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I agree that the stealth advantage (should you call it that) is mainly due to "breaking the other ships stealth". But what I often do is dump a fighter near the enemy CV... what advantage? Wish! usually there's another one there, negating any advantage that might have. True. But mostly they need to strike "lengthwise". While this is true, it is not IMo 'stealth', but related to spotting. See, that's spotting. Hell no. I reset plenty caps in BB/CA while remaining unspotted. I also do it long-distance (Conqkek) and risk nothing much there. It's not like I have to be spotted or near the cap to put a shell into whatever is in it. If CV loses planes (he spends them anyway) it means a delay not used for making DMG. Which is bad for the CV, too. But that is spotting advantage, not stealth. Yes I'm quite sure the both of us could come up with something better, more fair and more fun than WG has managed to produce. Now indeed let's get some snowflakes knocked off so we can get the next OP Smolensk/ Stalingrad/Op ship... ehhhe...uuhh... BOTH GUILTY AS CHARGED

Actually they DO affect your RoF, as you need to go back with more planes after the first ones are spent. THEN you really notice the importance of positioning and target selection. (in Furious for example, it doesn't matter that much).

Also, the most broken thing is the AP bombs - Kaga doesn't get those, but Enterprise did. This makes (made?) Enterprise... well... ultra-broken?

Consider Ark Royal, too. It is T6 but also half-price. I'm a big fan though so maybe "slightly biased".

Self-knowledge leads to true wisdom...

That is actually still what I do. Killing DDs is just a sideshow, really. It is NOT what CVs score huge damage with. And since this game is all about damage, chasing DDs is just a "necessary evil". Of course it is also WG being backward... you cannot directly counter the other CV. Well, actually you can, a bit... drop a fighter just outside his AA range... spotting him...

I dunno if the enemy CV sucked in this case. He knew perfectly well that plopping fighters over that Venezia at the end would win the game for sure. Must have been a smart one. He also may have killed the JB, I didn't check.

I still don't see the stealth there. The planes are visible. But. Yes the scouting thing is OP indeed. But this is unrelated to stealth, IMO. Yes it will. Also, you detect a DD only at 2.5k if he's smart. And using island cover helps. I cannot torp a ship from the left side if he hugs the island (torps do not arm). Also, there's no way I can hit rockets if coming from that side, but that might be me potatoeing. What happens is I aim for the ship but due to having to come down from the mountain, I'll be too late. This is only because a CV can spot for himself. Any DD, CA or BB can reset caps. And they do not suffer plane losses. One shell will do. Backspamming BBs and islandhugging cruisers have the same thing. Be unseen... be unmolested. I once spammed 3 BBs to death in Neptune. Nobody ever saw me do it. Ended with 100% HP. Granted if they had seen me I'd be back in port soon, but CV has that same problem. As in "yes we can" (but we will not..) Ahahahah but how is that related to "it is always the CVs fault"? You are quite a good CV player, curious what your opinion is about the replay. (and I am sure we g quite agree that some stuff really... ehh... could be better... regarding Cvs).

No it wouldn't matter really. The problem IS the even/uneven tiers. Now they have to balance CVs across more tiers than usual. The thing is, if they had a T7 CV they could balance it in T7 and give it +/- 1 tier. It would be GIVING THE SHIPS +/- 1 tier CV... now the ships always get +/1 2 tier CV. And that CV still performs at +2, so when you are a T6 and t you get a T8 CV... he actually also performs at T10... guess what that means.

Mate, I usually div up with T7 Sims in my T6 Ark Royal. What do you think happens when we get a T9 match? Well... I still can crap all over enemy ships. Yes a T6 CV with T4 planes, the only reason I do not get much more than 50k in those games are that : - it is usually a ROFLSTOMP once the first ship dies (10-12 minutes, and my planes are not that fast + large map); - T9 ships being far more fireproof than T8, T7, T6 and even T5... (if they gave me AP bombs... oh wait.. they'd not pen..); - T9 ships having better torpedo protection and thicker armour. I can still set fires (even though T9 ships have less firechance and usually BoS or something). So far haven't had a long lasting match in T9. Once it gets going, it ends quickly. But I'd like to take Ark Royal to T10, crap on some Minotaurs and Smolensks and then send that to Jingles.

Depends. Say he does drop his fighters as well, you'll (both) have as many plane kills as there were fighters. If you do not use them at all, you get no kills. It's still (profitable) damage... Some of those things aren't really true... Stealth, doubtful. Your planes get detected from 10k or so, the hull isn't any better. But you can hide, there's no reason to expose the hull. Unavoidable damage potential? If it is unavoidable then it is not really potential. You'll still have to hit, first. Decapping can't be done by shooting/bombing. Resetting yes. Decapping no. HP pool is not that impressive. Can get blapped by BB no problem, it is just a fat cruiser. The rest of it, yes agree. 100 in all CVs combined is not enough by far to get to their true potential. It is about 10 matches per CV.

Correct. Also, it doesn't mean it is always the highest scoring ship. Once you have the skill for it, it will be though. I think my IJN CVs will be the most OP thing. The Ark Royal is gonna be a challenge, but is also OP A.F.

On a side note.... https://wows-numbers.com/ship/3751786448,Ark-Royal/?order=battles__desc#leaderboard (you need to put in amount to Git Gud, they said...) well OK....

I'll sometimes drive my CV into the channel on that "speciul map"... (OK the other choices are borderhugging or behind that island which everybody know you'll be).

Your fighter cover will just shoot down the last 4 attacking planes... if he doesn't press F. The first blow will be delivered, guaranteed. Better put them somewhere so they spot what is coming to your DD. They'll be useful even if he has to smoke up.

Not just the CV player... BTW I get that about 20% of the time (teams are so bad...), but they only get me maybe 1/10th when that happens. My team causes the occasion though - and then it is up to me to detect them and kill them. If there's two (and they bring a cruiser) then sometimes I have to run, that is when there's a chance I get blapped. Of course it is the CVs fault to get surprised like that (if that one "escaped" DD kills you...). Yes agree. That is why I say must be more careful. IMO it is a "sh... happens" thing. You cannot watch them all... or maybe you can, just not at the same time. Is that a fault, or did the reds get lucky? I dunno about that. Autopilot changes the route without you being aware. It is also the thing that even if you notice it (press F!!) then the inevitable might already have happened. Especially if you have a tight situation. You know, where you need to kill the DD from situation 1. Meh, everyone has the talent to potato, fatfinger or FF-up in some sort of way.

Alrrighty then.... here goes.... remember this is 100/100 perfect hindsight. 1 - first three minutes you were spotting, result, only Amalfi went to sniff at cap, the rest ignored it, sort of. You shoot at undetected DD in smoke. --> I'd have hit that Hindenburg for 5 K. Three minutes, the match might last 10 if they (or the enemy) throw it. Take advantage. 2 - Then torps, you throw a few at a DD (?) and then at Cleveland. --> Cleveland is good target, but looks like you 'took the occasion'. Camper Cleve, hmmm tasty. Try to plan where you put torps, don't waste them. Torps are a valuable damage maker. 3 - You take the rockets again, kill Lightning and get a good whack at Yue Yang with the last 3. --> now that is a good example of how it should be done. 4 -- Now the AP bombers come out. You spot a glimpse of the low HP Cleveland, and you take him out. Good. Then you do a bit of spotting for that Yue-Yang. Would you get him with AP-bombers? Hmmm.. Note that Amalfi from first 3 minutes has found 2 friends, after you chased out Yue-Yang. They are capping! --> That is YOUR action making that cap possible, good. I dunno, maybe smack rest of the bombs on some BB? 5 - Torpedo planes now. You fly to A. there are Hindy, Tirpitz and an Italian cruiser (who is running). --> That is what I'd have done. Better to keep that mountain between you and Hindy, he now sees you, his AA goes dakka too. Also he turns in and avoids the torps. Bismarck gets two. Last torps you throw after the running Italian cruiser. That was sort of good... right choice of targets, the execution of the attack could be improved. Only 2 hits. On a side note: why do those three, Amalfi and friends still not have B cap. Yue-Yang? 6 - now, rockets. You go for the red Jean Bart. Send a whole load into him, plenty damage. Good? --> but he was burning in 2 places, and your own JB was killing him already. Hmm. That was a bit naughty. Well OK you had 25k after 10 minutes, you need the damage. But that Venezia might have been better target. After that you go for this Venezia and their Amalfi. Well, when you come to Amalfi only 1 plane still launches, but hey. Aside from ripping your teammate off a bit with JB that was an OK attack. But Captain Hindsight says: better take Venezia and Amalfi. 7 - AP bombers to the rescue! Obvious target: Tirpitz. He's coming for you? Going straight into AP-bombers? DERPITZ ALERT! --> Good execution. 5 citadels and a kill. Was he trying to attack a CV? He had it coming. ROFLOL. MORE OF THAT PLZ. 8 - Torps on the Venezia. --> you fly straight towards him, he has no trouble avoiding the first load. Second load you put in from ~behind, and he also avoids that. Torp attacks are not your strong point, best you take them from the side or wait until they are turning (best target: he sits camping...). Furthermore, your team is behind on points. The Venezia is sailing towards your JB... I think the JB will win a 1 on 1 fight. But their Amalfi and Hindenburg are taking your B-cap. I'd have gone for the Amalfi (seems he has crashed onto the island, too). 9 - Venezia gets it again, now AP bombs. The enemy Graf Zep has put planes above him though. Meanwhile the JB sort of potatoes and gets killed by Amalfi and Hindy. You now need to kill that Venezia, or he will take your last cap, and "you are the last hope". You drop AP on the Venezia and hit him hard but he's not dead yet. Problem. 10 - attack on Venezia but now he has smoke, and GZ has dropped a squad on him. All your planes die. 11 - Torpedo attack on Venezia. All miss. Bummer. 12 - last rocket attack on Venezia (good hit, but game ends). Concluding: FIRST: You got >>100k and 3 kills. Now that is a respectable game in any way. It certainly is not potato. There are a few things that you could have done better, you got two torp hits on Tirpitz and some on Cleveland, but most miss. Also, the first 3 minutes were wasted, sort of. You didn't get "your moneys worth" from that first fly-out. You might even have won the game if you were better with torps... but I'd have to check what your teammates did. Doesn't appear to me they did all that great and certainly you cannot be expected to kill 5. Because that is what it would have taken, after that Tirpitz you'd have needed to kill Amalfi and Hindenburg. Could you have done it? if you had, it would have been a notable 200K 5-kill mega-carry worthy of Youtube. Maybe that JB would have been dead anyway and you'd have needed Venezia dead too ( 6 kills and 250K). Oh my lord. The guy giving your position to the enemy was the Brindisi. I didn't see him performing very well... he's an a-hole. Or maybe he just hates you, I dunno. Well... I'd have understood if it was the JB, but anyway it's unfair and against rules. In hindsight (which is always 100%) there are some things that could have been better, yes. But... that is easy to say, when in battle you sometimes do not see all what is happening. Also, you cannot know what your teammates are thinking. Sometimes they also potato... Verdict: Sometimes you just cannot carry all these potatoes. Even when you're quite good with the AP-bombers. You can carry a few more if you get better at torping... But win this? NOPE. Could I have? Me? NOOOO WAYYYYYY. I'd say a small chance Masterrrr @El2aZeR would have won it. He can pull lots of potatoes. So final verdict: ALWAYS BLAME THE DONKEY!

There's basically 3 ways a CV can get killed. Or 4, but the fourth is when the CV is the last ship left-over. 1. The team lets a DD go... ...past half the map, undetected, and yes that happens. Then the CV has to (if he's lucky) detect him in time, kill him or eat torps. I've had such teams my CV (at the rear of the map) was attacked by 2 Dds and a cruiser. Even a BB but he wasn't fast enough. Usually happens (but not only then) in maps where you have two bases. Team lemmings clockwise, other team does that as well. 2. CV takes too much risk (for example: following the lemming train)... ....and gets detected broadside, gets blapped by BB. Not much to do about that except be more careful. 3. CV parks behind island. Well... at least he tried. But WG automated steering sends him elsewhere. ... can be the drunk autopilot makes a complete circle around the island. Or rams it. Usually the CV driver will find this out, but the thing is, can he still fix it. Or does it get even worse. The thing is, you plot a route on the map, but sometimes the autopilot changes this route. He can decide all kinds of stupid stuff. Like, you are behind the island, think "OK that's that". Then what happens. Autopilot feels CV should be at left side behind island, not right side... starts going reverse... Can be. See #2 above. I never get decreased karma. At zero all the time. ZERO-karma-ing like a BOSS. If a CV would do 200K+ every match, well OK then you'd be correct. But that's not the case. CV cannot influence a match that much. Bordercamping BBs have much more influence... if your team has such, and enemy has non-campers, CV will not save you even if he is good. And even if he is bad the enemy CV will kill all your border-camping BBs no problem. PS: player skills always make a ship OP. I've seen some that were carrying in the most unlikely ships.

True, the challenge for CV-play is not to have a better WR than a BB player. The challenge IMO is to see if you can do better than other CV-players, in the same CV. Or of you can outperform other CVs that have better damage numbers. The fun in it is that you are like the ENDBOSS playing against a team that ALSO has such and endboss. I'll never claim CVs are 'balanced'. Mostly they are "equalised" regarding damage numbers. That is, you can do the same d kind of damage in a BB or a DD or a good CL/CA. No longer sure the CV is topping the scoreboard at the end of the match. BTW that is the challenge for me. I want to get Ark Royal to 100K average. Doubtful if it will work... but can try.

Which just means nobody else could be arsed to go look for that Asashio, and you / your team thought the CV should go do it. If it were any kind of competitive mode, I think he would. But you are missing a point. CV needs credits as well to "break even". The rest of your team can do it as well. CRUISERS are a lot better performing that task, and so are other DDs. So. Yes a CV can do it, but that Asashio is a mean bugger. He can chew through a lot of planes pretty fast. Depending on where my CV was (and what CV I had) I'd do it or not. In Ark Royal, doubtful if I'd do it, depending on distance. Say it was kinda close, that Asashio would get it. I'd need more flights out than one though so it would cost me a lot of time. Less so in Furious or other RN. In US CV, distance is less of a problem, and it also has quite ideal weapons to get that DD. Probably I would do it. But IJN CV, doubtful if I'd do it: the AP bombs will not do, the torpedoes also not, leaves the rockets. And they are not the most powerful weapon, also, if the DD "jiggles" and I have to re-adjust, most rockets will miss. Doubtful if I'd kill him. Would need assistance from team. Would I get any, or would those "scaredy BBs" go "right good luck with that, N00b CV" and just not give a flying F? Correct. BUT there's the thing. If the DD decides he'll sell his life as dear as possible, he might keep the CV busy for at least 5 minutes. Which means 25% of the game he takes the CV out, saving the team from at least 25K damage, and saving the rest of his team from being spotted. Usually it is the other way around though. Seems like the whole team now decides the CV must be the one to take out the DDs. Other DDs and cruisers are far better equipped to take out DDs though. That's the thing eh. And why-the-hell is everyone looking at the CV for dealing with DDs. Almost seems like it is a chore that some other classes will gladly put on the CV. If teams wouldn't crumble like cookies I'd have 90k average in Ark Royal. Now I usually have to help them do the jobs that they neglect, but no problem, I can adapt. But CV cannot do everything at the same time - you cannot carry 11 potatoes. Which means if team decides to throw it it will end in a ROFLSTOMP anyway. Oh wait. There's also when the other team crumbles like cookies. Then if I have a team that is any good it ends in a ROFLSTOMP, and I end up with meagre damage. Which can, of course, also not be prevented by the red CV. You cannot carry a whole team in a CV. But (if same tier) at end game if you're not top 3, well... you've not tried hard enough.

Main thing with the IJN (in my opinion) is that they are actually able to influence matches a bit more. This is because of the AP-bombs and the harder hitting torps. You CAN actually kill a ship. Of course you can do it with RN, but you can NOT kill low-health ships like you can with AP. I often drop on (for example) a 25% BB. What happens, he negates the fire... or uses DCP... and heals. If in IJN CV, he just gets blapped. Meaning, RN cannot actually "take out" anything except DDs. The last thing is sort of untrue. I do not play DDs much or at all (they are a bit too quick for me... I get a headache). However I DO KNOW how those DDs make my life more miserable. And I know how they make it easy for me. So, even if I do not play DDs at all, I can tell you which things are smart and which are stupid. But... counterplay... UNLESS that DD is trying to sink the CV, there is not really "counterplay". All WG gives is "O-sector"and some "DEF-AA" pacifier-buttons. Counterplay is like "do not sail in straight line" for BBs against DD, as you cannot actually shoot torpedoes... You might actually be better as a CV-player than you'd like. Seriously, if you know what every ship can do and cannot do - you are a better CV player.

Shows to me your stats are ABOVE average mate. Look: 53% WR, and over 10K more damage than the average Shokaku player. That is definately not bad at all. I like the RN CVs, particularly the Ark Royal - because it is difficult to get large damage numbers in it (slow planes... and DoT). Means you have to think about which one to hit next, can you get a perma-fire/flood? But you'll have time to think... So there's the challenge for me, can I get 200K and raise the average to near 100k... well we'll see. Your stats in Skokek aren't that different from mine in Ark Royal, WR a bit over 50% and good fat damage. But I know that against almost any other CV I'm gonna do better than him, and will usually end up in top 3. So, I concluded I'm at least not bad. If I'm any good, well, depends what I get. Can't carry 11 potatoes that's for sure. Here's what I have done so far in T6 Ryujo. Man those AP-bombs and hard-hitting torps... I wonder what Shokek is gonna be like. I know a better one. Tattoo should read INSTANT ZERO KARMA.

It does work though. I'm mildly competent CV-player, but some DDs I cannot kill even if I do 3 flights out (and multiple attacks on those flights). Yes indeed, they manage to avoid getting killed even when spotted by me, fired upon by my teammates, and attacked by rockets and bombs. Of course when I do REALLY want him dead, he will die. But same thing when I am in a BB and a DD wants me dead. He will keep me spotted, spam torps, and his teammates will do the rest. There is a difference: if I move back to the end of the map, or past teammates, that DD will probably not follow me. I do agree it is broken, and lots of things could be made better. Also, simple: CV is BOSS so you have to take it like a boss.

Depends what CV you have if you can outmaneuver the rockets. On IJN CV the aim goes off really bad when they have to adjust in the last phase. But good luck on that if it is Ark Royal... has a LOAD of rockets so always gets in 4-6.

If you want to help the DD, you CAN leave fighters - but leave them at the ENEMY SIDE of the cap. This will provide spotting for the DD (if he is smoked up) and warn him if something is coming. I usually play with a DD div-mate in my CV, should hear him laugh when he spams a BB or CL to death, which I have spotted. Fav div: T6CV + T7Sims + (smoke)cruiser...