arttuperkunas

Someone posted a theory on Reddit that... I am starting to believe a little. The one thing (IMO) that Leone, Okhotnik and Harekaze II share (and to a degree the Silly Wang tbh) are that these are quite obscure boats that are not, afaik, hugely popular. So they may want to test how DDs without DCs manage in terms of combat efficiency and popularity without hugely disrupting the game (by leaving DCs off more popular boats).

I note that I have asked several times whether other ships were affected, because this was information I wanted to know (I don't have the Leone so I couldn't check). So far, it seems that there is: 1 DD without depth charges at T5 (Okhotnik) 1 DD without depth charges at T6 (Leone) 1 DD without depth charges at T8 (Harekaze II) Still interested to know whether there are others, so especially people who play obscure boats, do pipe up if you notice missing DCs. Edit: I am even more baffled by Leone and HII than I am by Okhotnik. Ok is, at least, IMO one of the best DDs that are still available at T5. Leone is, as I understand it, on the weaker side, as is the Harekaze II - especially compared to its older cousin, the Harekaze I.

A few others have been added to the list: Leone and, apparently, Harekaze II.

Don't worry, no one is expecting you to be effective if trying out a sub in co-op.

That is just providing a public service, i.e. educating mid tier cruiser players about the properties of DD AP at close range on a broadside target.

Shocking, I know :P. I think that's half the reason why we play this ship (those of us that do), how engagingly, hilariously, ridiculously over the top the ship is. This is also why I am so upset about this; why does WG want to nerf such a very fun ship that is not OP at its tier.

I think anyone who has taken a good hard look at the Okhotnik will agree that things like "realism" and "historical accuracy" are perhaps secondary considerations with this particular ship.

That is essentially the only explanation they gave to the Okhotnik nerf in the other thread :P. Like, they said "this is not a nerf to okhotnik, the characteristics were not changed, simply the environment around the ship changed").

I don't honestly think there is a legal or ethical obstacle to changing the visual model by adding depth charges (while respecting your opinion regarding the aesthetics thereof). That said, it is a little hard to discuss this because WG has not (despite my earnest efforts to request an answer) really stated why the depth charges have not been added to the Okhotnik. This inability to interfere with the model was not mentioned, but then again no real reason was given, so...

I don't think they would do that, as that is the kind of "confusion" that WG has stated they want to avoid. In fact, I remember hearing that they might have actually added visual depth charges to DDs in the distant past, but I'm not sure about that or might have misunderstood the matter.

Well I have to respect that. I doubt a lot of people will see things the same way, but good to know that there is at least one.

Don't be like that. He/she is selflessly protecting us Okhotnik owners from being shafted by altering the beautiful and totally historical appearance of our ship in order to add ASW capability.

WG has already taught us that there is no end of weapons that can be added to any part of the Okhotnik.

There are no outliers except for Okhotnik, or at I am not aware of any (the Cossack B and Sims B not having them has been confirmed as a mistake that will be fixed).

I will indeed keep trying. Not because I will be succesful (I might!) but because I'm not going to let them off the hook on this. They nerfed a premium, something they promised not to do. Pepperidge farm remembers.

I have the Yolo, I can recommend it... hesitantly. It's a fun, but quite stressful/intense ship to play, and requires IMO significantly more effort to do well in than something like a Jutland. You are neither a good farmer (lacking the DPM) or cap contester due to bad concealment, so you have to constantly try and outplay more stealthy dds and look for the right spots or opportunities to ambush BBs/cruisers. It is definetely not a ship that you will play every day, or when you feel like mindless fun.

Potentially, yes. That said, it would be IMO quite difficult to pursue in court or in front of a consumer dispute resolution board unless they had made a very clear commitment not to worsen a product (I say this from a professional POV, I am not arguing whether this is a good or a bad thing). In this case they have made an undertaking not to nerf premiums, so an actual nerf might be something you could have a case to pursue with.

Bro, I'm a contract lawyer. I have no illusions about my legal rights in the matter, or whether it's worth pursuing them. The only weapons I have are community pressure and some decayed commitment to the principles of fair play and community interaction that WG might still have left, so I am deploying them. Do you have a better idea?

Well, we kind of got one and it was pretty much nonsense. We have to keep up the pressure here, at the very least I want a real explanation as to why Okhotnik is being nerfed, not this "we are closely monitoring blah blah blah" doublespeak.

That is not an answer. There is, again as far as I know, one single DD at T5+ that does not have depth charges. This is a nerf to that premium. I want to know why.

No they didn't. They made a soft promise not to nerf premiums. They have never, as far as I know, intimated or said they will not otherwise alter premiums. If you disagree, can you please cite a link or post where they said anything of the kind?

I have already explained (at more length in the other thread) why it needs to be; because literally every other DD at T5+ (based on current information) will have depth charges, and that essentially means a massive nerf to a premium ship. edit: as for the model, you are really reaching here. I dare you to find an Okhotnik captain who is upset that their beautiful ship will be defaced by adding more weapons to it, for the "small" tradeoff of being able to fight submarines.

What exactly is your point? I am not saying that WG made false promises in its sub messaging. I don't care about that. I'm saying that they nerfed a premium ship that I love and have paid for. Your link/image has nothing to do with that.

Sure re mines - I was just participating in your argument without believing in it, so my bad for that - one should not discuss in bad faith. My real position is that talking about IRL in the context of this game is not a good starting point for a discussion. As for the model, the model can be changed. I don't understand how that's a reason for either having or not having something in the game.

I know bro :/. I'm still suspecting that they just forgot about the Okhotnik and are covering up because they have nothing else to say/dont want to put in the dev work to fix it, but it could also be an on purpose nerf... I just fail to understand why. I can think of no possible reason to nerf the Okhotnik, particularly with regards to ASW capability.