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CaptainThunderWalker

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  1. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    You could make the Isaac Sweers a Tier VII premium and put the Van Galen N-class at Tier VIII, making her better than the Gadjah Mada (Floatplane, better torpedoes, Tier VIII upgrade slot). That is also why I don't want the Van Galen member of the Admiralen-class to represent the second Admiralen-class batch (on Tier VI, in your proposal), but Witte de With. It helps with avoiding confusion.
  2. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    True, but it will be worse than the Gerard Callenburgh because the aft turret on this ship is superfiring and is further away from any kind of superstructure. Whereas with the Ontwerp 1937 it's squeezed right in between the funnels. That is true. Remember that for the Tier X you can use the Utrecht instead of the lead ship of the class, so we can use the British MK 20 torpedoes at 4 per broadside. 36 knots was the design speed, 42.8 knots the recorded speed in trials. I can't find a truly reliable source but the sources seem to agree. Tromp as a high tier destroyer was considered back in the day. She'd be quite similar to the Khabarovsk I guess, but she has too many similarities to the Yubari I think. Putting the Amiralen-class on mid tiers would help with the number of clones. Also, Van Galen is practically identical to the Jervis and Gadjah Mada, so probably put it at either Tier VI Isaac Sweers would probably be too different from the rest of the tree and be awkward to build a captain for because she suddenly needs IFHE (while all other ships have 120mm guns). She either needs to be a premium or have improved HE penetration.
  3. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    Yeah, the Wolf would easily be the smallest Tier II destroyer in the game. Good read though, thanks. It was a half-joke. Yes, it's obvious the Fletcher is different from the Benson due to several feedback loops (and the Fletcher is slightly larger), but you need to do some research to understand why the Fletcher is a logical development from the Benson. Show both ships to a random dude and he'll only note that the Fletcher is both bigger and slower. If it wasn't for the Tier IX upgrade slot the difference between the two would be fairly minimal ingame - most of the improvements of the Fletcher over the Benson don't translate very well to the game (and the HP difference is negated by being bigger). Note that the gun arrangement on Ontwerp 1937 is seriously worse than on the Gerard Callenburgh, though (the gun and floatplane were swapped around for the latter, because the single gun in between the funnels is a little weird when you can have it superfiring aft). 37.5 was the speed that both the ZH-1 and Isaac Sweers recorded in combat, but the ZH-1 wrung out 42 knots during the trials as they pushed the ship probably beyond its safe limits. I however immidiately admit that I don't know the exact details. There is not just the floatplane, there is also the Tier VIII upgrade slot and they can get the Fletcher threatment with the torpedoes. Well, the rate of fire of the Holland and Friesland class is terrifying. The Holland and Friesland will come with 4 × 45 = 180 RPM. Lower alpha, yes, but the dakkadakkadakka will be a hilarious gimmick. The DPM will even make the Khabarovsk whimper. Don't forget that the Friesland is a lot faster than the Holland (42 knots opposed to 32 knots) and can carry torpedo tubes (1×4 on each side) if Wargaming deems it necessary. Two ships of the class did so in the late 1950s for some tests, the Utrecht and the Overijssel. Something I'm noticing is that Dutch ships tended to turn out faster than their design specifications once actually built. I like this one. Never heard of the Oland and it really fills the gap that the European tech tree seems to have. Roger de Lauria should probably be put at Tier IX though, since it is in many ways a worse Gearing even if built a little later. I think I prefer that one as a Free XP ship, though, since... I think I would center the line around the 120mm guns, though, for the sake of ballistic consistency. The line might be too messy otherwise. As for your comments over Java and Tre Kronor: The Java... I really dislike having no torpedoes at low tier. Even at tier III I think the Friant and Caledon are just better ships than Java would be. The Friant especially has that great gun layout (if a little slow on the rate of fire) and enough torpedoes to punish the close range combat that is everywhere in low tiers. That doesn't mean the Java will be bad - it will be very powerful - but it will have some weaknesses. Gun range in the game is generally unhistorical, too - most ships have their gun range massively shortened. Tre Kronor can be balanced on Tier VI if you are generous with softstats and the likes, but that goes for most ships.
  4. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    Wolf would be a Tier II with a floatplane, which could be interesting. They are of the same size as the Tachibana-class, it should be fine, but yes, the Tachibana has heavier armanament (her sister ship, the Sakura, doesn't, outside of a single 120mm cannon). The Americans have the same issue but rename the class (The Benson and Fletcher have very few actual differences either). I agree though, but it can't really be avoided here. The Dutch Tier III However, the Tier IV B-hull can have an obvious and insuspicious refit that would increase the differences a fair bit, most notably the 40mm Hazemeyer Bofors twins replacing the Vicker mounts. Tier V is a predecessor to the Gerard Callenburgh class. Indeed a paper design. Here, have a blueprint. As you see, it bridges the gap between the Admiralen-class and the future Gerard Callenburgh-class quite well. Yeah, sister ships abound, which is why I stated that the Dutch DD line would be harder (but Spain has the same issue with DDs). Funnily, the Germans managed to get 42 knots out of ZH-1 with the same engine+hull combination as Gerard Callenburgh during speed trials (36 knots was the designed speed), so you can play around with the stats to make sure the Tier VII would be better in a few ways. Even just the speed differential would make up for the tier difference with all other stats remaining the same. I'll respond to your comments about Tier VIII-X below. Doing so would leave Tier VIII pretty much empty, since there isn't even much of a paper design to fill that slot. There is also the Dutch tendency to mount floatplanes everywhere on pre-war designs, which can become very awkward if Tier VIII happens to be a pre-war design as well. That's why I put it on Tier VIII - that way I could make the line consistent and this leaves the option open whether the Van Galen carries a floatplane or not. Also, I made this tech tree before both the Jervis and Gadjah Mada were in the game, or hell, before we got a British tech tree at all (or maybe just the cruisers). But with them in the game and on Tier VII, that answers this question for us with a clear "yes", as the floatplane would help justifying its higher tier. You could also make the ship more "Dutch" by replacing British AA-mounts with whatever the Dutch used on natively constructed ships (ie; Hazemeyer Bofors) that are everywhere on the other tiers anyway and would be an improvement over the pompoms. It's kinda weird if the Tier VII or VIII ship has worse AA than the Tier V, even on a destroyer. Yep, I mixed up the Tier IX and X. Happens when are typing something out of memory. Personally I was actually quite surprised that I could make two nearly full Dutch lines, though - originally I wanted to go for Pan European too, but you run in literally the same issues as you do with a Dutch line for a pan-European tree (how are you going to fill the tier VIII destroyer- and cruiser slots?). The Dutch have no problems for Tier I-VII with Cruisers, and outside of the double sister ships for the Admiralen-class also no problems up to tier VII with destroyers, but Tier VIII will be empty. Tier IX and X are no problem for the destroyers, and Tier IX and X for the cruisers can at least be filled with the battlecruiser proposals.
  5. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    Java has a broadside of 7 guns, so she is outgunned and out-armored by the St. Louis though her guns are more modern (but have actually a slower rate of fire!). She'll be worse than the Danae too - and in many games I think I'd rather sail in the Caledon or Friant as well unless I am going to be harrassed by aircraft all day, in which case the four twin Bofors mounts from the Java will be useful. Java will be a very strong Tier III, but the St. Louis, Friant, Tenryu and Caledon all have advantages over her in their own way. Tre Kronor is, as @Caridon outlined, better suited for Tier V than Tier VI. At Tier VI she will just suck too hard, but her AA will be massive wherever you put her. I think that is fine, actually; giving the lower tier ships that survived through World War II their historical AA at low tiers can allow Wargaming to homogenize the aircraft HP pools, making the differences between tiers smaller and addressing one of the bigger problems on carrier balance that way - something that plagued CVs both pre-rework and after rework. Edit: It's not just Tre Kronor of course; the Dutch line as proposed above would be very heavy on the AA as well especially at lower tiers and with any amount of common sense we also know what kind of upgrades Design 1047 would have received if it had been built throughout World War II :P Probably more than just 10×2 40mm Bofors mounts :P And many battleships don't have their historical AA, most notably the Kongo-class but it goes for many others as well.
  6. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    De Ruyter is more like a worse Leander or even Emile Bertin, and has no torpedoes until she gets her final hull upgrade (1942 planned reconstruction had she survived Java Sea). Tier V at most, together with Jacob van Heemskerck as a premium. Java is basically a faster version of the old cruisers that linger around at Tier III and IV, and also has no torpedoes - I think her 30 knots would be too much for tier III but she could be squeezed in at either tier III or IV, with Tromp at tier IV. She's modern for Tier IV but with only 6 guns and the low displacement she has she would have her weaknesses - in many ways she'd be similar to the Yubari. The Dutch line in general would probably be similar to Yubari - relatively undergunned ships with defensive AA in a seperate consumable slot (from Java onwards). Eendracht has 4 twin turrets on Tier VI and 2×2 + 2×3 at Tier VII with generally just better soft stats and a lot more (fictional) AA, the 16000 ton project on Tier VIII with 203mm cannons in three triple turrets (240mm guns were proposed but never confirmed, and the ship couldn't meet all design requirements when guns of that caliber would be fitted). Tier IX and X would be the Design 1047 proposals. Premiums would be plentiful; Celebes (enlarged Java) at Tier IV, Jacob van Heemskerck (Tromp-class with British DP-armanament) at Tier V, Zeven Provinciën (1950s variety of Eendracht) at Tier VIII. Van Kinsbergen and one of the old protected cruisers from the Gelderland-class would complete the Dutch tech tree at tier 1 and 2, respectively. In other words: Van Kinsbergen -> Gelderland -> Java -> Tromp (Celebes) -> De Ruyter (Jacob van Heemskerck) -> Eendracht -> Kijkduin -> 16000t project (de Zeven Provinciën), Design 1047, Design 323. There are a few surplus ship names to use, like Gouden Leeuw or Brederode, for the last few ships, too. Dutch DDs are harder, but doable: Wolf-class (tier II), Piet Hein (Admiralen-class, first group) at tier III, Witte de With (Admiralen-class, second group) Tier IV), Ontwerp 1937 (Tier V), Gerard Callenburgh (Tier VI), Philips van Almonde (upgraded Gerard Callenburgh) Tier VII), Van Galen (Tier VIII), Friesland (Tier IX), Holland (Tier X). Banckert (Tier IV) and Isaac Sweers (Tier VII) would be the Dutch destroyer premiums, but you could do a lot with all the floatplains the Dutch were fond on using on their destroyers (and all of the Dutch destroyers from Tier II to VII would carry one). Another Admiralen-class or maybe even a heavily modernized Wolf-class could be used as a Tier III premium. A bunch of Battleship proposals from the early 1910s would be used as additional premium ships, at tier III, IV, V and VI, with the latter two having an increasingly large fictional AA suite, but no battleship branch. The most interesting design is probably the one with 2 quad turrets, but there are a lot of designs floating around. Edit: As such, I wouldn't really say that the Pan-European line is viable - a Dutch tech tree alone is viable. Spanish tech tree is - mostly - viable too, but I couldn't find many proper paper designs to round out the high tier cruisers, so I ended up stuck at Tier VII. Destroyers look pretty doable for the Spanish, though for the Tier X you have to be very, very generous. Sweden can probably have a full DD-line, but the cruisers fall flat after Tre Kronor (Tier V). Greece, Austria-Hungary and Poland all had a bunch of ships too, but it seems to me that this would just be an amalgation of low-and mid tier premiums, since I don't think any of them even proposed ships that would fit in higher tiers. I don't think you can even make a single full line for either of those nations, whether alone or together, because they don't even round each other out that well.
  7. CaptainThunderWalker

    European research tree?

    I studied the Dutch ships before my hiatus, and it is very possible to make a Dutch tech tree with only a handful of paper ships in regards to cruisers and destroyers and enough leftovers for premiums. It would give us the Battleships would be paper for Tier III-V (maybe VI) and Sikret Dokuments for anything above that. Many other countries you want to put in the Pan-European tree have the same problem as the Dutch do and then some more - take Sweden, for example. They have Tier IX and X Destroyers very much like the Dutch, but they can just as much put the question mark to what Tier VIII they would pick. The Dutch can fill all other DD tiers pretty easily, though (Sweden has a few more holes). With Cruisers, the Dutch have to resort to paper projects for Tier IX and X, but at least Design 1047 and its associated projects are well-known enough and would provide us with the first supercruiser in the tech tree (and probably the most balanced designs of them all). Again, Tier VIII is the biggest issue, but same goes for Sweden... but they don't have any suitable ships after Tre Kronor, not even designed, and Tre Kronor is Tier VI if you're generous but probably better on Tier V (as Eendracht would have a full additional 3-gun turret in its B-hull configuration, and probably be Tier VI)... Now Tre Kronor is a ship I'd love to see in the game, but you can't really fill a Swedish tech tree with cruisers after that. And the Dutch can use the 1950 variant at least on Tier VII, maybe even on Tier VIII. Spain has also issues; they have the Canarias-class cruisers for Tier VII and I'm pretty sure they can fill most tiers below that, and while I am completely unfamiliar with any paper projects the Spanish might have had, and they had a lot less Destroyers than the Dutch. On the other hand, they are a bit more spread out and more ships of the individual classes were built, so with some messing around with statistics you can probably fill a tech tree with them, though Tier X will be a very, very generous interpretation of the Oquendo class. But the Spanish really don't bring anything new to a tech tree that the Dutch already do either except an actually built Battleship (but the España class BBs are just worse than the other Tier IIIs in every way with a broadside of 6 and the lowest displacement of all of them... but maybe balancing one for Tier III would make for quite a comfortable ship because its soft stats could be a lot better?). They also have their own paper BB for Tier IV, the Reina Victoria Eugenia-class, but the Dutch also had their whole slew of paper BB designs from just before the First World War. The reverse is also true however - the Dutch don't bring anything that the Spanish don't other than high tier paper projects to fill the empty cruiser slots. BBs above Tier VI are going to be fantasy no matter what you do, though Spain considered to order a Littorio-class Battleship appearantly. TLDR: I don't really know if there's much value in Pan-European research tree- seperate trees for the Dutch, Swedes and Spanish might be a better option. You will struggle with the Tier VIII DD and high tier Cruisers whether you make one or three tech trees and neither country has any noticeable BBs to speak of to fill a tech tree, but the Dutch have a lot of paper projects to plug the holes that the other countries seem to lack. High tier BBs are probably going to be fantasy, so I would expect most BB designs to be premiums... but for that it wouldn't really matter if you have one or three seperate lines.
  8. CaptainThunderWalker

    Funny and sad game situations shown with map screenshots.

    Make of this what you will.
  9. CaptainThunderWalker

    buff midways flooding chance and torp damage

    Know that I consider myself a bumbling fool as well.
  10. CaptainThunderWalker

    buff midways flooding chance and torp damage

    Why would you care about the average when the average player can best be described as a bumbling fool?
  11. CaptainThunderWalker

    Giulio Cesare stays as it is + balance of other premiums

    True. And these all played a role with uninstalling World of Tanks. World of Tanks is different from World of Warships, in that I never bothered to reinstall World of Warships on my new PC rather than actively uninstalling it which I did with World of Tanks. Balance was still a major factor in that decision, though. Definately true. World of Tanks has much bigger issues with its tier spread, and I think World of Warships is overall the better game. You can damage any ship in the game with any ship in the game, which is a very good thing. No plans on reinstalling World of Tanks ever :P . That being said, the Gulio Cesare is so much better than the silver competition that it's just gross. I mean, the Kamikaze is strong, but it doesn't directly outclass its competition (well, it does now, because the Minekaze was changed), and is mostly a pubstomper and I never really struggled dealing with it (though it's annoying when your teammates suffer from straightlineitis). Not even now I am rusty and my aim is bloody awful. The Gulio Cesare is basically a Tier VI battleship put at Tier V.
  12. CaptainThunderWalker

    Giulio Cesare stays as it is + balance of other premiums

    I quit World of Tanks over this issue and had a hiatus from World of Warships for over 18 months because of it as well. You're not alone.
  13. CaptainThunderWalker

    Kii AA Buff?

    YEah, AA numbers are arbitrary now, much more related to tier than anything else. A much more obvious case can be made for the Friant (Tier III French Cruiser) and the Emile Bertin (Tier V French Cruiser). The former has 4 90mm cannons of the Model 1926, and the Tier V ship has only 2 mounts of the same gun. Half that amount. Yet, the Emile Bertin has 11 AA DPS and the Friant 13 AA DPS (instead of 22). It gets even crazier with the flak burst: the Emile Bertin has one of 420. The Friant has one of 210. How the !#$% does that make any sense?
  14. It is not likely, but that just means I don't play Ranked at any of these tiers. Which means that currently only Tier III (and below) are available for Ranked, as all higher tiers do have too big offenders. Except maybe Tier VI, though the T-61 is pretty close. Tier VIII I am actually not that familiar either, but well, my rustiness (having had two extended breaks before because of... guess, game balance) makes me want to avoid Tier VIII for the time being regardless. And it's just one set of premium ships. Wargaming is going to sell new premium ships that are probably even better, just rubbing more salt in the wound. In before we get a Japanese premium BB at Tier V with 8 16-inch guns that are more accurate and have a shorter reload than the 14-inch guns on the Kongo. I have said it here.
  15. Then WG might be forced to ban certain premium ships from partaking at all in certain events or ranked seasons.
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