Scenarios to hard for random teams

[NothingButTheRain]

11 hours ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

Halloween was hard, but the hardest OP so far to 5-star has to be the "old" Defence of Newport Station with Scharnhorsts and Gneisenaus in the final wave 

 

Also even when they kick back and relax, players of forumite skill levels will easily top the chart (by a significant margin) in operations, so it is not egoistic of them to do so. Thanks to them letting off steam in operations, some of the poor potato BB backline snipers will have their moment of glory from a rare 5-star victory

The thing is that good gameplay can also inspire. I've actually learned most of this in the beginning by watching flamu and listening to how he thinks and how he considers things. I often literally had no idea what to do and it isn't always as obvious. But the somewhat smarter ones will find google and will read up a bit.

 

And the whole "backline sniper BB babies hype" is actually the second most annoying thing in WoWS now to me (and I mean all these victim role players who actually are suggesting for real that like half of what every BB does is snipe from A1, which very obviously is not tru at all). The worst is (elitist) toxicity, 3rd worst is AFK players.

 

I think that Defend is just right right now.

12 hours ago, Butterdoll said:

 

@IanH755 with cautious with this one, not every player have premium time, and signals, and dragon thingys mounted in his ships.

to those players will not be much meat in the bone after all.

Maybe cutting by half the earnings of those  special flags and bonus multipliers only within the ops environment?

 

You know that these elite players often have win rates of 66% or more? They can get just as much xp, ecxp and fxp in randoms by divving up with other purple unicums (think Saipan + Belfast + Flint or something) as they can by playing operations all the time. Nerfing these flags (to which I am opposed to) will nerf the 'middle class' 50%-52% winrate players more then it will hurt these purple ones. And besides, I actually collect many of my dragon flags from PTS, which is like doing a whole mission set for a couple days maybe, just so I can have a set of 5 each so it's not like P2W for me. I put effort into getting those.

[GulvkluderGuld]

5 hours ago, NothingButTheRain said:

The thing is that good gameplay can also inspire. I've actually learned most of this in the beginning by watching flamu and listening to how he thinks and how he considers things. I often literally had no idea what to do and it isn't always as obvious. But the somewhat smarter ones will find google and will read up a bit.

 

And the whole "backline sniper BB babies hype" is actually the second most annoying thing in WoWS now to me (and I mean all these victim role players who actually are suggesting for real that like half of what every BB does is snipe from A1, which very obviously is not tru at all). The worst is (elitist) toxicity, 3rd worst is AFK players.

 

I think that Defend is just right right now.

 

Not sure if you say the guys blowing off steam will inspire the rest of the team or saying that blowing off steam is bad here.

Often these players will lead by example because they are almost incapable of positioning badly and move with purpose.

 

As to sniping BBs, did you see the conqueror in the latest Jingles video?

When I use the term, it is for describing a distinct minority of BBs players who manage a solid last in the standings despite surviving the entire match with full hp and no heals used.

I had quite a few of those in Ranked lately, and they the most infuriating thing. Mind that the next bit applies exclusively to competitive modes, not random PvP.

It is similarly to being actively AFK (unsportsmanlike conduct) although those players are probably just monumentally incompetent and fully aware of they will get handed their head in any brawl.

AFKs: at least the red team would spend time and ammunition sinking them.

 

[Butterdoll]

13 hours ago, NothingButTheRain said:

You know that these elite players often have win rates of 66% or more? They can get just as much xp, ecxp and fxp in randoms by divving up with other purple unicums (think Saipan + Belfast + Flint or something) as they can by playing operations all the time. Nerfing these flags (to which I am opposed to) will nerf the 'middle class' 50%-52% winrate players more then it will hurt these purple ones. And besides, I actually collect many of my dragon flags from PTS, which is like doing a whole mission set for a couple days maybe, just so I can have a set of 5 each so it's not like P2W for me. I put effort into getting those

well, maybe.

 But as it was established in other topics I think weren't 50ish% players that brought their ships  full of "gold" from Narai to a point that WG retrieved it from rotation.

But there's must be another reason behind it, because certainly other ops are still being milked to the last drop by some and they (ops) are still in rotation.

There are "middle class" players that uses special flags and there are middle "classes players" that don't use those things.

Nerfing the rewards or nerfing the flags.

Nerfing the rewards, all players that uses flags will be fine and dandy, those who don't will be seeing another co-op mode

Nerfing the flags, all players that uses flags will still get by with good results , and those who don't will still see a ok reward.

But you are right when you say  the purple ones will never be affected.

Do you have more options than nerf rewards?

 

   

 

 

[EgyptOverseer]

I was surprised to see the Izumo on the Defense of Newport. Couldn't remember seeing T9 BBs in that T6 scenario.

 

I was still able to confirm that BBs are now the best option. Quite interesting how I can sail 7Km from 5 enemy ships (2 DDs, 2 CAs and 1 BB) and still see them shooting the friendly cruisers far behind me. Was still one shoted by the Izumo though, once all friendlies were out of range for him. LOL

[Estaca_de_Bares]

3 minutes ago, EgyptOverseer said:

I was surprised to see the Izumo on the Defense of Newport. Couldn't remember seeing T9 BBs in that T6 scenario.

An Izumo spawns in the final wave if the defenses haven't been breached, it's been like that since the first iteration. When the bots manage to enter the perimeter, it was (or is, still has't happened to me in the different recent tries I've done) a Hiryu instead. One change between before and now has been reducing the tier of the CV's pursuers: at first it was Myoko and Hipper, now it's Aoba and Nürnberg. Also the IJN CAs and Yubari carry AA consumable while the KM ones probably equip hydro.

 

Salute.

[MoveZig]

This was still not 5 stars, and people were all trying. The third wave requires near-perfection, it's clearly too much even for a competent PUG most of the time.

 

 

 

 

[EgyptOverseer]

3 hours ago, Estaca_de_Bares said:

An Izumo spawns in the final wave if the defenses haven't been breached, it's been like that since the first iteration. When the bots manage to enter the perimeter, it was (or is, still has't happened to me in the different recent tries I've done) a Hiryu instead. One change between before and now has been reducing the tier of the CV's pursuers: at first it was Myoko and Hipper, now it's Aoba and Nürnberg. Also the IJN CAs and Yubari carry AA consumable while the KM ones probably equip hydro.

 

Salute.

Cheers for that. Guess it was the first time my team managed to prevent them from entering the perimeter. 

[MoveZig]

1 hour ago, EgyptOverseer said:

Cheers for that. Guess it was the first time my team managed to prevent them from entering the perimeter. 

 

Actually, I'm pretty sure it's tied to killing the first 3 waves within the time limit.  Even if you prevent a breakthrough, the Lex and Izumo will not spawn unless you kill all the bots in time. Instead you get the enemy Hiryu, and at that point you can forget about 5 stars.

[Estaca_de_Bares]

20 hours ago, MoveZig said:

Actually, I'm pretty sure it's tied to killing the first 3 waves within the time limit.  Even if you prevent a breakthrough, the Lex and Izumo will not spawn unless you kill all the bots in time. Instead you get the enemy Hiryu, and at that point you can forget about 5 stars.

No it isn't, or at least the spawning Zuiho isn't counted as an objective for that: I've sunk it a couple of times with only 2 to 3 minutes until the end after he sneaked away and the final wave, still with Izumo, arrived. I agree about being nearly impossible due to the breakthrough to obtain 5 stars if the Hiryu spawns, but that also means that the team has messed up big already.

 

Salute.

 

Edits in italics.

[havaduck]

15 hours ago, EgyptOverseer said:

I was surprised to see the Izumo on the Defense of Newport. Couldn't remember seeing T9 BBs in that T6 scenario.

 

 

The Izumo is and never was the issue. The problem was that previously you could get double Scharnhorst (if you were really unlucky) -> Yeah fast firing BB shitting on ships and installations with a set torps on each side on top.  The speed difference alone meant that these fast deadly ships would  threaten the base much earlier.

 

 

I remember more than one battle looking kinda ok until it turned into this:

 

 

"Now we forge a new divsion,

to earn those sweet, sweet 5 stars.

And in the division,

find the salvation from field produce."

[lup3s]

48 minutes ago, havaduck said:

The Izumo is and never was the issue.

 

*Ryujo says hi to Izumo*

 

*Izumo sinks in shame*

[Estaca_de_Bares]

10 hours ago, lup3s said:

*Ryujo says hi to Izumo*

 

*Izumo sinks in shame*

Exactly: fires set, damage control and then 5 or 6 well placed torpedoes with flooding. Izumo is gone.

 

Salute.

 

P.S. and OT: holy smokes @havaduck! Interplay also had a game like that? Man, I enjoyed a lot "Castles" and "Conquest of the New World", that developer/distributor had really good ones.

[MoveZig]

On 15/05/2018 at 3:27 PM, Estaca_de_Bares said:

No it isn't, or at least the spawning Zuiho isn't counted as an objective for that: I've sunk it a couple of times with only 2 to 3 minutes until the end after he sneaked away and the final wave, still with Izumo, arrived. I agree about being nearly impossible due to the breakthrough to obtain 5 stars if the Hiryu spawns, but that also means that the team has messed up big already.

 

Salute.

 

Edits in italics.

 

I'm 95% sure now. In this battle a enemy DD got disabled but stuck in smoke, we didn't kill it in time but did prevent enemies from breaking through. We still got the Hiryu, and no Lex or Izumo in sight. Also, it was literally impossible to get 5 stars after that, we did all the other objectives. But maybe Zuiho doesn't count, for whatever reason.

[Estaca_de_Bares]

2 hours ago, MoveZig said:

I'm 95% sure now. In this battle a enemy DD got disabled but stuck in smoke, we didn't kill it in time but did prevent enemies from breaking through. We still got the Hiryu, and no Lex or Izumo in sight. Also, it was literally impossible to get 5 stars after that, we did all the other objectives. But maybe Zuiho doesn't count, for whatever reason.

Then considering the gathered evidence, it seems that "Destroy all enemy ships before the main attack starts" should be read as "all enemy ships equipped with main batteries". Still a curious detail though. Maybe I should try letting that Zuiho flee and live just to see what happens.

 

Salute.

[ThinderChief]

On 15/05/2018 at 5:00 AM, MoveZig said:

This was still not 5 stars, and people were all trying. The third wave requires near-perfection, it's clearly too much even for a competent PUG most of the time.

 

 

 

 

 

The problem is that most teams seems to be caught off, often failing to re position in time for intercept, in particular the sneaky DD at the extreme side of the 3rd wave formation. To succeed you need not only people who re position fast but also not be afraid to offer immediate fire support where it is really needed, not necessarily on demand because a guy get into a panic situation but on the ship closest to breaking the defence line. 

 

One thing i do most of the time is to smoke at least two batteries, firing from the spot, so the whole team have extra guns and support fire, if i can save two of them it makes a difference at the end of the game. DD players should do that more often instead of planting their smoke in the middle of the pound where it shield only themselves, same for RN Cruisers.

 

Since i train my Commanders playing those missions, i play Ernst Gaede,  Gnevny, and Fushun. I got my best results with the Fushun but the drawback is its inability to torp other DDs. Ernst Gaede is really efficient too but with only 3 smoke canister i have to play it differently, i can't smoke the batteries the same way and have to use the terrain instead.

 

Depending on the team, we managed 5 stars about once out of 6 games or less often, with a loss rate of about 2 out of 10 or so. 

 

Oh yeah i nearly forgot, this fire thing is a complete bag of bulls, too many fires, one hit one fire, one hit one fire, it's tiresome.

 

 

[ThinderChief]

Aegis is a lot easier.

 

With what i regard as the most efficient ship for Operation of the week missions, the Cleveland, i managed 7 kills, 153,542 damage without taking any damage myself, but we got only 4 stars.

 

First 5 stars of the day with the Gnevny, less fires but only one less citadel.