that squad has a massive disadvantage and usually has to either rearm or play defensively that side leaving the enemy time to get a strike in. Now it not making a mistake flying into Worcester aa because it air detection is less than its aa range but it still punishes you which has a massive knock of effect. Does that sound balanced? Any way you spin it there are a lot of things in game equivilafn to the unfairness of AP bombs but go unnoticed because they don't have the instant impact AP bombs do. 

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31 minutes ago, Mr_Snoww said:

Does that sound balanced?

 

Have I ever claimed it to be?

But just because one mechanic is broken doesn't mean we should tolerate another as well.

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I've bumped into CV's 4 times so far this season:-

 

1) 2 x Shima - sunk both times (wandered too far away from supporting ships and paid the price, friendly CV cannot be everywhere)

2) 2 x Mino - 61 places shot in one match (won), friendly CV trampled the red one in the other so all safe.

 

Not seen a single Hakuryu - all Midways to date (for the AP bombs).

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