The_Chiv

Would it not be simpler to give cruiser better spotting against a dd?

Pushing a cap right away is not a great idea. Sure early point lead and all but suiciding for it just seem a bad idea no matter how you look at it. DD player requires a bit more thinking and skill then most dd players have. AND A HELL OF A LOT MORE THEN BB PLAY.

There is a flaw in your observation. This game has never been rock, paper, scissors. Sure WG tried to promote this concept but that is not accurate to actual game play. A cruiser is only a threat to a dd if it can see it. Cruisers are highly reliant on team play in order to bring their dpm to bare on a dd. DD's on the other hand do not have this limitation and get the added benefit of having ap damage mitigation. DDs are way too important to the game because vision is the key to everything in this game. The team that can blind the enemy first has a much higher chance of winning. Just common knowledge. So yeah it is a choice for cruisers to play more conservatively, much in the same what it is a choice for a dd to not engage or spot other dds. Trying to justify one aspect as a part of a system that does not apply to one class is a bit of a stretch. If there was RPS then cruisers would spot all dds at 10km or have some other advantage over a DD. The best they get is a consumable with limited range, duration and a cool down that a dd can play around and circumvent. Not much of advantage.

I've gotten really good at tracking dds going into smoke and drop 6 or more shells on them at over 12km with the Minn. May not kill it but makes dd v dd play bit easier on our dds. The sad reality is that dd play has become way to important to a win. This reminds me of the old rts days of cv if one team had a good one they would win more often. Not being interested in the stability of ones product screams incompetency

Previous rank games I could play my atago and win 66% this season 50% ok 8 in a world of 9s so I tried the Agir and the Alaska, still 50% and one hell of a struggle. As I am not a fan of dd play too much I switched to BB playing GA, Minn, and Musashi and we are back over 60%. Playing a cruiser is a nightmare to say the least. Even if you support the dd and kill an enemy dd you are nuked instantly by all the bbs on that flank in one salvo. Not even joking. This leads to more conservative cruiser play which in turn leads to less support for the dd and thus dds are pretty much on their own to fight against dds. Toss a cv into the mix and the problem becomes even more magnified. The concerns many of us have raised about the rework before and after are now manifesting in some extremely negative ways. Could WG actually fix this issue? Well...Yes they could, but will they? No. WG doesn't give a damn about balance or fun to play. They pushed the rework on us as a cash grab knowing the min/maxers would dump $$$ to stay at the top. Everything that happened afterwards they didn't give a damn about. Fact is there has been enough time gone by to see the effects this rework and all we get from the staff is we need more data. WG will either need to tune down the accuracy of BBS, giver cruisers more survivability options in their stats, or exclude bb and cv from competitive play. None of these are likely to happen though as WG is tends to be incompetent when it comes to balancing.

Fair enough, though to be honest the average player tends to not think about target priority, class roles, and or supporting their team. And when it comes to dds this lack of understanding and or effort tends to have a greater negative impact then a bad cruiser or bad BB. Sadly though its not really their fault as WG does not incentivize team play all that well short of capping.

Yeah no. Sorry but dds do not have a citadel and are not effected by overmatching. Cruisers are. So really it is a judgment call. If I see the enemy has just lit up on other targets then yeah Im going to shoot at the dd, till I see the number on priority target get to 2 or more then im not shooting any more and Im going dark to get back into concealment. The longer a cruiser can stay in the game the greater the impact they can have as less ships means less counterfire that can dev strike them. Counter fire on cruisers however is a no brainer, but again being mindful of the enemy is key. Just going guns blazing and tunnel visioning is how most cruisers end up dead.

HAHAHAHAHA Soviet navy in ww2 was the weakest of all navies yet in game they are one of the strongest. Gotta love that bias.

Knowing WG they will make the H44 and sell it for cash money for 200USD. It will have a 45second reload but will be the only BB to cause flooding from gunfire, cause you know you 20 inch guns are OP.

Co op is a good means to learn some basics, which can help in random, however as a whole co op does not prepare you for what a random or even a rank battle is. In a co op the enemy is very predictable and there are some pretty aggressive tactics to maximize your xp gain that if tried in random will result in you dying in the first few minutes. You will get killed a lot. You will make mistakes. It is important you take the time to understand why what you did was a mistake. I would suggest spending some time on youtube looking up vids from Flambass, Flamu, Ichase, and some others to get an idea of positioning and str/weaknesses of classes. Below are my thoughts based on classes of game play mechanics you should learn quickly. DD's You have two primary jobs above anything else you may think. Spotting and capping. It is important to know that rushing into a cap and popping smoke is not only a bad move as it tells the enemy where to flood with torps, but also blinds your team and make any support impossible. While a bb is a simpler target to engage make sure you have last seen checked on mini map settings and keep and eye out for where enemy dds were. If your team can kill off all the enemy dds before they lose all theirs they gain a pretty big advantage. This however requires spotting of dd's. Currently only two classes can pull this off. CV's and DD's. Take some time to look up the basic stats of other dds to learn how what they can do and learn spotting ranges, this becomes really important in higher tiers. Cruisers Cruisers are a support vessel and a jack of all trades. Never be the first on to fire when the enemy is spotted. This tends to get you instantly focused(let bbs do it they have armor) HE is your friend. AP is good too but only on broadside targets When you fire your guns for the next 20 seconds you are exposed. If you fire your guns again during that exposed time it will reset to 20 seconds. Learning to manage this can make your life a million times easier and frustrate the hell out of a bb. Fighting retreat aka kiting is a good thing to do. If you have multiple targets to shoot your priority is always DD, CA then BB If you must shoot while in a turn, make sure that shot comes while you are past the apex of the turn and moving away. Play conservatively in the begining, being able to last to the late game when the ship counts are lower will giving you more freedom to push your DPM against the enemy to a greater effect. BB Deadeye is a thing, but Before t7 not really much of a threat. Just because you have back turrets does not mean you should use them Showing broadside is a sin so always be mindful of your position relative to the enemy. It is ok to use HE shells against BOW on BBS. Overmatch is a thing so always use AP against cruisers. Yolo= dead bb.

Not sure I should be proud of this but since WG has made playing a cruiser <failing to come up with something constructive to say on this subject>, I decided to focus more of BB play. 1 shot 5 citadels 60k damage, but deadeye is fine right?

Another Survey that expresses just how little the community likes the direction WG is pushing the game into that will sadly be ignored by the developers as they do not care about our opinions only our money.

beating a dead horse call it early access and one is a t7 the other is a t11 Agir was a great ship till deadeye so yeah you have a minor point with that but the ship can still do nasty things when played right and conservatively. Can not argue this one the player base has either gone full camper or full yolo. Dds refusing to do anything to help win, cruisers getting nuked in 1 salvo by 457mm+ ships, cvs just farming as usual but with more dot damage. whole rework is a dumpster fire.

Some decent AA numbers for the Alaska.

So you do not want to help your team congrats enjoy the loss.

It use to happen more back in the day, but now it is a bit rough if your side loses its dds first. Spotting is even more important these days thanks to dead eye and proliferation of 457mm+ Battleships. So when one side loses its vision this has a massive effect on the team. So in short yeah it can still happen but it is so much harder to pull off. This is also one of the main reasons I love playing gun boat dds and go dd hunting, nothing can screw over your opposition more then blinding them.

I think you are missing the point.1. Its a game. 2 I never called it op, said it was powerful when played right which can apply to any ship in this game, said it is not hard to kill in a bb. I suggested using the IJN style of cruiser play with it to frustrate bbs and provide a bit more survivability to the play of the ship. Not sure how you missed all this and jumped instantly to the assumption I am saying it is op. There are few ships I would ever have said are OP in this game. Even the Smolensk was not OP. It was TOXIC AF, but relatively predictable thus could be countered with a bit of effort. The only thing you can ever call OP is the player as they are the ones who dictate how they play and thus dictate how a ship will perform. Calling something op is just another form of placing blame on everyone and everything but yourself thus I tend not to do this.

In some ways you have to play it like a t8 IJN cruiser. Line up the shot wait for the bb to fire on some one else shoot a salvo or two and then go dark while he turns guns to engage you. Fighting them is actually not that hard if you can get a shot on them as long as you predict turn in or out right you can easily 1 shot them.

not over powered but definitely a strong cruiser.

Been complaining about that for some time. Only good aa ship is the Mino and even then only in smoke with some one else spotting for it.

Do not forget about the french ship with dual 203

While I agree it should be a separate category for commander skill reasons I find the rest of your argument to be false. Yes a Super cruiser can hurt a cruiser if it shows broadside, but as a cruiser can actually have better range and rate of fire this tends to balance out. Stalingrad and Yoshino both have better then 20km range with a decent rate of fire. Alaska, kron, Agir all below 19km. When fighting a bc there are some basic tips to screw with them. If you know you are going to be fired at cause you are seen and you see those guns coming at you, BOW TANK IT. Seriously 305 do not due much to 27mm armor with those angles. Once they fire go dark get some distance wait for them to engage another target fire one salvo wiggle around till dark set up the next shot once they fire again. May not be the best method in terms of maxing out DPM, but man can it really frustrate a Super cruiser player.

Looking at the poll results im actually not surprised. Cv rework smacked pretty hard at people because the community had forgotten how impactful a cv actually was before the rework. After the rework it was being played more because it was easier to play and the impact was just the same. The commander rework took the most toxic and annoying concepts of long range sniping in bbs and made it stronger, made cruisers life even more painful, gave cv's more DOT power, and dds lost some AA. It is pretty obvious that wg has a plan of where they want the game to go. Problem is that plan is in direct opposition to what the community wants and inevitably this lack of parody between development and player will hurt WG in the long run.

I have had games like that in a daring before can be a real nail biter even if you do not break 50k you tend to put up some good bxp and help your team win. Problem is this game does not make the concept of trying to win rewarding for the players who are in dds. Kind of sucks but it is WG so. What can you do.

2 full caps and plus a 75% damage on a dd, and 3 kills. so just on that you are looking at 75%+75%+75% + 25%+ 25%+25%+33%+3%+ spotting damage. excluding spotting damage that comes out to 336% meaning your efforts had the same results has killing 3 full health ships. Thank you for proving damage farming is not the right path to victory.