DFens_666

Dont skip any ship! You will need the experience to play on hightiers. In general it would be advisable to play several hundred battles low/midtier with all classes/nations to get a feel for the game. Its not that simple as it looks, and playing hightiers too early usually ends up in a bad experience. Actually, nevermind if you are playing Coop only. I had a look at your stats. Still, you shouldnt skip the ships itself, you could/should use the FreeXP to unlock the modules which leads to the next ship (B-Hulls and such). But that isnt necessary either if you play coop. Nagato and Amagi have good/accurate guns, if you liked Fuso, you should like them even more. Izumo was usually the turd in the line, but it got buffed now, so it should be more enjoyable. For the "British freeXP thingy" i guess you mean Nelson. Nelson isnt really easy to play. it has a huge citadel, and if you meet the wrong opponents you can get overmatched easily. Imo not a ship for beginner. But in the right hands, Nelson is really strong.

It performs better than old RTS CVs. I dont think ive ever seen someone with 200k average damage over a significant amount of battles. Somehow, its possible to deal that high consistent damage, and that is what i was going for. Others can potentially follow. Ive never claimed that all CVs are balanced/OP/UP, but he claimed, that CVs are nerfed to the ground - i have a hard time believing that for Midway. Also ive looked at Lexington, and the best players match the best players in BBs so... Cant speak for the worst players, as i cant get that data, but it is clear, that people who are bad with new CVs will struggle to deal any damage ever, they die to AA flak bursts or are simply bad at making good drops (ive seen people dropping torps like bombs directly ontop of the ship ). Unlike RTS CVs, where even potato CV players managed to deal some damage always by simply clicking on the target. Im not denying that there are problems with CVs. The biggest is and always was 2 tier difference. But this is not for CVs only, it goes both ways. Many times CV players seem to "forget" that, they only moan about being -2, but if other ships are -2 then its fine for them. And thats clearly wrong. You do know thats what WG said themselves? They specifically said "CVs should pick their targets carefully". If you dont like it - dont play it ?! Im simply accepting how WG sees CVs. If you wont, then thats your choice. Because similiar problems existed before, they have nothing to do with new CVs. WG never bothered with it, why would they now? Either they dont care, or it is how it should be. If you would have followed the discussion over the last couple of months, you would know that many good/experienced players have said exactly that (myself included btw) - New CV gameplay is repetetive and boring. The only fun part is continously striking targets (otherwise you are flying around looking at the scenery) - WG said they wanted CVs to have less impact on the game. That means less spotting and/or damage. The spotting part failed hard initially, and they made changes (i wont debate whether they are right or wrong, im just stating what happened, before i get flamed again). But if you could strike any target at will, the impact would still be too large -> so you should focus on isolated targets. - They also wanted to increase CV playerbase, however, this wont work with how CVs are supposed to be according to WG. "Noone" (except for some hardcore fans like RTS CVs) wants to play CVs like that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ You are simply looking at something, which WG doesnt want to be. You are saying the EXACT opposite to what WG is saying. Might aswell accept that

But you do understand this could happen to RTS CVs aswell? Like, not being able to do anything. Even worse if both CV players were equally skilled, they were busy with each other. And ofc if one CV player was horrendously bad, then he couldnt do anything after 5 mins because he was deplaned. Should i say now: You dont know what you are talking about, since i get told that all the time aswell? Btw best midway player last 7 days (all Solo) Looks far from "nerfed to the ground" to me. Actually much worse than RTS CVs http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20190223/eu_week/ranking_ship_us.html Even the best Lexington players beat CAs/BBs in damage... except Massachusetts which is probably a bit too strong. Atleast they are in even terms with BBs, they are definetely not worse.

Ok, im a noob, i have no idea what im saying in regard of CVs. Please dont make life easier for CVs as i asked for in the thread (15 upvotes - some of them who are pro CV guys) https://forum.worldofwarships.eu/topic/113339-standardized-planes-and-quasi-restricted-matchmaking-for-cvs/?tab=comments#comment-2864257 Also PLEASE dont make it easier for CVs if they are lowtier -2, because i dont have a clue what im saying. Its obvious im wrong. But kinda bad tho, MrConway said he liked it and it will forward my proposal... kinda sucks for you CV guys i guess /s Try to find where i said "CVs are OP" Well, ill admit that, i said Hakuryu was OP upon rework... Guess i need to be lapidated for that

1. Because it would be easy, but you result to Insults only, thus not invalidating his/our claims. Only because someone has less experience, doesnt mean he cant be right... funny isnt it? Or you wanna tell me, if someone who has never driven a car says, you should drive within the speed limit he would be wrong because he doesnt drive a car? 2. You claiming he makes anti-CV posts doesnt make it more true. Here im gonna showcase how you bend your reality - @hgbn_dk and @sgtmarple - you upvoted his post, you will be proven what his real agenda is, please take note: https://forum.worldofwarships.eu/topic/113654-hotfix-3-a-consumer-view-shokaku-viii/?do=findComment&comment=2874947 This was my only post in this thread, i was not talking about CVs, infact i didnt say/write anything, to which RAYvenMP responded with https://forum.worldofwarships.eu/topic/113654-hotfix-3-a-consumer-view-shokaku-viii/?do=findComment&comment=2875144 He is resulting to personal attacks, DESPITE THE FACT that i didnt say ANYTHING against/about CVs. 3. You havent provided a single fact in your last 10+ posts by looking at your profile. Again, you claiming something doesnt make it more true. Everyone can see that you result to personal attacks most of the time. Your claim would be true if every person would only be allowed to have 1 account only. Funny thing is, you attack me despite me actually playing CVs. Somehow you must have realized that, which doesnt stop you from attacking me. Oh and btw, ive made several suggestions PRO CVs (again, this can be looked up in my history). But you simply doesnt understand our position: You think I hate CVs - which i dont. But i can still dislike the rework, because it made the game less fun to me overall. 4.

So your personal average damage with Shimakaze is 160k? No, actually its not, its 40k Cant be that easy, otherwise your average damage would be higher. Average server stats dont support your claim Your own personal stats dont support your claim. 1 good game doesnt make it more valid, otherwise i will just show you a guy with 36 midway games in the last week with 240k average damage - good luck trying to beat that with your shimakaze

Well, then the problem is with you, not with the class. No DD deals more average damage (last week) than Hakuryu. Even most Cruisers are behind it. (Imo Zao/Henri are overbuffed now), and obviously Stalingrad cant be compared to other Cruisers. Midway has highest average damage only beaten by HE spam Conqueror, and steelships which are mostly played by very good players (Bourgogne even more than Stalingrad)

Should be very easy to counter someone who doesnt have a clue - question is, why dont you do it? You are telling us what kinda CV haters we are, and we have no clue blablub. So rather to argue against us, you resort to strawmen, ad hominem and straight up lying or making stuff up. Basicly that means: We are right and you know it, but you dont want to admit it, so you resort to above mentioned methods in order to undermine our position. Toptier CV demolishing enemy team = good, thats how its supposed to be Lowtier CV cant do much = bad, needs to change Imo an interesting logic if you think about it.

I usually havent put that much thought into, how things would turn out with +/-1 MM, because WG usually said they wont do it. Since we have a discussion thread now, why not do it. Ill base my answer on last weeks battles played on EU server from here: http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20190223/eu_week/average_ship.html So with +/-1 MM, T10 would only see T9 ships. T10 ships battles played 309878 T9 Ships battles played 140128 So what does that mean? Basicly all the T9 ships will be absorbed into T10 games. Rarely it might happen that MM would create a T8 game with a few T9 ships. In itself, this wouldnt even be bad, but if we go down the tiers now, imo it would create problems T8 ships battles played 273294 T7 ships battles played 198183 T7 would be constantly uptiered vs T8, because T8 is played much more than T9, which is already dragged into T10 matches. T7 uptiers far worse even against T8 (T7 BBs get overmatched, but cant overmatch T8 BBs, while T7 DDs dont have access to concealment module which T8 DDs have and Cruisers uptier badly most of the time anyway) than T8 vs T10. If you go down the tiers further, numbers drop ofc steadily (~200k T6 -> ~150k T5 -> ~110k T4). Imo in order for +/-1 MM to "work properly" we would need to have more T9 ships played compared to T10 ships - that will never happen. One might argue, that T9 will be played even less in such a MM, as they would be basicly facing T10 only. So from that pov, im against +/-1 MM.

I actually wonder about this more than anything else: EXP 1463 BB 1498 CA 1782 CV 1451 DD Because according to what CV players say, they wouldnt get any XP - seems kinda faulty to me

No, not only DD gameplay. I just dislike the meta Doesnt matter if i played CA/BB/DD - it was boring, sometimes even frustrating. If i wanna play wows and have fun i might only play OPs. And even those can be frustrating because of potatoes. KillerWhale is horrendous, people throw stars left and right, lucky they get their asses into the cap most of the time

Play BB They are superior in everything. - Good damage output - Can tank - Can even spot! last couple of matches i had 100k average spotting damage with GK They must be good spotters since they survive while being under pressure First need to get rid of any DD tho, then do what you want.

Since you are questioning what im saying, i can only guess you dont understand what im trying to say. You dont have to agree to what im saying, but since you are saying the same, i think its even more questionable. You dont like playing CVs because of how they are implemented... litereally what i said aswell. And other players can feel the same way, even if they arent playing CVs. I told you, i dont like the meta, you answered with "not my problem". Still doesnt change the fact that i dont like to play wows right now - and as i read forums / look around in my clan / see player numbers, there seem to be others agreeing with me here. If the CV rework would have had no impact on other classes, why were there not even 20k players online yesterday evening? If CVs are in a bad spot now -> fine with me, i dont have to play them. If other players have a problem with it, i can understand that. I still play them in operations tho. If DDs are in a bad spot -> im still fine with it, then i can just play Cruiser or BB. If other players have a problem with it, i can understand that. In either case, if they feel that they HAVE to play CV or DD, then i dont care about it, since they want to play the specific class for a certain reason, and they want it buffed for that same reason. But thats not whats bothering me. The game is boring right now. Its passive and camping, even when there are no CVs around. And certainly i blame the rework for it.

The balance is not 100% yet - WG said that several times. It might take 3 more months actually. And its a very thin line between too strong and too weak AA, especially since WG is going with 2 different interactions: One permanent DPS which effects every player good or bad, and Flak which mostly effects only bad players, since it can be dodged. So if you make it too weak, then good players can strike at impunity, while bad players cant achieve anything. To get a proper balance is extremely hard this way, especially by looking at each ship individually. There have been proposals around to migitate the effect of +/-2 MM for CVs, since its obvious WG wont switch to +/-1 MM. But something like that will take time even if they decide the community suggestions are good (which they might ignore anyway). We never know, IF they want to make it easier for ships which are -2 in a match, which goes for both CVs and surface ships.

So they force you to play this game? Interesting If you dont like it, you dont have to play it... its kinda simple. Id like to play more also, but currently its not much fun to me, so i play something else instead

So if someone else is YOUR victim, then its fine... incredible

Yes, and did i deny that? Nope, i didnt. I just stated, that other people, who are not only playing only DDs, can dislike the rework aswell... for other reasons. And if you havent noticed: Many people who want to play CVs also dislike it (not the rework itself, but what WG has done with CVs) Cant quite figure why you dont understand it... also why do you care, you said you didnt care so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Ok.... i said the same thing but whatever "You dont have to only play DDs..." would have been the correct syntax, but i still meant the same.

You have <700 games played - you dont belong in hightier matches anyway. Play a Radar Cruiser yourself to see how it is. It will teach you to be a better DD player

I think MrConway said he wanted to make one, but then didnt because of all the toxicity in the forums ... can understand that, it would end up in 2 groups throwing crap in each others faces

WG make a major mistake by releasing the CVs too early, and Haku was blatantly OP. So everyone who got raped by it, had to adapt. That meant, either play AA ships or group up. That created this bad meta we have now -> they learned it, and there is no reason to change that behaviour right now, as they feel its safe to do so. And if moving in one fleet to protect yourself from CVs is not a viable tactic, then what is? It is THE counterplay (always was) against CVs. However, noone bothered to do it against RTS CVs, because they could handle it by getting slaughtered once every xx matches by a Unicum CV player. It didnt bother them. Personaly i didnt play right after the rework, but i think many people were just abusing Hakuryu OPness and people had to change their playstyle to protect themselves against those CVs. It also could mean, that one flooding doesnt necessarily gets repaired right away, because with BoS + flag you can get the duration down to a managable level. That probably will mean, DDs as an indiviual will get more damage, but this damage will not have any meaningful impact, same as Conqueror HE spam.

True, thats why we see potatoes playing the same way even if there are no CVs in the game -> they "learned" its super safe to sit in one blob in the back of the map, especially when there are little to no DDs around. Well, good for you then. But you said, mostly DD-player hat the rework, and i disagree with that. You dont have to play DDs only to dislike the change, see @ghostbuster_ ... and i concur with him, that good player simply quit or play much less than before. Im not sure if anyone did take all factors into account (as i didnt read the whole thread, i dunno, so here is my theory): - Everytime WG releases a new line, player numbers spike for some time. From what ive heard, they didnt as much this time, and we are talking about a "new" class basicly. - WG gave us 200% XP on top of that -> and imo thats something, which noone took into consideration so far. That should be something, which makes people play more. And i think, WG did it on purpose (falsify the data basicly). According to Maplesyrup: Last week battles played 2.012.932 / 69245 individual players Week prior to 26.01: 2.836.715 / 97048 individual players I think that speaks for itself

Lets say, what you are claiming is possible, but not probable to happen. A BB cant delete every broadside Cruiser he catches, it just doesnt happen. CVs on the other hand can apply their damage much better than other ships. You cant compare DD torps with TBs.

That this is a bunch of horsesshit? How come BBs and DDs dont have several hundred thousand average damage if it would be true what you claim

Rework has ruined the game I dont even play DDs that much and i still hate it. Literally EVERYONE hates it - even if the reasons are different. DD players hate it for obvious reasons, and so do CVs. And most people who have a brain hate the new meta.