arcticstorm123

Yep, and there it is, right there, the difference between players who love the game, or some aspect of it, and developers who are tasked with increasing revenue and player retention

tbh though this is the dark secret of all Wargaming's games, once you get to Tier 10 or 9 it gets to be a bit boring once you have all classes covered, I'm not there yet but I know a few people who have given up because it's not fun anymore, they can bring out new ships but after a while they pretty much all operate the same with some slight buffs or weaknesses up or down. Wargaming need to introduce new classes just so they can keep people, and stop people drifting off to other games.

Exactly, I started playing again when CV's rework came in, and have now pretty much given up now CV's have been nerfed into uselessness, exactly the same will happen with this, probably not from DD players this time but more from BB and maybe CL drivers. At first they will be fun to play but existing classes of players will scream blue murder for nerfs. Also agree if dd's become sub hunters dd players will get to add "kill the sub" to the other things people demand they do i.e. "cap X!!!!!"

Actually got all the tier 8's tree and Prems so far (got lucky getting 3 Premiums from 2x 20 Euro boxes, Kaga is in fact the only I bought directly in shop) and just ground out the Brit tier 8. I had head start on the JP and US CV's as I had already been playing RTS. I've been waiting for the re-work to settle down (vain hope I know) and stuck to co-op and scenario's for same reason, and been looking where to go for tier X, I used to favour Japanese in RTS but looking at Shokaku I'm a bit underwhelmed so far, do the Japanese get better for tier X?

Yeah thanks for the clarification, wasn't following that closely, think apparent convergence is due to perspective because of the torp guide,. That picture just bought back bad memories of getting decimated attacking up-tier cruisers, probably less likely with a tier X game

And not forgetting his AA crews aren't asleep while you do this...

Problem with the re-work as I see it is change of emphasis With the rework WG has changed CV's role somewhat, ok they have always hit all ship classes but rework has probably skewed too much against dd's as a class. In RTS, as far as I can remember I'd probably prioritise target as follows: 1. Attacking bombers / Tb's / fighters 2. Enemy Cv's 3. BB's 4. CL's 5. dd's (and then only if they were after me or causing lots of problems, granted it was also trickier to hit them with just bombs). Not strictly in that order obviously, but you get the idea. I'd consider it a major plus to sink the enemies CV's early game so you could then move on to the rest. Problem now is there's no directable counter to attacking planes, fighters now are meh, would be nice to set a fighter on an attacking squadron, CV's could help a lot if they could target attackers aircraft like they did in RTS, but the new mechanic probably makes this more difficult to implement. Rocket planes replacing fighters guarantees people will look for dd's first because they will only scrape the paint on a CL or BB, and they tend to be your fastest planes.

Yeah I remember taking those excessive dog legs back to my carrier lol

I'd agree about CV hunting, in RTS it was a major factor as well as using fighters to attack the opposition's aircraft (Bogue 2+1 anybody?), with the rework WG has changed CV's role somewhat, ok they have always hit all ship classes but rework has probably skewed too much against dd's as a class. In RTS I'd probably prioritise target as follows: 1. attacking bombers / Tb's 2. Enemy Cv's 3. BB's 4. CL's 5. dd's (and then only if they were after me or causing lots of problems, granted it was also trickier to hit them with just bombs)

Just noticed the "Naval Legends: U.S.S. Cod – Trailer" (submarine). Are Wargaming about to attempt misdirection, launching another class we can argue about?

np it's hard to write what I mean sometimes Yeah understand that, if you accept CV spotting gets nerfed way back I would just prefer a dd not to spring into view 6km away with no chance to take any action or take evasive is what I was thinking , maybe give CV's enough secondaries to at least make it a fair fight

Maybe you interpreted my comment the wrong way, what I meant was if they removed/reduced spotting for CV's I couldn't care less, I don't want my primary function in a CV to be a spotter, and I agree this is one thing which would reduce a lot of the anger, only exception would be being able to spot an attacking dd (as in attacking my CV) at a reasonable range (argue among yourselves about what "reasonable" is)

Why so aggressive? I play all classes, ...not well but I play them.., I enjoy cv's as much as any other class, sorry you don't like them but some of us do, and would like to find a way to fit them so everyone's happy, and I'd post pretty much the same if any other class of ship was nerfed to this extent. There's no way you can have a calm reasoned discussion in this thread

Everyone who plays this game wants "glorious games" with high scores and the ability to dominate the game. BB gets a good score or a kraken?, fine! send congratulations, same for DD or a CL. But if a Cv does anywhere near the same (pretty much an impossibility since CV rework )?, omfg out come the pitch forks and torches!!! I get some people have no interest in a particular class, and never want to play it, but other players do, and the incentive to play is removed if you are reduced to just being a source of damage, or the even more ridiculous comments I've seen about CV's becoming "support ships" dropping sonar buoys or repairing other ships...who the hell would want to play that? We need to make the game fun for all classes, and most importantly at all tiers, Wargaming are making these changes just looking at tier X unicums, or what CC's like Notser says, with no thought as to how they affect tier IV, VI and even tier VIII CV players especially when up-tiered. CV's do have a place, in particular for discouraging camping and island/border hugging, personally I couldn't care less about spotting, but give the CV's something to make the game enjoyable, because hopefully that's why we all play this game, to have fun. (Re-post from "The return of the DD’s. Well, the bad ones anyway" as it's more relevant here)

Well that's the thing in't it? Everyone who plays this game wants "glorious games" with high scores and the ability to dominate the game. BB gets a good score or a kraken?, fine! send congratulations, same for DD or a CL. But if a Cv does anywhere near the same (pretty much an impossibility since CV rework )?, omfg out come the pitch forks and torches!!! I get some people have no interest in a particular class, and never want to play it, but other players do, and the incentive to play is removed if you are reduced to just being a source of damage, or the even more ridiculous comments I've seen about CV's becoming "support ships" dropping sonar buoys or repairing other ships...who the hell would want to play that? We need to make the game fun for all classes, and most importantly at all tiers, Wargaming are making these changes just looking at tier X unicums, or what CC's like Notser says, with no thought as to how they affect tier IV, VI and even tier VIII CV players especially when up-tiered. CV's do have a place, in particular for discouraging camping and island/border hugging, personally I couldn't care less about spotting, but give the CV's something to make the game enjoyable, because hopefully that's why we all play this game, to have fun. Guess this is off-topic so re-posted to CV rework thread

So what I'm hearing here is dd's are overpowered and should be nerfed, or removed from the game altogether?

Unless there was more than 1 CV in the game you were only hitting them one at a time, for however many attempts per squadron, assuming you suffered no losses at all from AA (unlikely in a Tier X game). How is this different from those Yamato's straying into the field of fire of 1,2 or more CA HE spammers? pretty much the same if you ask me, yeah they can sail away, but how quickly? The Yamato burns nicely.

Followed an old link and got this 404 page, what interests me is that someone at WOWS took the time to develop this picture, and some very submariney references are turning up under the covers of the game. Think you're annoyed at CV's right now?, could soon be the least of your worries! (tbh I'd welcome subs, would add a bit more variety, new countermeasures etc., people go on about their submerged speed but seeing until WW2 and the invention of the snorkel they did most of their travelling on the surface, something like the Halloween game where you had limited time submerged could make it a nice addition, and would give people ranting about CV's being overpowered something else to obsess about )

Got Tier 5 Pyotr Velikiy from an in game crate, got 2 x5 standard containers using allowance tokens, got flags etc. no ships

CV's in 2 updates time :

But you also had more CV tiers, and you didn't get up-tiered like now, tier 6 CV in a tier 8 game you need infinite planes to even tickle ships. And btw you do run out of planes of a particular class over time (admittedly with a rate to replenish), ohh goodee I've only got rocket planes available, that will stop that Tirpitz bearing down on me

Not hated at all and I think if most comments were like your we'd be a lot further along with this, some constructive comments. The fighters do seem like a last minute bodge, I'd rather have fighters in the RTS sense than rocket planes but I guess that would mess with the one squadron at a time concept, I think it would be better if they did a half RTS / half as it is now, so if you see fighters or other attack planes you could hit M assign a fighter squadron to an aircraft target (as in RTS) and then M key back to the attack planes, I change the course of my CV in game if required using this and it doesn't seem to affect the attack flight much unless they are in the thick of the enemy.

Well I've played this game since 2015 (not a Unicum and no interest in being one, just play for fun ), bounced from BB's to CA's to CV's to DD's and back again multiple times. CV's have been in the game as long as I've played as far as I remember and RTS was arguably a lot more damaging in the right hands than the current rework, for quite some time I think my RTS carriers had the most damage of any class, and like I said I'm no ace player. I think the difference now is that people have had a break from CV's and they like it, sure if they removed DD's for a while I'm sure there are plenty of BB players who would applaud, and react angrily when they come back, but it's a bit much to say CV's don't belong in the game, they have been here for years save for the last year or so. CV's are fresh in peoples minds because of the rework, over time the nerfs and boredom will move the bulk of players on to something else to moan about, and immediately rush to buy/acquire one (looks at Russian BB's and the Kobyashi camo IJN booster, how many Yamato's we going to see soon?). Everybody needs to calm down, CV's won't mean the end of the game and by the way if I had €1 for every time I've heard that about new developments in the game I would own Wargaming by now

( I agree btw, it was just to good an opportunity to link to this )

My limited experience is, you will may be ok with bd's but a definite no no for torps especially if the mountain is high and if the ship is reasonably close to land, it takes too long for the torp bombers to get low and you need to be dropping in water too, even when I drop over water the torps can just "disappear" maybe too shallow water?. Only exception I've found is if a ships nose is just starting to appear from behind the land into open water (pretty much the same as I'd do in a dd use the land for cover from their guns while lining up a torp run). I tend to avoid attack runs on targets on the other side of large hills or mountains, I've not been able to make it work for me, better is to get just outside AA on a good side with water then hit boost during the attack run