HaachamaShipping

Go home you're drunk. Or very excited by the idea. Also, I still hope they rethink the torps. It'd be nice to get an IJN DD premium which gimmick isn't a retarded set of torps. We now got: Asashio: 20 km super DWT Yukikaze: 8 km Lidl F3s Yuudachi: Shima stock torps, but even worse Like, why can't we go back to the good old days when we gave ships slightly worse torps in exchange for improved guns or such. Like on the Shinonome or Harekaze. You know, DDs that are considered highly competitive and not just memes.

KGV isn't my favourite T7 BB, but it certainly isn't weak. Also, I played it without IFHE, because I don't have 4 points to waste on a skill to avoid switching ammo. EL is 1 point and better payoff if I really wanted to. And I'm not sure you can claim your IFHE build to be "effective" with that kinda damage and WR to show for it, sorry.

You could also just not play then, instead of being an [edited]to 11 other players on your team?

Radar got buffed in range and duration for some ships, but I find the 6s delay harsher than the buffs. If you take the T8 radar cruisers for example, only Baltimore gained the ability to counter-radar anything that spotted it. Everyone else already had that capability and would only have lost it due to CE changes (Chapayev wasn't even about to lose it). 6s nerf however means mostly just idiots who f*** up their positioning horrendously get caught long enough for the team to wreck them, while most players have to just deal with a single cruiser for the first few critical seconds. And while I can feel pity for those who complain about having not much counter-play vs a CV DBing or rocketting them repeatedly till they are dead, if you get killed by a radar cruiser these days in your DD, you kinda deserve it. For teamwork radar, the 6s nerf imo absolutely dumpstered Chapayev, due to having wasted 6s out of the precious 20s it lasts overall.

Noticed no decrease in the sporadic attempts of coordination. Saw it yesterday, when someone was "BC" and people told him off. It almost developed in the team bunching up in a ball as the enemy got map control by flanking through A and we only got somewhere because the enemy DD died from focus fire and HE DBs and then they managed to retake the other caps. Was a terrible game, I hope they don't pull this crap again. Worst part is, team with hardly anyone else spotting focus fired whatever I spotted, so I got 120k spotting damage and a pittance in actual damage. Enjoy your pink.

Less skilled CV players are an annoyance that deplanes itself and ends in the bottom half of the scoreboard. Unlike with crap like Asashio, terrible CV players are not the issue for BBs. Decent ones are. USN HE DBs do a good ton of alpha damage too and have pretty solid fire chance that makes Conqueror blush. They don't rely on fires too much and when you do put it out, how long till a CV can just renew it with another drop? Also, keep in mind, AP cits might knock engines out, while torps can at times disable rudder on BBs. There's a lot of reasons to use damecon and if you don't use it, you are taking damage. Either way, DoT is basically a thing mostly of the RN CVs. Hahaha... Others are often more maneuverable, less easy to citadel and often have better torp belt. Yes, Yamato isn't going to fare great either, but it isn't going to suck harder than RU BB. If you ever got dropped in a Stalingrad, imagine the same, but without defAA.

Doesn't save your ship from getting dropped against good CV players. Players who actually fly into flak get wrecked also by Yamato. Limited DCP, so after five times they are free to be farmed. Also, crap torp belt. Russian turning circle radius preventing you to turn around or dodge stuff. Citadel that is high enough that it should be farmable by AP DBs. By all means, these ships look pretty much like CV food to me.

As a Kaga player, I approve.

Would it be alright if we were to reverse the radar nerf and give every cruiser with radar a 4-5 km stealth radar window? And to balance it, we make it consistently that BBs get like 8 km concealment. That'd mean cruisers would support DDs, because DDs would be the only way to spot BBs before suddenly getting shot at. Well, if you are 1v1 you are basically f***ed, but who gives a s**t. It's a silly argument to make that the CV deserves to run deep into AA range to spot AA cruisers, because in the end, CV spotting already got nerfed to basically the most barebones system we could have under the current rules. The only reason CVs spot this much in the first place is because they are fast, which is a consequence of having reduced alpha strike (because people complained RTS CV with their minutes of preperation time to get a concerted strike off were too powerful at oneshotting things). It's utterly stupid to insist that aircraft cannot effectively spot before dying, because it'd basically mean the moment the CV runs out of allies, it's game over, because they'd have to spot with their hull, with CVs typically having concealment along heavy cruiser and BB lines, crap for armour, crap for maneuverability and little chance to win a 1v1 with a target that isn't near dead and fighting back, unless it's some crappy DD. And hasty uninformed theorycrafting, mostly by people who had little idea of how to play CVs is why we got the RTS CVs reworked into this current state.

It's basically USN BB deck. It'd be as if Azuma had a 57 mm centre deck. Also one reason why I laugh at WGs claim that 30 mm was a T10 trait, so giving it to a T9 is OP, when Alaska basically gets 27 mm aft/stern, 28 mm upper bow, sandwiched inbetween the armoured belt and a 36 mm deck that bounces Yamato and Republique. Alaska all-round is basically the most survivable cruiser in the entire game. Wouldn't even hand it to Stalingrad/Moskva, given their huge citadel.

36 mm deck

No, they are different currencies, not different customers. Pretty much anyone who has played this game for long enough to have 1 million free exp should have a good bit of coal too. If someone is looking at buying these ships, they are typically looking for the experience of an IJN supercruiser and then it is "Do I spend 1 million free exp that I could use otherwise for whatever is offered now or in the future or do I spend whatever amount of coal they ask for Yoshino, which could also be used for other things alternatively?" Also, Alaska has actually decent AP if you get to mid range and Alaska has way better armour. If you can't see a difference between 25 mm everywhere and a citadel like a Nep and reinforced deck, 27 mm bow, underwater citadel, then I guess they might play the same to you, but Alaska sure doesn't play like some long range HE spammer to me.

Go play a CV and tell me how much it would change. Aerial spotting on most cruisers is their AA range (for obvious reasons you wouldn't want to half that one, unless you want CVs to run into Mino/Worcester 4 km instadeath midrange aura before spotting the ship if the cruiser turns off AA), while on DDs it is usually a bit over 2 km.It already got reduced once. And gues what, it did crap all, here we are still, with people complaining about CVs spotting too much and nuking your DD out of the water with HE DBs (which care not at all for detection, because you literally are above the enemy ship when dropping). And rocket fighters already overshoot spotted DDs if they don't have AA on, which is why CVs will either just fly a loop and come back with starting the aiming before spotting the DD again, or they pop a fighter ontop of the DD to keep them spotted for the second pass. And if I were to introduce BBs with fully unnerfed secondaries, a vastly greater difference in hp to DDs more representative of tonnage and some sillier level of HE resistence to the point they'd crap on everything, then would we argue about removing BBs, because they just are too large and unsuited for the game? Or can we just accept that the current mechanics don't work, but that this does not preclude better mechanics? Heck, we had RTS CVs three months ago and they, while being powerful, didn't cause this amount of grief and didn't cause DDs to become a dying breed. Without saying RTS CVs were perfect, it should highlight, there's a ton of ways how to handle CV mechanics and it certainly is not restricted to either of the two attempts we saw so far which both were half-assed and plagued by some seriously questionable aspects (RTS AP bombers for example).

That's absolutely winable though. Ibuki is a decent ship, Alaska is not OP.

If it even works. Worst case, you get nothing.

El2aZeR plays mostly Enterprise these days... which has AP bombs.

No. Everything as to why has already been said. Goodness, IFHE rockets would be insane...

Good luck with that. Last time I got into a game with him that I recall, it was still RTS CVs and he murdered half the team while capping B on Shards in the end. I wasn't even angry when I died to torp bombers in the end, just impressed. And frankly, you cannot blame El2aZeR for "killing the game". For one, he's not responsible for the crapshot mechanics we have. He's just enjoying them and highlighting how broken stuff can be, which, well, is to a degree the best you really can do. WG didn't listen to CV mains in years, when it came to balancing CVs and El2aZeR told us all in advance that we'd end up here, so you can't blame him for lying to us to "preserve his toys". Obviously, being good in a CV means that you basically harvest the tears of surface targets, but really, that is up to WG to fix and not the average player's responsibility. I for my part started to play the class because I saw what he and people like Yuro managed to do and because either WG leaves the whole mess as is, then it might be useful for a bit of fun before things go downhill, or they fix it, in which case, I'm not sad either, though at least they cannot as easily claim CVs were unpopular and noone played them. And heck, many posts complaining about CVs have a point, I mostly would just prefer if people kept things factual and not just throw out stuff like "x number of players hates CVs anyway" or "unlimited plane spam is the first thing that needs to go". Because in the end, to make valid points, the first thing to do is properly understand what you are complaining about and why stuff is broken at the moment.

You'd be surprised how little rockets and bombs do to AA. Usually, you'd die before losing most if not all your AA mounts due to CV attack, unless you get rocketted repeatedly by an idiot that uses something like FFARs on your AA without penning your deck (in which case you'd take no damage). Those are HE bombs. And yes, that's a single destroyed AA mount. As to killing 9 planes, you do realise that killing 9 planes over repeated waves is pretty lackluster? Like, even if the enemy CV had lost 4 planes every time, it would have killed you, because lo and behold, even alive, your AA is not up to the job and 4 planes out of a full squad still leaves over half to bomb you into submission. Heck, 9 planes might even be goddamn generous. That Chapayev did basically nothing wrong other than exist with his 890 m turning circle radius. I bet he'd have liked shooting down 9 planes but alas, he only got three of my T7 Kaga torp bombers (without SE) during the multiple passes I made.And I didn't even degrade his AA, given my torps can't do that. This is the state of AA.

Anything with a repair party can get dreadnought, except torpedo bombers. It's typically not uncommon, unless you have an unhealthy tendency to die or an aversion to taking significant damage.

If a CV is terrible enough, they can run out of planes and then it sucks for them. Happens. Guess why at times CVs are way down in the bottom half of a scoreboard. Planes aren't infinite, the hangar has a certain limit and you can only recover so many planes over the course of a match. Also, I don't get why people are hung up on the gradual degradation of AA over the course of the match. Tell you what, your Vladivostok after 8 minutes likely had most of its AA still online. A CV who knows how to limit the damage taken and losses incurred can drop a top tier BB even at the start of the match and if they want to, they can continue harassing that one person till that BB is dead, unless maybe the BB hugs a bunch of Minos/Worcesters/DMs/Salems. 4 minutes is maybe 6 attacks at most. If you are dead with that, well, sucks. But certainly easier to try survive that then even more attacks due to lower cycle time. For a workable solution, CV mechanics as they exist need to go. I don't see a solution within the current system. There needs to be actual hard counter options and to make up for it, CVs need to again be a class that can support and get rewarded for things other than just damage. If I want my CV to be safe, I sit like 10 km behind allies. I have to then fly 15 km just to get to a point where I can spot, because obviously I don't spot anything for a while when air detection on most ships is way below surface detection. If I actually then do a scouting run, searching for enemies, that's additional time in which I don't attack, not dissimilar to a DD that goes on a scouting run but might even get torps off while doing so.

If your win condition is to survive, rushing the CV is basically the way to throw the game. CVs are usually faster than you (only Kaga is slower than the Montana in T8-10 MM), so they can run and stay out of detection forever. Meanwhile, if you drive towards them, the CV has the shortest approach time they can get, while if you move away, they have to bridge a larger distance. Your changes limit damage potential. Damage potential is not what is out of the ordinary for the most part. Lack of counterplay and the absolute trashing of stealth-reliant ships is. Your proposal basically does little to account for that. If I can strike every 5 minutes, yeah, my damage might be terrible, but I can still ruin the game three times, harass a DD or troll a Minotaur. If you mess up, you might even just cause CVs to be absolutely unplayable for the potatoes and decent only for unicums, making it a game where a team with bad CV effectively has one less player for most of the match. Not to mention, your assessment is wrong. If you think that flying my planes across the map for half a minute is "being active", I guess you also always get to steer your ship. Even if planes are fast, they are not teleporting around and even infamous Graf Zeppelin has a longer time to target than a BB firing its main guns. No, you need to consider the full potential too. The issue there then is, how to remodel mechanics that the average Joe isn't left in the dirt. Look at cruisers. Good players get far better results. But even unicums don't wreck other good players anywhere near as hard as a unicum DD can crap over unicum DD players. And WG maneuvered itself into this corner by going for mechanics like these and implementing CVs in a way that makes it so those with no clue do actually worse than they ever did, while those who discover how to cheese mechanics can get incredible results.

There already is a time in whic it cannot be damaged again. It's the time your damage control is active. Admittedly, it's very short. I recommend Last Stand captain skill.

The issue though isn't that unicums or average players throw out lots more damage than they would do if they weren't a CV. Even if unicum CV players can get like 130k average in T10 CV, unicums in cruisers or BBs would manage that too; similarly somewhat competent CV players get results like somewhat competent players in BB or cruisers. The issue is that while these results are obtained, others get screwed over royally, far out of proportion of what it should be. If you just go by damage averages, the rework is pretty much where it should be. But guess what, damage averages aren't what causes the grief and even if the CV was effectively restricted to nuking one ship only to get damage "under control", if that one ship gets harrassed to death with no counterplay, no influence on the battle, that'd still make CVs a toxic class, even if their averages would be in the dumps. No, CVs need to be balanced around all players and around a role that fits into the game. The issue with "CVs need to be balanced around the best CV players" and why it comes up is because WG seems to rather balance around the average potato to avoid having to face that the current mechanics allow people who are good at CVs to kind of overperform, or at least to leave almost no counterplay, being limited by factors such as time or points rather than limits to skill or any way to counter via skill. Obviously you can't balance current mechanics around unicums, because if unicums only do average, then current average does terrible and CV play dies, which is not the intention of the rework. RTS CVs were ultimate alpha for poorest reload cycle. New CVs obviously cannot keep anaemic alpha without getting a much better cycle time. This is what people asked for, no longer getting oneshot by CVs.

There's a reason some people decided to not get Azuma. Yoshino gets 30 mm side and centre deck, 25 mm bow and stern. As for Azuma, I don't need a Yoshino to make it obsolete. Alaska does that just fine.