ForlornSailor

If there is a serious Q&A to the WG devs, im sure to bring that question up. Like thats gonna happen. But seriously, this whole AA and the interaction with the CV has spun so far out of control, there is, imo, no easy fix for this. A complete rework of the entire AA-Balancing is in need. This also means, all ships need to have a more similar AA-strenght, with DDs and BBs obviously haveing lower DPM then Cruisers - after all, they are suppose to be the counter to CVs. Then make it so, that AA actually combines and remove the RNG-factor of the AA. Its simply stupid for both players, that sometimes, I can drop the entire squad of planes by the time he gets to 5 km towards me, then the next squad comes and I shoot the first plane down, just after the CV dropped. How did anyone think this was a good idea or fun for anyone?

Yep. put words in my mouth to discredit me. On the contrary - you proved my point, that you didnt read. well done! Also - the one ignoring and looking one sided at things is you. Pretty much you called everyone NOT playing in a division of 3 Des Moines bad players. wow, if thats not arrogant then what is? And about what you are missing here. Lets see. How about a Enterprise meets 4 Missouri, 5 Des Moines and 2 Kidd. All of them are specced to AA, all of them have 19 points captain, they are all in Divisions and they cover each other perfectly. CV gonna say: challenge accepted? ye right. But thats your perfect world dude, read your own words. nuff said... In many cases its more like WG made the choice for us. Cruisers cant slot Hydro and Def AA at the same time. Why not? WG playing around with it on DoY felt like a slap in the face to me - as in "oh they do had the idea to make it available both". Also, the way AA works is just plain stupid. Some AA-monsters out there. Game loads - good CV player checks ships "hmm... Des Moines..nah...Minotaur..better not... Hello *put ship with lowest AA here*. The DPM WG is giving to some ships is hilarious nowadays. Older ships like Atago are a joke. And they are not made for giving up Hydro for Def AA, its limiting the ship even further if you do. And then again you might go with Def AA into a game with 0 CVs and 5 DDs. Congratz, you just shot your own foot. twice.

Any more "pro-tips"? Did you even read what ppl did say? You are like missing the point so far, you´d could travel to the moon and back and still could have some extra miles left.

Exactly my thought.

Ah the Santa Maria Manuela. Saw her this year in Turku, when we docked in on Sedov. I would upload a pic but the forum is messy right now. On of the more known ships, that I have been on, was the Estonia, that sunk 1994 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Estonia

My thoughts exactly. Its like the rare games without DDs or one side without DD. A confused group off ppl cuddeling in the spawn, not knowing what to do when nobody leads the way. Which is funny, cuz I somehow have the feelings, those are the same players, that will turn their BB fullspeed to D when the only DD is headding A. And then blame the DD 2 mins later. Much of the CV-whine equals to the Torp-whine. In my quest of watching idiots, that show their talent (or better: lack of) on twitch, I came across this 2 days ago: A T8 BB div of 2 guys. They are in TS with 2 other guys from the same clan. They also play 2 T8 BBs. They count in. They get on the same team. I get my popcorn. They sail broadside in a line of 4 towards the map border - a DD gets spotted 5 km next to them. Not even ONE of them cares. They all get hit by torps, the twitcher sinks. Now, get this. His comment: OH SH!T F4KK I KNEW (!!!!) THEY WERE COMING. He didnt touch WASD tho. Bottomline: Stupid ppl gonna be stupid. And they like to complain.

Once again, CommanderPiPi knows everything.

I wonder how ppl can reply "no!" to this. You really want to claim, that it doesnt and can not under any circumstance exist? Impossible. @siramra there is the famous "X" from the modpack. It will give you all the tools to shoot at the position, where a smoked up ship was detected the last time. By spraying a little on that direction, especially with a fast reloading ship, its possible to even trace the movement of that ship in the smoke, if you have experiance doing this. As to cheats - who knows whats around. Ive had - very few, granted - occasions, which I couldnt explain either. Only recently I got 2 very very odd hits in the same round, on first I thought, it have been different enemys doing it. Watched the replay and had to notice - it was infact the same guy doing it. So yea.

Thanks for the time you put into reasearching. Now atleast this mystery is solved and I can retire one of my several tin-foil-hats :D

So here would be the screens with my damage. Looking at it now, I also count like 4 pens that did 0 dmg - salvo 2 and salvo 4. But not as bad as D-Fens I´d say.

Yea, ofc everybody aims & hits a little bit different. Funny enough, we are really close to each other in that example. I think im gonna run my replay later and add the screens from my hits for the lols. Then again, there is no real guarentee that what we see is really whats happening. @wilkatis_LV was doing some testing about that lately - do you already have results btw? So we will never know.

Possible, but: First - it does show up if you incapacitate modules, like AA / Torpedotubes / w.e. Now ofc, if you only partially damaged the module and did not destroy it - not sure how that shows up. which brings me to: Second - If you incapacitate bigger modules (torpedotubes, engine and rudder im sure), they dont show up as penetration. Im 99% sure of that. Often my first shots are DDs and my usual lucks brings me 0 dmg but 2 incapacitations. Happens all the time. My ribbon count then states something like: 0 hits, 0 dmg, 1 defended, 2 Incapacitations. again, doesnt explain what happened here cuz <-- Fiji aswell. French cruisers do have a blackhole in their sides, thats true tho...

impossible. I did perfect fine hits on same target at same time. problem not solved...

Exactly my thoughts. You are talking to the wrong ppl @Migulaitor. Not that I disagree with anything you say or dont appriciate your efford.. its just... yea... special ppl are too special to read the forums or get knowledge from other sources.

Exactly this. I was like WTF is going on now! Just bad... very bad.

Yes, it does matter very much. Read the first post: the problem initially is the skill difference of CVs and that there are stupid teammates, that YOU cant control. If I could control all 12 players on my side - things are totaly different. Also: If I would have a way to know, that thtere is a CV or not in the next round, I could use Def AA instead of Hydro. Vive Versa if I could know, that next round, there are no DDs. Problem here: Cruisers have to chose. Its stupid. They should have both consumables. Difference is - in sports I chose with whom I play. I play together with them all the time. In any other MMO I have the same option - only here i cant :)

Then again, its 1 player controlling all those units. Thus comparing impact on the game is useless, since the skill is the same (and difference of skill is the starting point of the discussion) So yea, that example doesnt make sense from any angle.

Are we not there already? BBs that have better concealment then Cruisers, better turningcircle, nearly same speed. Those would bee the disadvantages a BB should have against Cruiser. Oh wait - it used to be like this, but its been watered down more and more until we are left with total absurd things like Moskva vs Conqueror (concealment) or Conqueror vs Zao (Fire potential) or Missouri vs any Radar Cruiser or... Sorry, but balancing means exactly this. If balancing doesnt stand for this in your opinion - then what does it stand for?

I just had to quote this for truth and make it bold. Ive come across many discussion in this forum, where ppl will bend the reality, by either projecting enemy team as perfect or their teammates as perfect or vice versa (whatever did suit their agenda at that moment) to prove a point - not at all limited to CV-discussion. All this talk about a perfect world where every player will make the perfect decission every time is really futile, cuz it just dont happen. It was basicly what I was trying to say, you just found the better words to describe it :)

Judging by their stats, this is obviously the explanation for what I had to witness. But you know, this goes hand in hand. You are not a potato out of coincidence, so to say, rather there are reasons, why they are potatoes. And how those guys handled the presence of a CV is one of those reasons. Oh yea I agree. This was the least stupid of the three examples, and I gotta say - we actually won that round despite all the odds. The map was trap and the three stooges BBs went to A and from there into the enemy spawn. Needless to say the CV did make his way behind C, so they would have never caught him. Also, a Montana-Division was in B, blocking the rest of our fleet from helping them. If they would have focused B first, I would have happily provided AA for them (me = Moskva). But I had no chance then to hide behind B. Luckily, that round we had a decent CV and he understood, that the enemy CV has only 1 place left to go in that situation. So he actually spotted him for us guys in the south to shoot him.

He has a point if u focus on this statement and combine it with: I had a really really bad streak yesterday, where as I had every round a T10 CV in the game and seriously every time the enemy CV was awesome (checked WR - in ranges from 65 to 90% WR!) while my best was, if i recall, a 51% guy?. And every single time I told my team right at the start, that we are up against a VERY dangerous CV. Whats the stuff that I see? A Mogami rushing alone in the cap - I scream to him, to stop this, CV will kill him. Not even 30 sec later he got send to port - by CV. Next round all the BBs wander off in different directions. Was fun seeing Bismark, Tirpitz and Izumo getting deleted one by one with each wave of the CV. Another round - 3 BBs (2x T10 + T9) circle the map into enemy spawn, hunting that CV. A shima leading them. The CV again had fun deleting them. What I dont understand: why does this keep happening? Its like you would watch a traincrossing and people just keep walking ahead of incoming trains, piling up dead bodys next to the track. Just to see 5 mins later more ppl walking carelessly ahead of the next incoming train. How can you not change your playstyle when there is a CV around? Why do you put yourself into positions, where its the easiest thing on earth to delete you? This must be a constant thing for those guys i decribed in my examples from yesterday - so why the eff do they keep on doing it? There were ppl with 2000 to 8000 games among them (ye I had fun checking those ppls stats) - then I wonder, how often have they been deleted from CVs cuz they played stupid? If you´d guess hundreds of times - I wouldnt even say thats unlikely. So how come ppl cant learn? Its totaly beyond me.

Yea, i stumbled over his remark also. Its your first lowtier DD, eh @clocky

However, what you did not take into account: Conq will not meet TXI or TXII ships, but GC will meet TV and TVI regulary. In addition to that, Conq has always TIX to shoot at and usualy TVIII aswell, making it more easy to set fires. In addition to the reload mod, Conq is cleary the better firestarter in reality.

That would be 1 decent + 1 afk vs 2 flying potatoes. You are right, I forgot that combo. Although im sure it wasnt fun for those 2

Fun for whom? Certainly not for the decent CV, that is paired with someone, that doesnt start any plane 5 mins into the game and is thus 1 vs 2. Also not for the remaining 20 surfaceships (minus the occasional AA-speced Cruiser, which are very rare on those Tiers anyway). So what stays? Fun for the decent 2 CVs that get paired against 1 or 2 low-skilled-CVs? Or the rare occasion, matchmaking finds 4 equally skilled CVs (although not all of those 4 will call that "fun"). I can think of even more "reasons" why CVs get reported.