[SCRUB] aboomination Players 5,763 posts 16,940 battles Report post #26 Posted May 3, 2018 Just now, EdiJo said: Yes, you evidently still can hit a battleship, at least enough to start a fire. But sometimes you need to aim at smaller targets, ya know... Bogatyr is the ship you're looking for! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdiJo Players 1,419 posts 11,712 battles Report post #27 Posted May 3, 2018 1 minute ago, aboomination said: Bogatyr is the ship you're looking for! I found it long time ago, switched from the good old Loui after AFT nerf... Although after the range upgrade Loui is quite good too. Still, I like BB - what can I do Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[NAN0] HaachamaShipping Players 8,474 posts 10,052 battles Report post #28 Posted May 3, 2018 Well, at least it still has 5 turrets and isn't some Myogi (not that Myogi is all that terrible though). as others already said, low tier, most BBs have garbage accuracy. Also, regarding HE spamming T4s... Ishizuchi does that quite well too. Can't say it is terribly accurate, alpha is worse than Orion, but it has decent reload and is fast enough to not be easily rushed by DDs. And the AP shells are utter garbage against anything that is not a cruiser. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SAR18] Uriens_The_Gray [SAR18] Players 45 posts Report post #29 Posted May 3, 2018 At least you can shot in the intended direction ... When you one-shot your allies BEHIND you, accuracy went a bit off ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdiJo Players 1,419 posts 11,712 battles Report post #30 Posted May 3, 2018 1 hour ago, Riselotte said: Well, at least it still has 5 turrets and isn't some Myogi (not that Myogi is all that terrible though). as others already said, low tier, most BBs have garbage accuracy. Myogi is like Izumo - WG put a carrot (Kongo) and a stick (3 turrets with crippled accuracy). Upgraded Myo even looks like a Kongo... Another example of pushing into faster grind. Bad bad bad bad bad idea, WG. Quote Also, regarding HE spamming T4s... Ishizuchi does that quite well too. Can't say it is terribly accurate, alpha is worse than Orion, but it has decent reload and is fast enough to not be easily rushed by DDs. And the AP shells are utter garbage against anything that is not a cruiser. Yes, I have & like Ischi. I even just played 3 games today. The biggest problem is total lack of AA, and ALMOST EVERY Ischi game has AT LEAST one carrier. And skill of those carriers varies wildly, so in 50% cases enemy CV totally owns the sky. Ischi is long and doesn't turn very well. Orion at least can remind the CV that not all planes have to return, so most of CV players think twice afterwards. The other thing: Ischi AP is not effective even vs broadside BB and armor can't stop same tier real BB shell even when reasonably angled. Unlike the Orion's. Simply: Ischi is not a battleship. But Ischi can still shoot DD - and the Policy says she will always can Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[AAO] Paimentaja Players 396 posts 24,486 battles Report post #31 Posted May 3, 2018 16 hours ago, EdiJo said: Oh, no. When KM BB's came out I spent lots of time in my St. Louis - because I am dedicated seal clubber so I could not miss such a harvest! I played them without premium and quite rarely. I don't usually do "dedicated grinding" - I start multiple lines, leave them in peace and sometimes come back... Also that's why when I finally reach something supposedly fun to play, it is already nerfed to the ground Oh, I take Gneis for a ride now and then - quite frequently in scenarios (speed! torps! AA) and I don't feel the guns are trolly. Just that she has too few of them... FdG on the other side was a pain. Almost always in T10 battles, focused heavily and not able to withstand it, like the Kurfurst can. Anyway, I didn't play much Kurfurst either, because I wanted to get the "dmg emblem" first, so the Conqueror was the obvious choice. I meant the conspiracy theory about the silent nerf. I did not play her almost at all at the time - but took her for a ride recently and had quite a few trolly misses at broadside cruiser 10km away. That did not happen before. Maybe we are all autosuggesting ;) Unfortunately, WG guards statistic data as it would be a National Security issue. I did'nt mean it as a bad thing, I meant it like you should've seen all the "versions" of those ships ; How good they were and how bad they turned and what they are now. It took me 6 months to grind through Bis... And agreed on the nerf of KM BBs and in general, what it did to the desires to play with them. Ok, I kinda liked the Gneis a lot like you, but felt betrayed when it got nerfed. Bis was still... "good"ish but secondary build made it fun to play. Then the FdG turned that all around... it indeed could'nt withstand anything in those tiers and sunk pretty fast. I have not even bought the Kurfurst now when I finally grinded the FdG out of the way. Agreed on the Missouri thingie, I played it quite a lot and occasionally still do. I find that all BBs are in the same state or somehow I just cannot shoot anymore or something... Richelieu is atm the BB that I can hit a lot better, but seem to not win in it. Cruisers have always been my thing, but recently I'm able to get some better results with DDs. Still, I prefer cruisers. My original point kinda was, that the Orion may be now on par with the other BBs = trollish shi*. (At least for me they all are.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,140 battles Report post #32 Posted May 3, 2018 2 hours ago, EdiJo said: Myogi is like Izumo - WG put a carrot (Kongo) and a stick (3 turrets with crippled accuracy). Upgraded Myo even looks like a Kongo... Another example of pushing into faster grind. Bad bad bad bad bad idea, WG. Yes, I have & like Ischi. I even just played 3 games today. The biggest problem is total lack of AA, and ALMOST EVERY Ischi game has AT LEAST one carrier. And skill of those carriers varies wildly, so in 50% cases enemy CV totally owns the sky. Ischi is long and doesn't turn very well. Orion at least can remind the CV that not all planes have to return, so most of CV players think twice afterwards. The other thing: Ischi AP is not effective even vs broadside BB and armor can't stop same tier real BB shell even when reasonably angled. Unlike the Orion's. Simply: Ischi is not a battleship. But Ischi can still shoot DD - and the Policy says she will always can Izumo is a decent ship, Myogi not. The amount of CVs at midtier is not that high, you can lookup the stats for that. Ishis speed helps to get near friendlies with decent AA. And yes, Ishis AP works quite well versus broadside BB and she can tank enemy BB when angled. Btw, it looks like Orion still performs very well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
_LordLucan Players 161 posts 6,266 battles Report post #33 Posted May 3, 2018 15 hours ago, EdiJo said: Orion accuracy nerf made it a wide-spread shotgun. its just WGs way of preparing you for the KGV , it will now feel familiar instead of disapointing Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdiJo Players 1,419 posts 11,712 battles Report post #34 Posted May 3, 2018 21 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Izumo is a decent ship, Myogi not. No no no. I was really struggling in Izumo. Especially considering how much you have to grind to get out of stock. Very expensive fast food for HE spammers and for CV. 21 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: The amount of CVs at midtier is not that high, you can lookup the stats for that. There is just new thread about that. At lower tiers you on average have one CV in every game. Sometimes 0, sometimes 2. When I queue I see similar number of CV and cruisers. And it is much more probable to get a seal clubber vs noob in a CV than in other, more numerous, classes. 21 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Ishis speed helps to get near friendlies with decent AA. What has "decent AA" at tier 4? oO The best ships barely can make CV to pay the price AFTER they are dropped. 21 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: And yes, Ishis AP works quite well versus broadside BB and she can tank enemy BB when angled. Nope. I just had "a brawl" with some Courbet today. I killed him with AP, yes, but the dmg started appear only at 5km or so, and he was flat broadside to me. I was angled, yet I still got massive hit. Huge citadel with max 203mm armor, the thinnest paper of all BB in the game. 21 minutes ago, ColonelPete said: Btw, it looks like Orion still performs very well. Maybe. But it now performs more similarly when you know what to do - to when you don't know what to do. Just point in the general direction and roll the dice. Not fun. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdiJo Players 1,419 posts 11,712 battles Report post #35 Posted May 3, 2018 15 minutes ago, _LordLucan said: its just WGs way of preparing you for the KGV , it will now feel familiar instead of disapointing Sold that boat, but I remember it wasn't as bad as I heard. I sometimes use Duke of York now and it feels better than Monarch ;) Anyway, fortunately at that tier targets are already larger than in T4... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,140 battles Report post #36 Posted May 3, 2018 5 minutes ago, EdiJo said: No no no. I was really struggling in Izumo. Especially considering how much you have to grind to get out of stock. Very expensive fast food for HE spammers and for CV. There is just new thread about that. At lower tiers you on average have one CV in every game. Sometimes 0, sometimes 2. When I queue I see similar number of CV and cruisers. And it is much more probable to get a seal clubber vs noob in a CV than in other, more numerous, classes. What has "decent AA" at tier 4? oO The best ships barely can make CV to pay the price AFTER they are dropped. Nope. I just had "a brawl" with some Courbet today. I killed him with AP, yes, but the dmg started appear only at 5km or so, and he was flat broadside to me. I was angled, yet I still got massive hit. Huge citadel with max 203mm armor, the thinnest paper of all BB in the game. Maybe. But it now performs more similarly when you know what to do - to when you don't know what to do. Just point in the general direction and roll the dice. Not fun. Then you are doing it very wrong. The stats can be looked up. AA can be looked up. You yourself talked about Orion. There are other aimpoints than the waterline and yes, 203 mm armor can bounce 305mm guns, you just have to angle more... And knowing what to do is the baseline of doing well in this game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
44_Broadsword Players 5 posts 7,963 battles Report post #37 Posted May 3, 2018 Oh I love the Orion, and have noticed a slight change since the patch. Maybe its me as I think we all play differently especially after a long day and just want to relax. Having said that I managed to send 3 DD and a Courbet down last night and had another decent game with her so I don't mind. My W/R in her is 54% after 400+ games so know that I might have to adjust play style. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[NECRO] Deckeru_Maiku Beta Tester 6,636 posts 24,864 battles Report post #38 Posted May 3, 2018 11 hours ago, nambr9 said: Soooo ... now I can charge an Orion with Kamikaze? Good, good But take your time to look who's the ship's commander... might be a big surprise if you target someone who knows what he does... And yes, that nerf was a terrible one. Couple days ago I did a battle with my Orion and barely managed 100k damage and two sinkers - one DD among them... - which made me feel terribly helpless and underarmed... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EdiJo Players 1,419 posts 11,712 battles Report post #39 Posted May 3, 2018 1 hour ago, Deckeru_Maiku said: And yes, that nerf was a terrible one. Couple days ago I did a battle with my Orion and barely managed 100k damage and two sinkers - one DD among them... - which made me feel terribly helpless and underarmed... You still can hit battleships, and you have the same fire chance. If it happens that someone takes care for you about DD or other small stuff (or if they are just potatoes) - you still do 100+k as before. You even sometimes still can get RNG hit on a DD. But this is not what my whining is about. I agreed a zillion times that the nerf was needed - but not in the way which makes things more random, independent on what you do. This is more general problem with WG that instead of matching both teams properly, they tend to randomize damage to neutralize any skill advantage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[-SBG-] ColonelPete Players 38,559 posts 19,140 battles Report post #40 Posted May 4, 2018 Right, good players have no advantage to win a match. Those poor unicum BB players have only 50% solo winrate.... or maybe not? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[ALONE] GeneralSavage Players 123 posts 5,432 battles Report post #41 Posted May 4, 2018 18 hours ago, EdiJo said: Yes, it is still good - but I whine only about WHAT was nerfed, and not that it was nerfed... WG intended to nerf Orion because it can deal a lot of damage in a short time period when compared to other BBs in its tier, which is not what they want. They don't want to nerf shell characteristics because its a flavour of the line. Nerfing armor is not possible because all BBs have standard levels of armor at its tier. AA is already crap and more or less the same compared to other T4s. Nerfing AA won't be of relevance anyway because it doesn't affect damage output. Just a tad to survivability. But as I said, its AA isn't too durable or much effective as of now and nerfing it wouldn't give the necessary change that it requires. So I think nerfing the sigma was the only effective nerf it could receive. Come on now, we need to give your adversaries a chance too.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
anonym_DKZABZXaXZld Players 67 posts Report post #42 Posted May 4, 2018 So Orion isn't fun to play anymore? Sounds like good news to me. Maybe I can finally have fun playing lowtier cruisers again... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[NECRO] Deckeru_Maiku Beta Tester 6,636 posts 24,864 battles Report post #43 Posted May 4, 2018 12 hours ago, Duke_of_Lauenburg said: So Orion isn't fun to play anymore? Sounds like good news to me. Maybe I can finally have fun playing lowtier cruisers again... Yeah, do that... best set fixed times, to people can use their Orions to show you personally how terribly nerfed it got... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
