Culiacan_Mexico

An add on: I do question radars effect on overall game play, as I see it in a very similar way to long term smoke.... somewhat detrimental to the flow of the game. A Battleships or Cruisers in some cases face with a near permanent wall of smoke... just stop. I have stop multiple aggressive tier 8 BBs in their path, in a Farragut, just by putting up a wall of smoke. I have never been comfortable with the game mechanic (although I used it a lot), as I am uncertain about how it effect the game as a whole. Now one could argue that the BBs should have came with the proper support, but... in randoms? Radar has a similar effect but against DDs.

Agreed, when to use AP and when to use HE is a skill players must learn. Sometimes the choice is clear other times... As for Radar, I don't think it rewards bad DD game play.

I feel WG smoke game rewards bad play. DD should be spotting, screening and scouting from their team... a lot, but the rewards for some/many DDs is to set in smoke and just shoot. While WG sort of gives DD the idea that capping has value, everything else but damage is not really directly rewarded. Many DD player follow game mechanic/rewards and learn bad game play...spotting, screening and scouting is worth very little. Damage is highly rewarded.

Game play doesn't fail into two separate categories, but more a sliding scale along a line. We all do it: examine the tactic situation, make a choice, and then... live with the results. Did you make the best choice, the worst choice or something in between. So the question was:"...how could any game mechanic reward bad play?..." Long ago 20Km Shima torpedoes rewarded bad game play. High tier was a wash with these players learning/using bad tactics; and the game rewarded them. Thankfully, WG changed game mechanic and that is over. But the thing is this, if there is game play that falls between the absolute of good and bad, then game mechanic would also not be absolute. They can reward bad play to some extent. For example, (IMO) I don't play CV, but the removal of auto drops from some tier is teaching new players to rely on auto drops. I believe that auto drops are considered bad CV game play, yet game mechanic teach new CV player to use them and reward them for it. Look at BB HE, is this a case in which game mechanics are rewarding players for sub optimal choices?

You are making a definitive statement "And you cant profit from it." If you watch Flamu review other players game he points out example were bad game play does work for them. They profit.

Why do assume it is binary? Everyone has bad play. As flamu has repeatedly said if he went over his games he could find many incidents of bad play/choices. Isn't the goal to minimize them, to learn from them and improve?

Depending on your definition of bad play... BB camping is supported by game mechanics... in particular the consistent lack of CV threat. If you listen to this particular group of players they often say the same thing: "I moved forward and supported a cap once and died, so I will never do that again. I will sit at the back and use my gun range." Since they never learn how to position their BBs well, sitting the back does better for them than moving forward and just dying. Now what they should obvious do is advance their skills, but between the first two option the game mechanics rewards them when they camp.

If you work to learn game mechanic, how each ships works, actually accept responsibility for improving your game play... you have the answer to your question. Six months from now you can smile and laugh. Good luck. Linkaex- So if I play bad the rest of my team is also bad?!?

When I first started playing, I moved up very quickly through the tiers, without ever really learning to play each ship well. I never grasped the fundamentals of DD game play. I would recommend you move to a much lower tier and take your time learning game mechanics/DD play.

High tier and low tier were similar with around 2.5 DDs per team. High Teir BBs seem to average around 5.5 per team. Russian DDs being equated with other DDs at high tier seems a bit unbalancing due to the reasons you stated. IMO Last Week 22.7% DD H 45.4% BB H 23.2% DD L maplesyrup Accounts 3420193 (Hiddens) (18945)

All that has to happen is for the team, with the Russian DDs, to recognize the standard tactics situation is now altered, adjust their game play as a group, and counter what MM has given them. How hard could that be? In randoms... WG should really look at this issue.

A DDs alone who smokes... it isn't good for them. They are blind. If the enemy DD is alone and in smoke (no hydro or radar), I attack in a DD or a cruiser. I have the element of surprise. Farragut is a great DD for this. Like a mad terrier, it should never allow a rodent in it's territory.

So all DDs would work like a Tier 10 Russian DD. Wouldn't that be fun.

One on one? Cruiser vs DD? This is a virtual auto win for the cruiser.

Cruiser vs five BBs per game... is it wise for a cruiser to cap early? Back in the day of 3.5 BBs per game, cruisers still had to make good choices before they moved into caps. Radar offers no protection from Battleship and Cruiser AP/HE.

For me, it is a question of the game play I like. So, a completely selfish view. My first introduction to hydro was when the German cruiser line came out; because as a DD main I wanted to see how this new anti-DD tool was working so I gave it a try... and I loved it. I had the ability in the Königsberg to attack DDs in smoke by analyzing their position, then taking an taking an aggressive approach, before attacking. Smart aggression was rewarded. I am not a good cruiser player, but I had 176 games played with a win rate of 63.07%. Short range hydro on cruisers, based on the play styles I like, is rewarded. Long range hydro and radar are a completely different matter, as they punish close in tactics, while reward caution and long range torpedo spamming. I played during the days of 20Km Shima torpedoes (I was in the Fubuki)... and I hated it. Not because they were much of a threat to me, but because it reinforced a game play style I dislike.... long range snipping.

I don't care for radar as it is currently, as it discourages DD risk taking in the form of close in positioning. This type of radar in game was never needed; what was needed was the removal of long range torpedoes, and rewarding smart tactical game play.

Co-Op can teach you about your ship: its handling/capabilities.

I have no idea what is correct, the screen shots supplied in this thread seem to indicate no top tier matching with DDs. I never gave it much though.

Does it? "As of patch 0.5.8.0, matchmaker will make matches with an equal amount of top tier Battleships and Cruisers and with the same amount of Carriers of the same tier"

Different abilities/roles.

WG should, but I am not sure they can or will.

I checked some stats... CVs can be the most influential ship on our team, and it sucks when your CV player is 'poor'. There isn't much you can do about it other than try to adapt and know that the odds are 50-50 the better CV player will be on your team next game.