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Flavio1997

some thought on the game

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some thought on how I would rework the mechanics of the game, I’m a player that back in the days was very active, right now with university, I can’t play as often as I did before.

 

i would remark that theese are very personal opinions

Wall of text incoming, getting into the suggestion:

 

1)      changing the bloom “flat tax”:

right now, after you fire, with any ship in the game, be it a 100mm gun’s dd or a 460mm gun Yamato, your concealment bloom to you max firing range, now I agree with this change, as stealth  fire was a cancerous thing, but imho the fact that it blooms for 20 seconds is detrimental to some classes ( fast firing cl and dds) while is a great advantage to bbs, that can go invisible between each shot, meanwhile if a cruiser want to do so, it has to massively reduce is dpm, but it’s  super detrimental for dds, especially at the start of the game, when they go cap contesting and do those knife fights with other dds, because even after you have killed the enemy dd, you stay spotted for another 20 seconds unless you smoke up, and in those 20 seconds you usually get nuked/ lose a lot of hp, or when you have to finish a low hp enemy, you still get spotted for 20 seconds, and that’s a very big price to pay. Also, the fact that guns so different have the same bloom time is rather counterintuitive, unrealistic and bad for the gameplay, especially for the most volatile ship of the game.

I would change that to a sistem like: after you fire, you have  4secs of “ bloom flat tax” +1sec/ inch of the gun fired, so a 127 secs dd will have a  9 secs bloom penality, a ligh cruiser 10 secs, a CA 12 secs and a bb 18-20 seconds, the only one who would have a slight penality would be the yamatyo at 22 secs and the republique at 21 ( meanwhile all the 16 inch have 20 secs, so for the vast majority of bbs it would be the same/improvement).

 

2)      smoke visibility after fire, even here, I like the fact that after you fire in smoke your detection range increase because it was silly to have a bbs sitting 3 km from you and hammering you without getting detected, however, I think that WG overdid it, especially on bbs. Because with the  current 14-16 km-detection-after-fire-in-smoke,  smoking an allied bbs is useless ( or at least in only a defensive measure) because every time he fires it will almost always get spotted, while if I smoke up a bbs, it’s should be considered good teamplay  and should get rewarded and encouraged ( maybe giving to the smoker some exp on the damage that the smoked up to do in the meanwhile). Imho the bb detection range in smoke should be reduced to 10 km ( to prevent that silly situation of beta’s days, as described before).

 

3)      spotting damage: right now this matter is handled in a VERY crappy way from WG, because when a dds spot someone, the one spotted will open up fire ( you have nothing to lose after all)

, so his detection range will bloom and the everyone “spot” that target, and the dds don’t receive any exp from it, or at least very little. Imho this should change, the closest ship to the target  ( with a line of sight obviously) should be the one who gets the spotting damage. The same is for when an enemy is spotted with radar/hydro/planes of sorts (catapulted, cv, spotter), the ship radaring him should get the spotting damage. There should be also medals and achievements for spotting ships/spotting damage

 

4)      reward cap contesting, if I with a dd contest the enemy dd capping ( even if no one spot each other), I should get a reward/ribbon of some sorts, like a cap contested for every 20 seconds in which the enemy dd can’t cap the area. And like a medal for contesting cap for 2 mins or so

 

5)      raising the bbs citadel, that’s one of the changes that I notice the most in my 15 months pause, right now hitting another bb’citadel  is very hard, even when the enemy is doing a “closing in manoeuvre” in which he shows the under the water part of the ship  ( that back in alpha/beta was a “send me to the port immediately”). Wg please stop dumbing down this game, let the ones who do mistakes get nuked

 

6)      on the same train of the last sentence above: make it in a way that cruiser who get overmatched from the nose/bow don’t get full citadel damage (maybe only penetration/ half citadel damage). Is not fun when you are doing you 150k damage in your Mogami, you have still 32khp and get deleted by a Grober Kufurst  14 kms away who get lucky and do to you a 3 citadel hit when you where presenting him only your stern ( and I mean only your stern, perfectly steaming away from him). This don’t ancourage aggressive and intelligent play, and reward camping behind an island

 

right now this is what I thought I would change of this game, what do you agree/disagree on?

 

I will probably get back when something else crosses my mind

Flavio

 

 

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Most of the proposals you've made are pretty sensible, although a bit of tweaking here and there would be needed. The one I'm less sure about is the 4th one. Sure, I would like some kind of contesting award and reward, but that wouldn't work too well in epicentre mode because even the ship with the worst concealment could gain one by simply sitting behind an island at the outer ring. There should be some kind of trigger like getting a cap defense before the timer for such achievement starts running. Another option could be limiting it to the inner circle only, or at least different contest times for each ring (the further from middle, the longer it takes to receive it).

 

Salute.

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I like your proposals, They are pretty well thought out, however I would agree with Estaca_de_Bares on Epicentre. 

Your correct over the contesting caps, a Ship can be in the cap area tanking, taking and dealing damage and there is no reward for this except damage and potential damage, while the opponent is racking up defended ribbons.

 

As an example:

A ship is inside an enemy  cap for 1-2 minutes being fired at, the cap is constantly getting reset by the enemy, however the ship contesting is actively stopping the enemy from gaining points. The ship dies after 1-2 minutes of fighting gets no rewards even if the his team goes on to win the capture point.Also if he is the first in the cap then the cap timer gets reset even though there maybe others inside.

 

Maybe the could be a mechanism where if a ship is contesting a cap while inside or within 100 metres of the cap zone they receive some sort of rewards/achievements

 

Player especially new player need to know that they are doing the right thing as far as game-play is concerned, WG in this update have implemented a good system to let players know they are doing the wrong thing. Please WG work on the good things players do.

 

 

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54 minutes ago, Estaca_de_Bares said:

Most of the proposals you've made are pretty sensible, although a bit of tweaking here and there would be needed. The one I'm less sure about is the 4th one. Sure, I would like some kind of contesting award and reward, but that wouldn't work too well in epicentre mode because even the ship with the worst concealment could gain one by simply sitting behind an island at the outer ring. There should be some kind of trigger like getting a cap defense before the timer for such achievement starts running. Another option could be limiting it to the inner circle only, or at least different contest times for each ring (the further from middle, the longer it takes to receive it).

 

Salute.

i have to admit that i encounter the epicenter mode so rarely that i forgot completely about it, but we could also made in a way that the contesting rewards kick in only in the other type of match only or  that the reward time for epicentre are way longer ( like 2 or 3x)

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@Flavio1997  Very sensible on all counts, epicentre being a special mode with existing special mechanics could have a customised approach to the contesting scoring.

 

Personally I'd make the gun blooms in your point 1 achieve the stated aim of WG that they don't want ships blinking in and out with gunblooms so the blooms should be equal to the reload timer (before modifications) for consistency and ease of understanding.

 

Point 2, I disagree a bit as BB's have too much survivability as it is, but cutting the bloom a bit would be OK.  On the same subject the detection from smoke firing in the Neptune is pretty silly it needs to be cut by at least 1.5km. It's tricky in Kutuzov, but that ship has longer range so it's less of an issue.

 

Point 6, this is a wider issue with cruiser design and BB's survival tools being buffed while cruisers haven't been. The simplest blanket fix would be to reduce citadel damage on cruisers across the board by a fixed percentage, the most thorough would need a lot of work and that would be to redesign the citadel sizes and heights of every cruiser in the game.

 

I'd add a point 7, the sheer number of BB's in every game throttle gameplay and discourage cruiser dynamic play which means DD's aren't opposed, I'd like to see a hard cap of 3, max 4 BB per side.

 

I agree with the broad thrust of every point, well thought out post as a good starting point for improving the game, a few tweaks here and there, but that's how all good ideas work.

 

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53 minutes ago, BeauNidl3 said:

@Flavio1997  Very sensible on all counts, epicentre being a special mode with existing special mechanics could have a customised approach to the contesting scoring.

 

 

I'd add a point 7, the sheer number of BB's in every game throttle gameplay and discourage cruiser dynamic play which means DD's aren't opposed, I'd like to see a hard cap of 3, max 4 BB per side.

 

2

i would love to see that point 7, in the recent days i had various games with only 1-2 bbs for team, and it was wonderful  as a cruiser and as a bb player to have those matches,  with a bb i could choose my target , tank damage and nuke everyone, and with the cruiser i could do some aggressive dd support, while cittadelling to death cruisers

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Great points. I disagree a bit with 6, I don't think there are issues with cruiser survivability. Maybe better agility would help more.

 

Only thing I would add is that I think they need to reduce the effectiveness of bow tanking. It makes the game too static. They need to encourage movement and not stalemate.

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4 hours ago, Flavio1997 said:

 

1)      changing the bloom “flat tax”:

 

...after you fire, you have  4secs of “ bloom flat tax” +1sec/ inch of the gun fired...

 

This might be a fairly significant buff to some DDs.

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Just now, Culiacan_Mexico said:

This might be a fairly significant buff to some DDs.

This. The base value should be around 10 seconds at least. Otherwise gun boat dds will abuse the hell out of it. Just look up the gearing leader board and look at the averages those guys who left the game had. Thats what invisi firing did. And we would get too close to a return to this should the balance be slightly off.

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4 minutes ago, dCK_Ad_Hominem said:

This. The base value should be around 10 seconds at least. Otherwise gun boat dds will abuse the hell out of it. Just look up the gearing leader board and look at the averages those guys who left the game had. Thats what invisi firing did. And we would get too close to a return to this should the balance be slightly off.

 

There's plenty of scope to tweak it so invisi firing doesn't return, but the smaller gun ships having the same duration bloom as Yamato with its monstrous artillery is rather daft and it currently greatly favours BB's over everything else.

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47 minutes ago, dCK_Ad_Hominem said:

This. The base value should be around 10 seconds at least. Otherwise gun boat dds will abuse the hell out of it. Just look up the gearing leader board and look at the averages those guys who left the game had. Thats what invisi firing did. And we would get too close to a return to this should the balance be slightly off.

Anything less than 10 seconds would severely handicap BBs and some cruisers, because of their turret rotation, in targeting DDs.  Caution would be advised.

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15 minutes ago, Culiacan_Mexico said:

Anything less than 10 seconds would severely handicap BBs and some cruisers, because of their turret rotation, in targeting DDs.  Caution would be advised.

yeah it would make DDs overpowered. Their strength is already their concealment so increasing their strength even more would greatly impact gameplay.

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20 minutes ago, GarrusBrutus said:

yeah it would make DDs overpowered. Their strength is already their concealment so increasing their strength even more would greatly impact gameplay.

That's why I raised my voice in concern. And you know I love my dds.

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22 hours ago, GarrusBrutus said:

yeah it would make DDs overpowered. Their strength is already their concealment so increasing their strength even more would greatly impact gameplay.

guys you get that 10 seconds is still a very long time? and that if a gunboat want to fire it has to get detected?

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39 minutes ago, Flavio1997 said:

guys you get that 10 seconds is still a very long time? and that if a gunboat want to fire it has to get detected?

I think I understand.

 

Having DDs gun-boating at near max firing range with the ability to go stealth after a 10 second delay... sounds like a significant buff.  

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1 hour ago, Flavio1997 said:

guys you get that 10 seconds is still a very long time? and that if a gunboat want to fire it has to get detected?

Yeah I know but how easy would that be? Im sailing the Fletcher and each time a BB tries to aim at me I hold my fire and he cant shoot me because the gun traverse takes already 10 sec.

The penalty of 20 seconds for all ships is deliberate in a way that this doesnt happen. Because it would get extremely frustrating for CA's and BB's.

So on this point I disagree. Your other points are..... on point.  :Smile_hiding:

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