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Infiriel

Worcester - excuse me?

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56 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Thing is, why do you even have to build for AA? CVs are an integral part of the game, being one of the four classes you can choose from. Isn't it nonsensical that you have to expend a good amount of captain skills and upgrades just so you can defend yourself or others against a core part of the game and play to your air defense role as a cruiser?

And wouldn't AA be much easier to balance if you do it largely around base values instead of having to pay attention to skills and upgrades that are capable of turning even mediocre AA ships into no fly zones?

:Smile_teethhappy:

 

What you point out is so oblivious, a blind man should be able to see it.  Yet that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

--- underlines are mine---

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19 hours ago, Crysantos said:

Heyho,

 

First of all, please keep in mind that the current test phase is meant to figure out where we're at when it comes to balance, so we can adjust it before release. When it comes to the actual ship, the Worchester has its advantages and disadvantages - it's a great ship against DDs and CVs due to her characteristics, but she's also very prone to taking damage like the Minotaur. She does lack torps and smoke compared to that ship but does get HE in return. She's quite sluggish when it comes to maneuvrability and lacks the acceleration rate of the Mino.

 

I understand the the AA power is a concern and we'll definitely keep an eye on that but also keep in mind that HE shells take down those AA mounts quite easily, I had exactly that experience with her in battle - also full AA builds aren't  going to be the common build in randoms. We'll take a look at how she performs, what the feedback from testers, contributors and you is like - but I'd always like to highlight that a new ship might look mightly on paper, but testing it in a proper live server environment is something entirely different.

 

Thanks for your constructive contributions here!

 

@Tubit: Max concealment is currently 9.5 km (at least that's what I get with camo, CE module and CE skill).

 

Greetings, Crysantos

 

@Infiriel, @eliastion

 

do you See?

 

and you are left with a  overgrowned Atlanta and that's it.

 

Most probably, the same fate will happen to the Cleveland.

Being a good and solid, though skin t6 cruiser capable of Multipurpose.

Now will be reduced to a thing in the map behind a island.

 

yeah, I'm whining because I will loose one good cruiser at t6. And in it's place I will have the shiniest turd of the US line and nerfed in top of that.

A nerfed turd, wtf?

How can you have courage to nerf a turd WG? I think it's place should be in t5 for furutaka kick it's [edited]to kingdom came @Crysantos. So i'll be 1 ship less to ops/random

And Dallas, while in WIP I think will be a sluggish Shchors.

either one will be eaten alive by akasukis and whatnot I will not even speak of others ships, like buddy e.g. that ship will laugh so hard.

 

 

*Edit

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Vor 1 Stunde, Butterdoll sagte:

hold your horses.

Worcester, it's WIP.

 

And will be nerfed to the ground before they release them.

 

And then, there's not much he can do

 

You really think WG nerfs ships just because tests show they are imbalanced? :cap_haloween:

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51 minutes ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

You really think WG nerfs ships just because tests show they are imbalanced? :cap_haloween:

 

well, to answer your question.

It depends which type/class of ship we are talking about.

the War chest probably will be more whoosh... puffff. Not even a bum.

Let's see.

 

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On 4/28/2018 at 5:55 PM, Tubit101 said:

It's like a Minotaur for dummies.

Need to disagree here. Minotaur has super heal to compensate for its armor. Also has smoke. This makes it more forgiving in case of mistakes. 

Worcester, however, doesn't have any of that. It has to rely on island cover or ally smoke to survive. Dealing damage is much easier with Worcester because of HE ammunition. But that isn't much of a deal when it can't survive for more than a few minutes in the open. 

So yeah, not an easy to play Minotaur.

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Some might cal it anti CV "malignent disease." Some might call it "anti CV chemotherapy."

 

I'm with the latter group. For all times sake! I'd strongly urge CV players to uninstall and play Wowp instead.

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2 hours ago, Ferry_25 said:

Some might cal it anti CV "malignent disease." Some might call it "anti CV chemotherapy."

 

I hope you realize that Worchester does not represent a global CV nerf.

If anything Worchester will only increase the influence of a super unicum CV division. A 90% WR div may rise even higher when using this ship. And ofc skilled solo CV players who have already learnt how to deal with the Minotaur (and AA ships in general) will be thoroughly unimpressed with the Worchester. It's nothing we're not used to.

Thus Worchester represents a huge buff to skilled CV divs and does nothing against skilled solo CVs. The only loser in this equation is once again the average CV player and those that are teamed with them in extension. If I were to examine this from the perspective of a skilled CV player only I'd be rubbing my hands in glee.

 

It's funny how CV hate can turn one utterly blind.

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On 4/28/2018 at 1:18 PM, Hades_warrior said:

 He melt my Alsace like an icecream in Sahara.

LOL!! , BBQ Time

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9 minutes ago, Ysterpyp said:

LOL!! , BBQ Time

Its more tied to baguette and tea battleboats lacking HE protection than "worcester unfair plane". Des Moines is no less gentle against them

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13 hours ago, GeneralSavage said:

Need to disagree here. Minotaur has super heal to compensate for its armor. Also has smoke. This makes it more forgiving in case of mistakes. 

Worcester, however, doesn't have any of that. It has to rely on island cover or ally smoke to survive. Dealing damage is much easier with Worcester because of HE ammunition. But that isn't much of a deal when it can't survive for more than a few minutes in the open. 

So yeah, not an easy to play Minotaur.

As I've mentioned earlier, the HE ammunition is the reason why I said it's a "Mino for dummies". The survival aspect is very situational. This is symptomatic of WG's latest bad design choices where they throw good balancing out the window in favor of gimmicky extremes. On the wrong map with the wrong team, Wooster might have a hard time, yes. But put it in a tryhard division and see what happens.

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5 hours ago, Tubit101 said:

As I've mentioned earlier, the HE ammunition is the reason why I said it's a "Mino for dummies". The survival aspect is very situational. This is symptomatic of WG's latest bad design choices where they throw good balancing out the window in favor of gimmicky extremes. On the wrong map with the wrong team, Wooster might have a hard time, yes. But put it in a tryhard division and see what happens.

Aren't "tryhard divisions" rare? I mean how often do you see Belfast and Atlanta in a division? Sure, there are plenty of extreme situations but you can't claim a ship is over powered just because its in a division, doesn't give justice to the ship's actual capabilities. AA needs a change, its just too much. Still don't think its an easy going mino.

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50 minutes ago, GeneralSavage said:

Aren't "tryhard divisions" rare? I mean how often do you see Belfast and Atlanta in a division? Sure, there are plenty of extreme situations but you can't claim a ship is over powered just because its in a division, doesn't give justice to the ship's actual capabilities. AA needs a change, its just too much. Still don't think its an easy going mino.

 

Why would you division Belfast + Atlanta?
You division either one of them with Blyska/Lennin or Saipan...

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On 4/28/2018 at 6:49 PM, Commander_Cornflakes said:

You really think WG nerfs ships just because tests show they are imbalanced? :cap_haloween:

They did...look at the conq...:cap_popcorn:

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10 hours ago, cro_pwr said:

 

Why would you division Belfast + Atlanta?
You division either one of them with Blyska/Lennin or Saipan...

Belfast smoke + Atlanta dakka dakka + 2 radars+ Atlanta's no fly zone. Why not, huh?:cap_popcorn:

Just about any of these premiums in a division is a pain in the arse.

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Worcester seems super weak to me. A more difficult to play Minotaur with lower potential (worse AP and no torpedoes).

 

If it got improved autobounce angles I would have some hope, but currently just looks garbage compared to what the other tier 10s bring to the table.

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What strikes me is that it's going to be challenging if not borderline unplayable solo but broken o/p in a division.

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On 5/1/2018 at 9:28 PM, Affeks said:

Worcester seems super weak to me. A more difficult to play Minotaur with lower potential (worse AP and no torpedoes).

 

If it got improved autobounce angles I would have some hope, but currently just looks garbage compared to what the other tier 10s bring to the table.

 

I think she is a strong ship. Yes she has some weaknesses, she is quite vulnerable in the open due 25mm armour but that is something you can say for every cruiser. She is very dependent on map, on Ocean or Okinawa she will suffer but on any map with decant amount of cover she could turn to monster. She has insane DPM and she is very (maybe even much to) strong against DDs and CVs. She also could be very powerful in division. Maybe her playstyle looks boring but she definitely couldn't be called a weak ship. I don't think that she needs any buff.

 

 

 

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On 5/1/2018 at 5:52 AM, GeneralSavage said:

Belfast smoke + Atlanta dakka dakka + 2 radars+ Atlanta's no fly zone. Why not, huh?:cap_popcorn:

Just about any of these premiums in a division is a pain in the arse.

 

Because you are divisioning 2 ships with same strengths and same weaknesses (AKA without spotting, you can't do jack s**t).
Thats why whenever you want to get an OP division, you take OP ships that compliment each other well, in this situation you take either DD or CV to spot for Belfast, and / or Atlanta, and go together to contest cap and radar/kill any DD dumb enough to come close.
And both Blyska and Lennin fit into that equasion perfectly since they can provide another smoke for Belfast, and they are strongest (no P2W at the slightest) t7 DDs, or as I said, another (Not at all P2W) premium carrier aka Saipan.

 

Dumbest thing you can do in a division (heck its the game after all, so you can do it for fun) is to bring something like 3 Yamatos or whatever in the same division. You aren't getting anywhere with it, and its enough to have 1 dumb DD in your team to have 0 spotting and 3 dead/useless Yamatos.

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8 minutes ago, cro_pwr said:

 

Because you are divisioning 2 ships with same strengths and same weaknesses (AKA without spotting, you can't do jack s**t).
Thats why whenever you want to get an OP division, you take OP ships that compliment each other well, in this situation you take either DD or CV to spot for Belfast, and / or Atlanta, and go together to contest cap and radar/kill any DD dumb enough to come close.
And both Blyska and Lennin fit into that equasion perfectly since they can provide another smoke for Belfast, and they are strongest (no P2W at the slightest) t7 DDs, or as I said, another (Not at all P2W) premium carrier aka Saipan.

 

Dumbest thing you can do in a division (heck its the game after all, so you can do it for fun) is to bring something like 3 Yamatos or whatever in the same division. You aren't getting anywhere with it, and its enough to have 1 dumb DD in your team to have 0 spotting and 3 dead/useless Yamatos.

what about, Belfasts and flints?

there are some videos about it, I think they call them cancer divs.

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On 5/1/2018 at 11:28 PM, Affeks said:

Worcester seems super weak to me. A more difficult to play Minotaur with lower potential (worse AP and no torpedoes).

 

You get HE ammunition with base 12% fire chance. And we already know about its reload. In terms of damage potential, this thing is hilariously broken. I'm really worried about players that are familiar with exploiting island cover.

Oh my poor poor Richelieu will be a burnt baguette by the time I run out of his gun range while I can't do a thing to him in return. My Helpful DD may get him spotted but he's gonna be deleted:etc_red_button:. I need not elaborate on that. My Carrier can barely spot him for a few seconds because 'Murican AA says hello:cap_rambo:. Regardless, my flat arc shells are either gonna hit the island or the water. How many times do you end up in Ocean map anyway? If i'm that unicum Worcester player, I wouldn't mind playing in that map in 1 out of....say...20 games? Seriously, its waaay too rare.

 

In the end, I'm just glad that they did not make it a mino copy. Minotaur still stands as the most versatile ship in game IMO. Except for BBQs and tanking, this thing does it all and does it really well too. 

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8 minutes ago, GeneralSavage said:

You get HE ammunition with base 12% fire chance. And we already know about its reload. In terms of damage potential, this thing is hilariously broken. I'm really worried about players that are familiar with exploiting island cover.

Oh my poor poor Richelieu will be a burnt baguette by the time I run out of his gun range while I can't do a thing to him in return. My Helpful DD may get him spotted but he's gonna be deleted:etc_red_button:. I need not elaborate on that. My Carrier can barely spot him for a few seconds because 'Murican AA says hello:cap_rambo:. Regardless, my flat arc shells are either gonna hit the island or the water. How many times do you end up in Ocean map anyway? If i'm that unicum Worcester player, I wouldn't mind playing in that map in 1 out of....say...20 games? Seriously, its waaay too rare.

 

In the end, I'm just glad that they did not make it a mino copy. Minotaur still stands as the most versatile ship in game IMO. Except for BBQs and tanking, this thing does it all and does it really well too. 

9% fire chance because IFHE, 4.5% because firing at tier 10. If you intend to keep that AA at "lol" level you need then AFT/Manual AA. Combined with CE you're already at 18 points, so you have only one Tier 3 skill to pick. Either Demo to offset IFHE penalty or SI to get more gimmicks

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19 minutes ago, Panocek said:

9% fire chance because IFHE, 4.5% because firing at tier 10. If you intend to keep that AA at "lol" level you need then AFT/Manual AA. Combined with CE you're already at 18 points, so you have only one Tier 3 skill to pick. Either Demo to offset IFHE penalty or SI to get more gimmicks

 

You can increase fire chance a little with a flags. But then again Worcester, with reload module, can shoot some 180 shells in a minute and even with 4.5%-5% chance you can start quite a number of fires. Well theoretically at least.

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in terms of DPM this ship is good sure, but unfortunately thats not all there is to the game. This ship has no alpha threat and is somehow even more defensive and less adaptable than Minotaur. Especially noticable is the garbage turret placement which is bad for the island hugging playstyle.

 

I really disagree on the notion that Minotaur is versatile. That ship is very defensive and static in playstyle. It cant kite and it cant chase. Now Worcester is the exact same, but without the tools to play a defensive position well. Theres a reason why Flint is a clear cut over Atlanta despite losing a turret. Worcester seems too reliant to have everything fall into its hands.

Needs islands, needs a team to stop enemies from pushing, needs the right type of island, needs enemies to approach on certain angles or risk only getting 2 turrets to shoot at a time. 

 

It does nothing in Randoms that Minotaur cant do, and does nothing in competitive that Des Moines cant do. In other words a waste of time. Other than being an AA one trick pony it has nothing. Worcester might be workable for the good player, but why not just grind one of the universally competitive lines that do more of the same but have tools to do soooo much more.

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