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KarmaQU_EU

Why KC won't collab WoWs, and what to learn from it

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TL;DR There are probably things to be learned here which may help to improve WoWs and there are already quite a few points I have in mind but I can't be bothered to write them out so still making a superficial thread in case other ppl with more enthusiasm and insight would like to contribute.

 

As we know Kancolle would not prefer to have a collab with WoWs despite (allegedly) having been approached by WG in the past.

 

I was reminded of this topic recently due to news on the Azur Lane collab.

 

By having discussion and thinking on why, perhaps we may be able to generate insight that may help to better WoWs or allow us to see it from much needed new perspectives.

 

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I initially envision 3 main sections:

1. Why Kancolle does not want collab with WoWs.

2. Why Azur Lane does.

3. What would WoWs have to change to make Kancolle to want to collab, and would those changes be beneficial to WoWs.

 

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The sections themselves are quite superficial, for instance there may be structural barriers preventing a collab happening such as the parent company of Kancolle firmly opposing this on non-creative and content-based grounds. Conclusions generated on this are factual only and do little to provide insight to improve WoWs.

 

Reasons why Azur Lane does may also be mundane and trivial, and not "insight" per se. Conclusions will merely serve to perhaps improve experience on future collabs, but little meaningful context providing insight on game design and operation.

 

And finally, things that WoWs will have to change for KC to want to collab may be beneficial to KC only, and due to scope of change and resources/talent required, not realistically applicable. 

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

However, insights and perspectives on those sections, such as those having to do with analyzing the way entertainment industry works in Japan, how creative content is evaluated, their production standards, philosophies, and process, may serve to provide WoWs producers with technical knowledge of how to do better in the industry.

Qualitative insight such as how to align with the market, how to align and stay ahead of different types of markets (e.g. bubbles), and highly contextual insight, may serve to provide WoWs developers with how to make the most of their game's uniqueness and context.

And finally, general operational knowledge experience within the specific act of collaborations. (Lack of experience/standardized procedure may also be a reason why KC side shies away from collabs.)

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also as a joke, engaging in critical thinking may do the WoWs team some good by preparing them for engaging in other relevant issues, such as how to address toxicity, how to not make p2w, and how to make their game fun (requires creativity).

 

Everything I would ever be interested in saying about WoWs I've already said in some form or another. But most actual serious stuff like how to hire ppl and how to measure saturation in the industry is either too long to be said simply or outright now my place to say. If my morale for this game was a bit higher I'd at least attempt a writeup which was messy but still goes into details, and if it was very high I'd be slightly concerned with the quality too but now, just meh.

 

I'm not expecting long writeups so just throw your notes out here.

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One thing in particular that has bothered me for a long time was during the ARP collab, how the ship death animation was not synced to that of the original work, where they turn into particles of light and drift away. But I've droned on this point before already.

 

Edit: Here's a fun idea, I will sync an idea to every publicly contributed point here. As detailed as the contributed point. And nothing I've already droned on before, only new things.

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16 minutes ago, KarmaQU_EU said:

1. Why Kancolle does not want collab with WoWs.

2. Why Azur Lane does.

3. What would WoWs have to change to make Kancolle to want to collab, and would those changes be beneficial to WoWs.

1. Because its creator/owner allegedly have ties with Gaijin Entertainment (WG's direct competitor).

2. Because Azur Line's creator does not have similar ties.

3. WoWs would have to change owner (to the owner of Kancolle or one affiliated with them), whether it would be beneficial depends on the approach of the new owner.

 

Glad I could help :Smile_trollface:

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2 hours ago, KarmaQU_EU said:

2. Why Azur Lane does.

 

Basic story behind it afaik is that AL became popular among WoWs Asia devs, so they contacted AL devs on whether they want to do a collab. And among AL devs WoWs is very popular, so they immediately agreed.

 

It's a wonderful thing when two groups of weebs meet. :D

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2 hours ago, KarmaQU_EU said:

I initially envision 3 main sections:

1. Why Kancolle does not want collab with WoWs.

2. Why Azur Lane does.

3. What would WoWs have to change to make Kancolle to want to collab, and would those changes be beneficial to WoWs.

 

You should add a #4 to that list:

 

4. why would the average player give a flying eff about why or why not any japanese manga company would collaborate with WG as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz

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1 minute ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

 

You should add a #4 to that list:

 

4. why would the average player give a flying eff about why or why not any japanese manga company would collaborate with WG as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz

Free stuff to be obtained is free - Arpeggio boats, Yamato HSF camo. And these makes for nice mementos as well have some utility.

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14 minutes ago, Panocek said:

Free stuff to be obtained is free - Arpeggio boats, Yamato HSF camo. And these makes for nice mementos as well have some utility.

Remember how long it took to make players able to sell those ARP ships and release those captains and how often players asked for those options here in the forum?

There's probably more people waiting for some more historically relevant ships instead of spaceships and those girlships.

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3 minutes ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

Remember how long it took to make players able to sell those ARP ships and release those captains and how often players asked for those options here in the forum?

There's probably more people waiting for some more historically relevant ships instead of spaceships and those girlships.

And why you would want to sell perfectly fine ships. Even if you loathe "anime stuff" you can untick their camos off and get normally looking IJN boats. Stuff some IJN captain on board and problem solved? Heck, even Arpeggio girls turn into normal IJN guys

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1 hour ago, El2aZeR said:

It's a wonderful thing when two groups of weebs meet. :D

can agree ;)

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1 hour ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

 

You should add a #4 to that list:

 

4. why would the average player give a flying eff about why or why not any japanese manga company would collaborate with WG as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz

My my, aren`t we a weeeeeee bit prejudice? Better check that locker room of yours if all Boxes are still alive and kicking.

May i ask if you also call all black people N_iggas or germans N_azi because, well you know, they are from Germany so they have to be...?

If you have no [edited]clue what the [edited]you talk about, better inform your sorry [edited]first than to throw insults and blind accusations around mate.

 

Back to Topic:

1. Because KC is too big to be bullied by WG into somerthing :)

2. Because AL isn`t yet and might actually think they could get a decent boost out of it. ( just like many people started out WoT after G&P entered the Co-Op ).

3. Nothing sadly, because in KC you don`t actually play ships but Girls, unlike ARP or HSF where you still had the ships commanded by characters. So to transform that over would you then play not a Bismarck ship but the Girl? How about the Hitzones? too many problems i`m afraid :/

 

POI

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4 hours ago, eliastion said:

1. Because its creator/owner allegedly have ties with Gaijin Entertainment (WG's direct competitor).

2. Because Azur Line's creator does not have similar ties.

3. WoWs would have to change owner (to the owner of Kancolle or one affiliated with them), whether it would be beneficial depends on the approach of the new owner.

 

Glad I could help :Smile_trollface:

Can you give a source, at least for number 1? :cap_hmm:

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22 hours ago, Panocek said:

And why you would want to sell perfectly fine ships. Even if you loathe "anime stuff" you can untick their camos off and get normally looking IJN boats. Stuff some IJN captain on board and problem solved? Heck, even Arpeggio girls turn into normal IJN guys

Because due to not being able to avoid fulfilling those ARP missions I ended up with 10 quite useless captains, which made transferring the usefull captains to other ships a pita.

And I only need one Kongo clone, not four or five...

So: sell them off... just to get rid of them.

 

21 hours ago, StoneRhino said:

My my, aren`t we a weeeeeee bit prejudice? Better check that locker room of yours if all Boxes are still alive and kicking.

May i ask if you also call all black people N_iggas or germans N_azi because, well you know, they are from Germany so they have to be...?

If you have no [edited]clue what the [edited]you talk about, better inform your sorry [edited]first than to throw insults and blind accusations around mate.

 

No, I call black people "extremly pigmented" and I know for sure that some, but not all germans are rightwing material, because I am a german myself.

Alas, I don't have an effing clue why you came up with the above, because I just stated a fact and - other than you - didn't even use derogatory terms to do that.

So, if you can't post something without acting like the backside of an donkey, please don't post at all..

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20 minutes ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

No, I call black people "extremly pigmented" and I know for sure that some, but not all germans are rightwing material, because I am a german myself.

Alas, I don't have an effing clue why you came up with the above, because I just stated a fact and - other than you - didn't even use derogatory terms to do that.

So, if you can't post something without acting like the backside of an donkey, please don't post at all..

I quote from your earlier Post:

"...as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz."

You insinuate that every person who knows manga is only in it for the porn ( Hentai ).

You directly prejudice those people.

You disrespect their interest in it without asking.

You totally disregard the broadness of Manga.

 

Those are facts. What you posted is as i aforementioned that.

Disrespectul, disregarding, discriminating, hateful.

If you are unable to see the correlation between what i responded and what you wrote, there is none. Same crap different camouflage.

Saying you dislike it, your opinion, is fine, doing the above isn`t.

 

And now have fun on my ignore list.

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I nearly started an thoughtfull and detailed answer to this, but then I saw...

 

9 minutes ago, StoneRhino said:

And now have fun on my ignore list.

 

..so it would be a waste of time.

 

Instead I just leave this here: What the internet is for

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Phew I thought the thread was gonna become moderator material.

 

Anyways, while "which types of ppl want what" is kinda relevant, it still took over a dozen posts to just get into the door so the discussion is going bit too slowly.

 

What I had in mind was more like insight on entertainment, games, creative content in general.

 

Such as from a neutral perspective, how entertainment is not judged by its content but by its "popularity", but not really popularity per se but more like claims within the creative sphere, and most ppl don't know better. The implications this would mean could be that WoWs has to structure for an outwards "presentation" so it can sell, having to do with "showmanship". The reason WoWs is lackluster, niche, lacks popularity, feeds into this.

 

Another point could be how a lot of people see entertainment as "investment", i.e. they invest their time and gain optimal benefit. The implications this would have on WoWs also means a lot of basic, structural, even philosophy level changes. How much "polish" matters nowadays, how different perceived "nature" of content is enjoyed differently by pp (different types of investment, different areas and things given to the investment). These things are insight to be gained from critically examining the topic, the situation, as listed at top, and reflecting upon WoWs.

 

I look forward to what content you can bring to the table.

 

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55 minutes ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

Because due to not being able to avoid fulfilling those ARP missions I ended up with 10 quite useless captains, which made transferring the usefull captains to other ships a pita.

And I only need one Kongo clone, not four or five...

So: sell them off... just to get rid of them.

What ARP ships lack in inability to use camouflages, they make up with opportunity to knock several dailies with single captain. But whatever float your boat

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3 hours ago, StoneRhino said:

I quote from your earlier Post:

"...as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz."

You insinuate that every person who knows manga is only in it for the porn ( Hentai ).

You directly prejudice those people.

You disrespect their interest in it without asking.

You totally disregard the broadness of Manga.

 

 Those are facts. What you posted is as i aforementioned that.

Disrespectul, disregarding, discriminating, hateful.

If you are unable to see the correlation between what i responded and what you wrote, there is none. Same crap different camouflage.

Saying you dislike it, your opinion, is fine, doing the above isn`t.

 

And now have fun on my ignore list.

Hey, dude. I actually kinda like some manga and anime, at times I read/watch a sh*tton of the stuff... and you still don't make any sense even to me. I mean, seriously, how insecure and defensive can you get about your interests? All that @Deckeru_Maiku really said was that most people here have no real interest in whatever WoWs is or isn't collaborating with. Please, grow a pair and stop being offended by everything.

And I seriously lost it at your claim that he's "directly prejudicing those people". Then it got funnier with "Disrespectul, disregarding, discriminating, hateful." I mean, seriosuly... It's like you're making fun of yourself at this point, there should be some limit to blowing things out of proportion. :Smile_sceptic:

 

And then you deal the finishing blow with the oh-so-terrible

3 hours ago, StoneRhino said:

And now have fun on my ignore list.

Yeah. I'm sure your "oppnent" is devastated. He might never recuperate from that.

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5 hours ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

Because due to not being able to avoid fulfilling those ARP missions I ended up with 10 quite useless captains, which made transferring the usefull captains to other ships a pita.

And I only need one Kongo clone, not four or five...

So: sell them off... just to get rid of them.

I think WG learned some lessons since the ARP collab. I really doubt we'll ever get half a dozen iterations of the same ship again. Might be they just sell stuff like in the HSF collab.

 

As for captains, why say no to free 6 pt captains (if they are like Isoroku cat)?

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On 2-5-2018 at 9:49 PM, Deckeru_Maiku said:

Remember how long it took to make players able to sell those ARP ships and release those captains and how often players asked for those options here in the forum?

There's probably more people waiting for some more historically relevant ships instead of spaceships and those girlships.

I want some ARP ships :(

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On 2-5-2018 at 10:56 PM, StoneRhino said:

My my, aren`t we a weeeeeee bit prejudice? Better check that locker room of yours if all Boxes are still alive and kicking.

May i ask if you also call all black people N_iggas or germans N_azi because, well you know, they are from Germany so they have to be...?

If you have no [edited]clue what the [edited]you talk about, better inform your sorry [edited]first than to throw insults and blind accusations around mate.

 

Back to Topic:

1. Because KC is too big to be bullied by WG into somerthing :)

2. Because AL isn`t yet and might actually think they could get a decent boost out of it. ( just like many people started out WoT after G&P entered the Co-Op ).

3. Nothing sadly, because in KC you don`t actually play ships but Girls, unlike ARP or HSF where you still had the ships commanded by characters. So to transform that over would you then play not a Bismarck ship but the Girl? How about the Hitzones? too many problems i`m afraid :/

 

POI

What is G&P?

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1 hour ago, NothingButTheRain said:

What is G&P?

I think it is Girls and Panzer, basically tanks and anime that WG sold some premium tanks with what I assume is popular characters from the show. 

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1 minute ago, ollonborre said:

I think it is Girls and Panzer, basically tanks and anime that WG sold some premium tanks with what I assume is popular characters from the show. 

Ah thanks. I heard of Girls and Panzer, I just didn't know what G&P meant :cap_hmm:

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On 2.5.2018 at 6:43 PM, KarmaQU_EU said:

I initially envision 3 main sections:

1. Why Kancolle does not want collab with WoWs.

2. Why Azur Lane does.

3. What would WoWs have to change to make Kancolle to want to collab, and would those changes be beneficial to WoWs.

Well

1. Kancolle is big enough to stand its ground

2. Azur Lange competes with Kancolle as its chinese counterpart

  a) azurlane is not as big as kancolle and seeks to broaden its active comunity

3. I dont thinkt that there is much synergy between KC/AL and WoWs - they have different approaches (they are abit like Science fiction vs Science Fantasy)

 

so i think since auzurlane is smaller than kancolle, and given chinese and russians had always good relationships, it is beneficial for both sides to stand up against Kancolle.

i think its mere strategic to get an economical vital and vivid competetor (from its playerbase) in Asia.

It also serves as a extra candy for all those weebs out there to be satisfied.

 

On 2.5.2018 at 9:30 PM, Deckeru_Maiku said:

4. why would the average player give a flying eff about why or why not any japanese manga company would collaborate with WG as most don't even know those manga or, if they do, only are interested in the hentai pictures that can be found on the interwebz

i like you! you Sir are prime example of why the internet is funny! keep up the good work with more of these comments! they are just so much fun to read! :)

 

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9 hours ago, NothingButTheRain said:

What is G&P?

It stands for Girls & Panzer. Since it`s debut it is been praised and became quite sought after.

It is an Manga/Anime about Schoolgirls driving WW2 ( mostly ) Tanks as competitive Sport ( Like Highschool Football in the US ).

WoT made a big Co-Op with the Producer incl. various Voiceovers of famous Characters and gotten a decent boost out of it.

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18 hours ago, Riselotte said:

s for captains, why say no to free 6 pt captains (if they are like Isoroku cat)?

There is no unlimited amount of 6 pt captains needed by me. And, as said above, it makes looking for a certain captain you want to assign to a ship a bit more tedious (like having to go through a list with 234 unneeded 6 pt captains while looking for the 8 pt one you want to train...)  :Smile_glasses:

Spoiler
Spoiler

this was done by a misclick... nothing spoilered here

 

 

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