Thracen

I'm no expert on tier 10 balance but your cc changes seem to be converging their play style. The des moines has the best dpm out of all the tier 10 ccs already? the cost of this is looping arcs and shorter effective range. (also firing over islands.) I think double buffing it and changing it's play style isn't really on the cards. I also think a -5% fire chance to all ships (mainly thinking ccs) is insane. Did you know that tier differences decrease fire chance, this sort of change will make it impossible for low tier ccs to damage higher tier ships. You've created a world where the arguably the best fire starter in the game (Zao) has a 10% fire chance? I would also say that you seem to have focused on balancing the ccs among other ccs while ignoring them or even nerfing them in the BB vs CC meta which is strange considering how maligned ccs seem to be at the moment. I appreciate the thoughts and hope wg are at least thinking of these issues if not rushing to implement any changes.

You guys didn't read that I was talking about the stock version? AA rating of 8 etc.

Just to be clear, this is my point, that they have no need for an accuracy increase.

I may be throwing fuel on the fire here, but if I was going to recommend a line to go up to new players, or players that are finding it tough in other ships I would point to the german line. They get less punished for mistakes due to turtle back and good speed compared to the US. Their strength is designed to mitigate inaccurate guns with shorter range engagements. Ignoring accuracy of particular batteries for a moment, everyone has an easier time hitting targets at close range, less time for the target to move, great for people that have problems with that sort of prediction. When german BBs were released they had higher than average stats as all the unicums charged up the line free exping liberally. Now the likes of me and my potato friends have worked our way up them, lowering the stats, as the unicums have left to try their typically more challenging ships. Throw in the likelihood of it being a new players first line and it's easy to think that any slightly lower than average performance stats may well be down to the player base. This theory is at least partly evidenced by the flint.

Currently in an ongoing bug report about this very issue. Will keep you posted.

Thanks Nightdare, that's a well put together response I've got the exp for the first hull now, but my credits are thin on the ground. I will return with a large wallet and hammer through the upgrades once I've got my bismark ship shape and a tier 8 cc I haven't decided on yet. The big thing was adjusting my expectations, pushing for those 40k damage games instead of 90k damage games made it easier. You're a credit to the forum, I shall think of your words before I come whine again and spare the rest on here my mewling.

Consider this a short post requesting participation .

I agree, there is no point judging a ship on one configuration. Obviously there would be no point in an upgrade if there was no tangible difference, I think this is the most extreme case however and it's not like 19000exp is a cheap option.

I am certain you are talking about the non stock hull, the stock hull has an AA value of 8. My point is there is no play style when you can only travel 18 knots. Sure most bbs can't adapt well that's why there are dds and ccs but when you travel that slowly you can't even make that first choice. You have to head in the direction of the closest enemy to get anywhere near a fight before it's over let alone within effective range. As to the "just free exp it" argument, why have it there in the first place if it must be skipped? Why purposely have terrible content? You are right about the heal, I was exaggerating, I always use it once. I know I'm bitching, but I just can't see any value in this ship as stock. None. I would love someone to prove otherwise so I can learn and improve. However this doesn't seem to be the case. Oh and no, I hadn't seen that thread before you linked it.

The only problem i have is being pushed out of my smoke with torps. These new thick waves make it impossible to stay in and even if you have an escape route planed you're without your smoke for an extended cool down. Anybody solved this yet? I just can't seem to get it right when i'm faced with a dd backed by a BB to kill me in the open.

Try it stock, the AA does nothing, no exaggeration. I just had a game that took me 10 minutes to even get a clear shot, then of course you get focused so hard you have 2 minutes of shooting. I have seen my dispersation split a tako at 8km. The tako was completely broadside, 0 hits, 0 damage. This ship has zero viability stock. none. I challenge anyone to post an average game in this ship in stock configuration. It has no AA it has no speed it has no survivability it has no accuracy It does have a nice heal, that you might use once, if you are lucky. Before you die. I would say this is my cursed ship but thats my fletcher, this ship is just unusable.

Stock hull this ship is mediocre for tier 6 let alone 7. I'm a cruiser player mainly and I have no problems getting up tiered and relying on positioning. Problem is you can't position crapat 18 knots. You can't defend against a cv, you can't turn into torps. But why are you alone getting torped and cv'd? because I top out at 18 knots that's why. I'm tier 6 in every line save the brit ccs, up to 9 in others. I have never had a less pleasant ship. Ever. Sorry for the complaints, I just find this ship is shockingly bad stock. I had more fun (and success) in the 13.4km fuso! I just feel that there is no skill to learn, no adapting to this ship while it's stock. All there is is pain, no learning curve, no lessons to value later down the line just pain.

I feel your pain, I have finished the others but have 17 russians left to kill. I really want the nachi as well as it's the least offensive in colour. I've been taking out my schores and kiev to help others out at least. I wish there was an easier way to do this. I have noticed it feels harder playing these ships .

Merry Christmas I suppose, and thanks for the fun. Name: Thracen Ship: Graf Spee if it exists, if not I'll take a molotov in black with flames down the side please .

Trying to play the ship now, but I'm finding I do more damage with the genu guns than these. I find the suggestion that they are accurate very confusing. Do they get much better with the next hull? I spent all my credits on the ship and modules to get it to work a little better for me but I just can't hit the broadside of a barn or keep safe by staying close to allied. *sobs* I'm going to read the guide now but any extra tips/hope would be great .

Hey guys, I hear lots of love for this ship but I'm not quite getting it. The torps are nice but the angles are a challenge, forcing broadsides when a single bb shell is a 3rd of your hp at the wrong moment, this doesn't work out. The biggest frustration I have are the glacial guns, I maneuver loads to avoid those BB salvos but it puts my guns constantly off target. Slowing turns just so your guns can catch up just doesn't seem right in a cc. I feel I should play close with 10 km torps and way less range than the schores for example but the slow guns seem to run counter to this. Any tips would be greatly appreciated. (I did look for some youtube guides but most are from old patches talking about different guns?)

There seems to be a lot of conditions you have to meet to get this ship to work. 1.Be second line. 2.stealth in then turn. 3. do all these things in front of ships in the open you can engage. It's this 3rd one that's tough.I find that I actually do less damage on the second line that yoloing in down a flank because groups of ships tend to play passive and smart enemies run from a pack. The stealth ain't much either 12.3. When you actually get to use the guns they are good. Blowing away a dd stupid enough to get caught in the open by a cc or a BB that's screwed up allowing 2 salvos into the superstructure. But these are enemy mistakes, I feel that you can't make opportunites yourself in this ship, but have to get in a good position and hope they happen.

I was going to start a thread to console myself on my streaks but did the right thing and searched. I'm sure it must be down to me but today I have a winrate of 33% and yesterday it was 70%. I really hate playing badly and knowing even the few wins in my notifications are from when a team carries me. I know my bad habits too, I lead, which is always a mistake unless you are a top tiered jap dd. The tunnel vision comes in too. I even like to play ccs and dds where one mistake puts you out. All of it combines into these long runs of good games and bad.

Thanks for the help, I do have last stand. I will work on when to use guns, I've definitely got a bit gun shy because of detection and my low survival rate. My settings match your suggestions but I've got no mods installed. I can certainly see where I could benefit from the one you suggest. I totally see that I should have dropped speed there too. I maintained a vulnerable position for way longer than needed. Thanks again. I'm off traveling till Friday but I will put this in to practise when I return.

And here we are : http://wowreplays.com/Replay/22065-Thracen-Tears-of-the-Desert I appreciate all the time and effort chaps.

Right I have replay here, turns out we sneaked a win but I'm sure I played poorly. How do I upload it?

I don't think I'm going to have the chance this week, I'll install the replay functionality when I get back of my hols on friday and try to show you some games. Thanks for the help.

Not offended, I'm here for help after all. However a big part of my frustration is the fact that I don't think I'm a total waste of ammunition. http://eu.warshipstoday.com/signature/539901090/dark.png

I think it's fair to say you don't get to a fletcher without learning the basics, point in fact the above post is mighty familiar, I mainly play dds and ccs, compensating for fragility with planning and positioning is my bread and butter. I will focus on maintaining a tighter formation with my team and backing down from dd duels when not 100% in my favour. Saying that it might be one of my mistakes, up until now I've always assumed I had advantage in those scenarios. Whether the ship has this advantage or not with me at the wheel it clearly doesn't.

I match all those requirements save the torp reload for which I've gone with the gun module. As for 1v1s I never get them, I'll be closing down a dd ready for the finish and then get interrupted buy a devastating cc salvo. I find I take more fire when evasive in the fletcher than the benson.