GulvkluderGuld

Please elaborate on what economic motives that might be? XP would mean progress toward the next ship in li.....oh wait, there isn't one. Changes seem clearly aimed at ranked when taken in context with the posted CV xp changes. Also ranked is near unplayable for other classes with 4 camping BBs and CV that all try to kill the single enemy CA and DD. Having greater representation of the other classes would provide more chances of a comeback.

Good and needed change for Ranked which is overpopulated with BB. No doubt they will cry. Ofc WG being WG they dont buff the other classes. Nope. Never that. It was always infuriating how those backline 20 km sniping BBs with full hp at the end of battle could save their star when instead they could have won the match easily if willing to position where their paint might get scratched.

I never noticed secondaries were difficult untill they added Schlieffen. Now it's unplayable without AFT to stay out of range. Tried Marceau in ranked, but the secondary gunners dont underlead like real players would At the moment Schlieffen make DDs so useless at anything but spotting, its actually painful. Cant shoot anything while being spotted if it's inside 12 km of a Schlieffen or those terminator gunners will just rape the dd.

Or get tortured by Schlieffen Secondaries

PanasianCLs require Legendary screen module:

From my experience in ranked, Schlieffen is blatantly overpowered already. Unless the objective is to create a braindead faceroll ship with automated gunners so BBs can finally stop looking at the screen while playing, no buffs are needed. Those "trustworthy" socondaries out-dpm'ed a full gunboat harugumo i was fighting in my Småland from a full 10 km away (i lost obviously) each doing about 10k dmg. They also make open water gunboat DDs unplayable, have hydro to dodge torps and those same secondaries make yolo rushing it suicide, even from behind islands. They also melt cruisers and if they dont do it fast enough, there's always those massive torpedo batteries on each side. In short, the only way to stop one is BB guns or long range HE spam, so the poor armor is required for balance. It's either bad armor or bring back Stealth Fire to the game (i think nobody misses that).

I'd rather regrind the entire line of IJN gunboats twice than regrind just the FdG or just the Trashcan. Already tried regrinding them a couple patches ago and even got 200k XP on both before they killed my will to play them. Good thing I've still got 2,9 mio FXP left after spending 1,3 mio on resetting IJN gunboats and FXP'ing the russian CVs after learning my Serov is jinxed.

Actually, I realized I had forgotten after the first 5 games

Played a few more games with 13 point captain (no IFHE). To even get in range, it pretty much requires one to yolo into the caps with DDs and pray enemy BBs will not dev strike it on the way. Could definitely use a few km more range - or better reload for when it finally gets in range. On the plus side, the guns can lob shells over the moon so even taller islands BBs usually hide behind cant block them. 2 games as top tier with 70k and 90k. 3 games as bottom / middle tier requires a miracle to break 20k. I'm forced to conclude a Gadjah Mada is more effective at doing everything the Chumphon can do (apart from shooting down planes), but it it can still have good games as top tier.

Two Chumpton games. 90k dmg first game, 2-3 kills as top tier. Having 3 BBs push into me and eating torpedoes helped alot. 12k dmg as bottom tier and not for lack of trying, but how do you even get in range of anything on tier 9 with only 12 km range and 4 dds/CV? And God forbid some ship wanders into 11 km range, the shells dont land before the game ends! Have a Flint and loved it untill the made CV reeeework. Now its only suitable for operations.

2022 Year of "the tier you must not name". Mecklenburg = tier X Scharnhorst?

send replay to jingles!

Had a 3.30 min match two days ago while blowing off snowflakes. Short match times are good, not bad.

Sorry, but I'm not fact checking every memory item, not when there are smart people here who can correct minor oversights like this. Thanks. I also wondered if any normal DDs could pen 25 mm if they specced IFHE, but decided against mentioning it since I'm literally too lazy to do the calculations. You're welcome to shed light on this if you like

For all those BB players who complain about secondaries not being strong. Here's the result of a fight to the finish between Daring and Småland with a sidekick of GK secondaries for the 20-30s duration the fight lasted. DD distance 4 km, GK at around 6,5 km. Must say I was surprised how much damage the secondaries did especielly since this includes active dodging using the throttle. No Idea what the GK ran for captain build or modules, but he didnt farm anything for the last 30s. What do you guys think? OP? UP? Fair? Småland 16k Daring 14k GK secondaris: 8,8k GK primaries 2,2k Tbh I think since the rework secondaries are so effective long range that it isnt efficient to open water gunboat inside their range, even 11-12 km, unless the target it almost dead. Seems too strong to me. I know Flamu did a test, but I wonder if he tried at different distances.

6 BBs 1 CV every random game and 3 BB 1 CV every ranked. Can we please put an end to this?

They are very different ships and playstyles. In a 1v1 Ragnar will win every time unless it takes torpedoes. As a cap contester, Småland is still superier due to much faster consumable cooldowns and better stealth. Ragner has fewer charges and much longer cooldowns, especially on speedboost, is a bigger target and much less stealthy. Ragnar generally loves 1v1, where it can leverage it's 30 mm HE pen and superior shell speed and accuracy as well as 25 mm armor plate which makes it impossible to deal with for DDs (bar Harugumo and 150 mm germans). Ragnar is really a minicruiser without a citadel, and it's perfectly acceptable to pick a 1v1 with a cruiser or BB too. I've dumpstered full hp CAs (non russians) in Clan Wars without issue. It's also excellent at burning bowtanking russians from behind cover. Overall Ragnar is very strong at its designed role but quite one dimensional and is best played along a dedicated spotting DD. Småland is the more versatile pick and I've ended up preferring the Småland due especially to consumable uptime, stealth and torp availability.

Hated Z-23 but that was years ago. Z-46 was playable but i dont remember it as being especially good. Many players seem fond of the Z23 and Z46 these days, so the mileage may vary.

There are also Ohio, Republique and several other BB you didnt mention. The topic was meant to include them all. Rightfully I should probably have included a "?" in the title to reflect the question in the first post: are secondaries OP, UP or Fair. The question was meant a bit more specific, related to both the specific experience and open water gunboating at longer ranges, but this is open to the readers interpretation. The experience I considered it very abnormal since damage was higher dpm than many DDs would be able to output with perfect aim during the same timespan.

The topic was about secondaries, it says right in the title. Not my fault if you jumped to conclusions. If I meant GK secondaries or german secondaries, it would have said so. Whether Yamato secondaries can do this or not I've not the faintest idea about since nobody specs yamato for secondary range.

Thanks for the contructive feedback. You are completely right about the final outcome, but the game was lost beyond recovery so the play only mattered for saving a star. It was a suicide play by nature where I expected to ambush and trade with the Daring while GK was partially blocked from shooting me. Didnt work because Secondaries could fire over islands where primaries couldnt. Also thanks for the feedback about the damage evaluation - I happen not to agree, since there are hybrid DDs and not a few of them which couldnt have matched that damage output. Shell flight time at 6 km should be > 6 seconds, probably more like 8 since the fastest shells go about 800-850 m/s, but you could well be right anyway. Will watch out for it, thanks!

Err, is that a personal attack since you cant stay on topic or does it just read like one? We can agree this was a learning experience. I just got surprised by how bad the experience turned out the one time when i wasn't being careful Wrong again. I'm talking about secondaries, GK just being the incidental example here. Back up your words by playing Marceau or Khaba gunboating in the open vs Schlieffen and post a replay of it. Yep, tried that and also with Ragnar and Småland. Those secondaries are almost homing shells, so good at flying over even tall hills. This, although with all the hydros swanning around, even torp DDs are a bumpy ride. Thanks, that is exactly what I find to be the issue with secondaries.

And I'm telling you match duration is irrelevant. The issue here is secondary DPM making DD gun duels near unplayable (read: too risky) despite sitting behind an island which main guns cant shoot over. Sure I miscalculated the damage, but I'm sure when you go brawling in a GK, you dont expect the enemy ship that cant even use its main weapons on you to remove 40% of your HP in 20-30 seconds. Anyway, I wanted to know what you guys thought and I see most here are crazy BB enthusiasts, so I rest my case. Will be flying FDR and Nakhimov and farming BB tears, knowing it's a perfectly fair player interaction since BBs cant fight back and are okay with being my free XP pinatas. Very technical, but arguing for making secondaries more tolerable and yamato buffs cant be bad!

Actually they did, since the engagement lasted less than 30s. And even if they only do the same amount of damage, where does that leave things like player skill and ship-ship interactions? GK landing >50% shells at 6,5 km against an actively evading, stern in DD? Not your average GK volley unless you have a different ship in port called GK than i do. Horisontal dispersion is too great. With Montana I'd agree with you, but for GK I'd say even 8k is a good volley. Good joke. I'd like to able to use the Harpoon missiles my Småland is equipped with too. On paper they could shred several ships before they load in. 1. Thanks. 2. Wrong about the second part, first part is debatable since the GK wasnt even the main target. 3. Seems you guys really love your automated secondaries. 4. Secondary accuracy would only need to taper off at range. Currently getting spotted for 5s within 12km of a german ships means losing 10-20% hp if your are a DD (unless handy hard cover is available). That severely limits cap contesting and DD vs DD interactions since it's simply safer to spam torp boats around the edges. Would love to try player controlled secondaries too But yeah, probably too OP too.

What does that have to do with AI controlled weapons? 404 No logic.