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Aotearas

Fighter stun when strafing out of a dogfight?

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So, I just had a most interesting case with my Essex where I was going to strafe out of a dogfight to strafe his fighters with my second fighter squadron. So far so normal.

 

Except that when I strafed out of the dogfight, as opposed to leaving the enemy fighters stunned for a second, they immediately follow my fighters, escape the strafing window and relock the fighters in a dogfight. And I mean immediately, because the moment my fighters strafed out, his followed.

 

 

How?

 

It was my understanding that strafing out of a dogfight stuns the enemy fighter squadron. Been doing that ever since it got introduced, why didn't it work here? How could his fighters instantly fllow mine without getting stunned? He can't have preemptively strafed out himself, because then MY fighters would've been stunned and they clearly weren't. Is there some a countermeasure to the fighter stun I've never heard of before (not a CV main), or is this just another CV bug that happened to bite me in the arse?

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1 hour ago, Aotearas said:
Spoiler

 

So, I just had a most interesting case with my Essex where I was going to strafe out of a dogfight to strafe his fighters with my second fighter squadron. So far so normal.

 

Except that when I strafed out of the dogfight, as opposed to leaving the enemy fighters stunned for a second, they immediately follow my fighters, escape the strafing window and relock the fighters in a dogfight. And I mean immediately, because the moment my fighters strafed out, his followed.

 

 

How?

 

It was my understanding that strafing out of a dogfight stuns the enemy fighter squadron. Been doing that ever since it got introduced, why didn't it work here? How could his fighters instantly fllow mine without getting stunned? He can't have preemptively strafed out himself, because then MY fighters would've been stunned and they clearly weren't. Is there some a countermeasure to the fighter stun I've never heard of before (not a CV main), or is this just another CV bug that happened to bite me in the arse?

 

 

WCxshPc.png

 

Afaik it has to be a simple movement command to remove the stun, other commands won't do it.

Also, of curse, you have to be paying attention right there, and have to act quick for it to work

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12 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

WCxshPc.png

 

Afaik it has to be a simple movement command to remove the stun, other commands won't do it.

Also, of curse, you have to be paying attention right there, and have to act quick for it to work

How small is the opportunity window to remove the stun, because when I give movement commands to stunned fighters (more out of RTS habit than actually trying to move since I never saw it work), it doesn't work, they just keep being stunned.

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3 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

How small is the opportunity window to remove the stun, because when I give movement commands to stunned fighters (more out of RTS habit than actually trying to move since I never saw it work), it doesn't work, they just keep being stunned.

I think stun is as long as the strafe out is, but I'm not sure on that. With that the ability to remove it should be exactly as long.

You want to be quick just because if the enemy squad opens the distance you won't be able to strafe them while they are locked in a straight line flight

 

I haven't done much testing on this as I've pretty much given up on CVs (screw that UI), just know that it's a thing :Smile_teethhappy:

 

I do still have my CVs up to Shokek, so if you want we can jump into a Training room and play around with it

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54 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

How small is the opportunity window to remove the stun

 

There is no window, it's instant.

The problem is that if you go for a direction your fighters aren't facing they're gonna take a while to turn. Check the arrow below your fighters to see which direction they are facing.

Also APM spam is not recommended as it slows down your fighters with tiny turns every time.

 

Been using it ever since they introduced strafing out. Works 100% of the time, every time.

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On 03/08/2018 at 4:03 PM, El2aZeR said:

The problem is that if you go for a direction your fighters aren't facing they're gonna take a while to turn.

Thank you for the tip, that consideration never even occured to me.

Does that allow you to counter-strafe faster (assuming they have to turn in the first place), considering your planes still have to whirl around to start strafing ?

And if so, do you get the kind of swerving strafe instead of the straight-line one sometimes or do they predictably take the normal trajectory ?

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32 minutes ago, rnat said:

Does that allow you to counter-strafe faster

 

Yes, although there is a trick to that as well.

If you pick the distance of your strafe just right so that your fighters lock in immediately they won't need to turn and will start strafing instantly. That requires quite a bit of experience however and if you fail, you will lose your window of opportunity as your fighters will circle around like idiots to get into position. It's much safer to make a move command first then start strafing.

Still, if you can pull it off it's a much more effective method as it has literally no counterplay.

 

Personally I've never believed in "swerving strafes". The problem with planes in general is that the icon does not really represent the actual position of planes as it is (in my experience) averaged from the models and not taken from the actual position of fighters which in reality is just a dot on the map. This can give the illusion that fighters are flying all over the place when in reality they're following a straight path. If you see a "swerving strafe", you'll realize that after a few seconds the path of the fighter will eventually stabilize in one direction. That's the actual strafe path that was taken, the icon just misrepresented the position of the fighters.

 

This can happen with bombers too but it's much more rare.

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Please excuse me if I misread you, but does that imply that, if you get the distance just right, there is no move-command needed to "unfreeze" the fighters before the strafe, or is the order just about getting your planes to turn after that initial movement-command ?

 

Regarding your second point, I'm pretty sure i've seen my fighters fly in an actual S-shape (not the icon) while zoomed in on a strafe, while actually covering a comparatively small distance along the strafe-axis. It was rather noticable with the tracers going all over the place. Though, since I don't have those replays anymore i can't provide any proof and might just be misremembering things.

 

[edited]: missing word

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48 minutes ago, rnat said:

Please excuse me if I misread you, but does that imply that, if you get the distance just right, there is no move-command needed to "unfreeze" the fighters before the strafe, or is the order just about getting your planes to turn after that initial movement-command ?

You do need the movement command, it's that one that removes the stun. 1 movement command and after that you can do whatever you like

 

49 minutes ago, rnat said:

Regarding your second point, I'm pretty i've seen my fighters fly in an actual S-shape (not the icon) while zoomed in on a strafe, while actually covering a comparatively small distance along the strafe-axis. It was pretty noticable with the tracers going all over the place. Though, since I don't have those replays anymore i can't provide any proof and might just be misremembering things.

If I remember this correctly they "fixed" it so that no matter what the plane animations show the strafe is going only along its path & within its borders. As far as I understood it you used to be able to make all kinds of weird semi-circle strafes if the past, now it's just a visual thing

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50 minutes ago, rnat said:

Please excuse me if I misread you, but does that imply that, if you get the distance just right, there is no move-command needed to "unfreeze" the fighters before the strafe, or is the order just about getting your planes to turn after that initial movement-command ?

 

You do need the move command. Picking the distance right just removes the need for your fighters to turn.

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Just now, El2aZeR said:

 

You do need the move command. Picking the distance right just removes the need for your fighters to turn.

Thanks for the clarification :)

Yes, I noticed that, if the strafe starts upon placing the order the planes seem to snap into direction rather willingly.

Was kind of hoping that setting the initial move order to unfreeze into the correct direction would speed it up even more.

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This is the shite that makes good CVs insane. the small things only few know about/or master

 

 

mang

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