Sea_viper

My Karma actually went up during the ranked season even though I am a massive n00b who brings the Warspite in rank 12 LOL Anyway, my experience is that it is much more helpful (and less offensive to others) by telling them what I am planning to do before offering suggestions. Another thing is that try to ask for support as early as possible. (This is especially true for Hiryu/Saipan captains, since their attention is all over the map) For example, at the beginning of the game DD often spam 'requesting fire support' or 'please stick together' = no useful information 'Going to cap A， Fighter pls?' = CV can reserve some fighter and expect to provide support 'Please spot that DD pls' When an red DD runs away = CV is most likely trying to manual drop/strafe covering friendly/ scouting the other DD. Thus cannot help on time. UNLESS there is a fighter already standing by because you asked earlier

No, Angling Warspite at around 60 degree is actually a terrible idea. For a start, the bow of Warspite can bounce 14 inch shell only because of the overmatch mechanic, which basically need you to point your bow directly towards incoming fire. This is true for most BBs unless you know the guns shooting at you will overmatch your bow hull plates, than it is better to angle according to the citadel armor, (Which only US BB have enough citadel armor to consider this) What makes angling at 60 degree such a bad idea in Warspite though, is that the internal bow armor plates above the water line are sloped backwards, so at 60 degrees, the internal bow armor plates are basically flat against incoming shells. Since the hull plate no longer auto bounce shells, even 14 inch shell will do penetration damage if they aim a bit higher. When facing guns with 15 inch+ shells, Warspite WILL eat penetration damage from shells that hit anywhere besides the belt at any angle. Yes, the armor is THAT bad.

I did't shoot at any of the dds with my 15 inch guns I also have +20% AA instead of secondary upgrads I have boat load of flags and premium consumables though P.S. Not saying there's nothing wrong with the ship, but its AA and secondaries can be so troll, they even hit the friendly NM

WG make this ridiculous weak spot at the forecastle that is only covered by 25mm of armor, so 16 inch AP and 8 inch HE are guaranteed to penetrate regardless of angle. Don't ask me WTH that guy was thinking when there is a 44mm deck inside that module.... of course tier 8 games will be rough... I have a feeling that WG just punish the player base that is trying so hard to make certain ships work. I think those who bought Warspite probably have more knowledge about battleship then those who only knew Iowa, Yamato and Bismark... of course the ship would perform better under educated hands. Yet I have the gut feeling that WG just looks at the stats and say "Oh, Warspite have higher average exp and WR than the other two tier 6 BB! NERF BAT TIME!" Other Historically significant premium ships that got ridiculous handicaps Mikasa -- flagship of IJN at Tsushima terrible 12 inch guns and short ranged secondaries Yubari -- test bed that make IJN cruisers (after kuma & friends) what they were Got 4 gun config instead of 6 gun config and force it to be an AA ship (it never was)

I don't think there is much difference between draft of the two figures. But obviously the ship is very lightly loaded in game. But looking at the armor scheme, I really don't think this is the major issue. I consider the problem of the "casemate" module much more serious and ridiculous as discussed in #66 http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/48276-warspites-armour/page__st__60__pid__1033156#entry1033156 For those tl;dr, Warspite in game could be sunk by constantly shooting through its BLOODY FORECASTLE. Which only have 25mm of armor all around... (It is a pity that the 3D and armor model is quite good...)

The armor model have undergone changes to match the armor scheme in real life, I am very certain about it. Some noted the armor scheme is "patchy", well... it is true IRL too. The Warspite was commissioned before WWI, which means the armour scheme do not works for: plunging fire, shells traveling underwater, torps, divebombs etc. And there is only so much that could be done in a reconstruction. On the flip side, the NM's armour scheme is also not immune to Warspites guns. And Warspite have a much better damage repair party

As a true RN lover, jutland flag is a trivia compares to… EQUAL SPEED CHARLIE LONDON

The AA mechanic is so ridiculously broken not because of the raw DPS, but how WG decided to make DP guns contribute to most of the damage AND blanket nerf to multiple mount AA. Most importantly..... (more on that later) 1. It make AA spec cruisers set up a massive no-fly-zone rather then sailing close to the friendly it escort. It is also not historical, since medium AA is most successful in terms of AA. This "feature" makes AA escort way too simple and boring. The ideal situation should be that long AA will disrupt attacks, medium AA do the actual killing and short range AA just retaliate. 2. WTF single mount in with open sight will have more dps per gun then radar ranged equivalent? I am looking at Warspite's pom-pom... I can find all the pompom directors with type 282 ranging radar and turns out pompom do less dps per gun then 20mm with open sight... REALLY? (I am aware of the problems with the pompom, BUT it already got crap range compair to bofors already... which is running the mk 51 director with no ranging equipment... on Cleveland) Oh, look at the AA dps of high tier US dd is even more funny, Fletcher (5 guns) have more AA dps then Gearing (6 guns). WHAT BLOODY NICE WG LOGIC! (AND DON'T bs me with how multiple mounts are inefficient, since under DIRECTOR control, having concentrated guns is BENEFICIAL to reduce errors could be made in the FC chain) 3. If you guess BARRAGE ability is the crux of the problem, give yourself a cookie Now you know the answer look at the ability again x3 dps AND panic ALL squad in range Imagine two squad of TB trying to cross drop a ... Fletcher with AA ability, when BARRAGE is active the 5"/38 a) manage to put up 3x fire (plus x1.3 to a designated one) to the planes and panic both squad... the punch line is... there is only 1... ONE Mk 37 directors! How the F did you manage 3x dps and panic two squad from both side your ship!? Let me side step a bit and let you watch watch what barrage REALLY means... From 1:50 "Barrage sacrifice accurate prediction for the volume of fire" This translate in game to... a) no stacking with designation b) REDUCED dps (per squad) c) PANIC WG, WHAT THE FXXK? I will list how changing the above things closer to real life solves many in game problems. Changes 1. barrage ability no longer gives buff to large AA dps but remain the panic ability, and no designation bonus for large AA during barrage 2. add a BIG multiplier (x3/4/5 depending on FCS and different lines) for designated target to all medium AA with modern director control (no slap on open sight guns will get that bonus) so average AA ship can defend itself with some reliability 3. Nerf large AA dps, but add something back a) TACKLE and PANIC when DESIGNATED a target for ships with good long AA guns and FCS (USN ) (flying in straight line in a barrage is brave, flying in straight line when pointed by modern long AA is suicidal) (If WG decided that giving all modern AA ship with TACKLE is too much, it would be ok just to make BARRAGE and designated tackle a active/passive relationship for AA ability) Results 1. No more WTF moments when all the squads suddenly melt because of Cleveland pop barrage 5km from your squads.... 2. Designation becomes much more useful, and squads now melt one by one instead of together 3. more skill dependent on both side (CV players have more ships to worried about but will not lose all squads in an instant, while most ship have some strike resistance but not always inflict crippling plane kills) 4. AA escort now have two level: Panic the attack (could be done in range) and melt planes (need to sail much closer) 5. CVs can choose to do long drops (by the "calm squard" ) to save its plane (low risk low reward) 6. barrage still ruins CVs attack and group up ships will HURT A LOT 7. NO FANCY REWORK, just putting together existing mechanics, the aura/dps concepts still hold 8. Now USN strike and IJN strike have two approach to the same problem: US use DB to brute force through AA and wrecked the medium AA on deck BUT it may take multiple run just to clear the AA and there will be loses every time DB run the gauntlet (not to mention coordinated AA) IJN use multiple squads (especially TB) to fool the poor soul Unsyc attack will back fire so hard... 9. AA mechanic will be more fun then "fire and forget" for AA cruisers ATM 10. More faithful to real life (just a small bonus compare the game play advantages)

If you read the link you gave, you should know the quote is wrong. 1. area under 6mm deck is a small module that most likely don't have much hp. to citadel from that point means going through 32+89mm deck. 2. her main citadel are covered by 89mm slope behind the 330mm belt, unless you turn and lift the whole belt out of water, citadel through those area is rather impossible. 3. For that forward citadel... it is a long story in the post you linked. in short, no shell smaller then 15inch could reach it reliablely because it is under water and have a 25mm roof (+32 mm deck above it, but 15inch+ shell can pass through the 102mm belt and overmath the 25mm roof) Conclusion: bow tanking is possible to same tier or lower ship, but you will get punish really hard if things go wrong

Of course it is a mistake, but that's not the point. it is not fun for both sides. AA cruisers now only have to press one button to neutralise any strike, which is just lame... so why not give cruisers the ability to disrupt and melt designated squad for the entirity of the game while having to give up some killing power when panicing all squad in range? I find that could make AA much more interesting

I think the current implementation where AA = killing planes is creating this false dilemma. CV captains nowadays will regularly see their planes got melted just because an AA cruiser pop defensive fire at the other side of the island While BBs captain who did not invest much in AA find his AA virtually useless and all he can to is to dodge and weave till he sink And AA cruiser captains just look at the next concentrated attack an push T to watch fireworks and get bored. I don't think ANYONE is happy about the AA as of now. Long range AA's most important job is not to kill planes, but to disrupt attacks and protect the ship. And I don't think this should be an ability exclusive to AA cruises. Why not let all ships with enough large AA guns panic designated targets while cutting down the Raw dps. This way planes will not suddenly melt, perfect attacks becomes more difficult, and designation will be useful even if the AA is relatively week

What really makes me mad about the AA is that they decided too add Warspite with her full radare suite after the 1942-3 refit which include 1x type 281 Air search radar, 4 x type 283 ranging radar for each pompom and two type 285 on HACS director for the 4inch gun... (the modeling of the ship is THAT GOOD to find all these detail) yet now the AA is comparable to Fuso where most of the AA comes from those rubbish 25mm with open sight...

Add one to the list In 0.5.6, AA of Fuso and NM will be buffed, while Warspite AA remains unchange (which got nerf hard in 0.5.3)

The power of That is why I hope the game would shift Long AA into what it should do: to disrupt attacks rather then melting planes. If the lethal zone is at mid range, the plane loss will be much lower then it is now, On the other hand, the drops will also be disrupted more often then it is now. I doubt AP divebomb whould change the damage of USN CV much, especially when the 1000lb bombs already do much damage AND stack fires. The deck lay out of CVs is another topic which is better discussed in another post

From my experience in my Warspite, the 4 inch secondaries will reliablely do 0 damage in a brawl XD

The AA mechanic is so ridiculously broken not because of the raw DPS, but how WG decided to make DP guns contribute to most of the damage AND blanket nerf to multiple mount AA. Most importantly..... (more on that later) 1. It make AA spec cruisers set up a massive no-fly-zone rather then sailing close to the friendly it escort. It is also not historical, since medium AA is most successful in terms of AA. This "feature" makes AA escort way too simple and boring. The ideal situation should be that long AA will disrupt attacks, medium AA do the actual killing and short range AA just retaliate. 2. WTF single mount in with open sight will have more dps per gun then radar ranged equivalent? I am looking at Warspite's pom-pom... I can find all the pompom directors with type 282 ranging radar and turns out pompom do less dps per gun then 20mm with open sight... REALLY? (I am aware of the problems with the pompom, BUT it already got crap range compair to bofors already... which is running the mk 51 director with no ranging equipment... on Cleveland) Oh, look at the AA dps of high tier US dd is even more funny, Fletcher (5 guns) have more AA dps then Gearing (6 guns). WHAT BLOODY NICE WG LOGIC! (AND DON'T bs me with how multiple mounts are inefficient, since under DIRECTOR control, having concentrated guns is BENEFICIAL to reduce errors could be made in the FC chain) 3. If you guess BARRAGE ability is the crux of the problem, give yourself a cookie Now you know the answer look at the ability again x3 dps AND panic ALL squad in range Imagine two squad of TB trying to cross drop a ... Fletcher with AA ability, when BARRAGE is active the 5"/38 a) manage to put up 3x fire (plus x1.3 to a designated one) to the planes and panic both squad... the punch line is... there is only 1... ONE Mk 37 directors! How the F did you manage 3x dps on two squad from both side your ship!? Let me side step a bit and tell you what barrage REALLY means... From 1:50 "Barrage sacrifice accurate prediction for the volume of fire" This translate in game to... a) no stacking with designation b) REDUCED dps (per squad) c) PANIC WG, WHAT THE FXXK? I will list how changing the above things closer to real life solves many problems. Changes 1. barrage ability no longer gives buff to large AA dps but remain the panic ability, and no designation bonus for large AA during barrage 2. add a BIG multiplier (x3/4/5 depending on FCS and different lines) for designated target to all medium AA with modern director control (no slap on open sight guns will get that bonus) so average AA ship can defend itself with some reliability 3. Nerf large AA dps, but add something back a) TACKLE and PANIC when DESIGNATED a target for ships with good long AA guns and FCS (USN ) (flying in straight line in a barrage is brave, flying in straight line when pointed by modern long AA is suicidal) Results 1. No more WTF moments when all the squads suddenly melt because of Cleveland pop barrage 5km from your squads.... 2. Designation becomes much more useful, and squads now melt one by one instead of together 3. more skill dependent on both side (CV players have more ships to worried about but will not lose all squads in an instant, while most ship have some strike resistance but not always inflict crippling plane kills) 4. AA escort now have two level: Panic the attack (could be done in range) and melt planes (need to sail much closer) 5. CVs can choose to do long drops (by the "calm squard" ) to save its plane (low risk low reward) 6. barrage still ruins CVs attack and group up ships will HURT A LOT 7. NO FANCY REWORK, just putting together existing mechanics, the aura/dps concepts still hold 8. Now USN strike and IJN strike have two approach to the same problem: US use DB to brute force through AA and wrecked the medium AA on deck BUT it may take multiple run just to clear the AA and there will be loses every time DB run the gauntlet (not to mention coordinated AA) IJN use multiple squads (especially TB) to fool the poor soul Unsyc attack will back fire so hard... 8. More faithful to real life (just a small bonus compare the game play advantages

Since the Nagato shells overmatch all 25mm plate, there is only one 32mm deck and 102mm internal belt and bulkhead that covers the foward citadel... yea, will totally slice right through

Errr... the said ship is not theoretical at all... Your discription fits the Aoba nicely with the exception of NOT being able to invis-fire... And Aoba is a very good ship. Lesson: Zao is not only good at invis-fire and IJN line in general excel in hunting ship down. ie. Rain fire on BB and wiggle Ap on broadsides CA/BC HE on anything else (IJN CA can duel German CA when angled) Take Hydo for dd hunting (German find faster and IJN kill faster) Againt CV:…… emmm.... help…… USN CLs……?! Torps are for (failed) Banzai charges LOL (and seriously: retreating actions) But IJN CAs are terrible escort ships becase they take damage too easily. They don't have enough AA to escort and always eat cit from BBs, hydro not good enough for finding torps and dd without breaking off and brawling is suicidal... So I think it is just a matter of playstyle, feel free to try other lines if you always got one shotted lol

I think I found why Warspite may feel very soft for some people now. I was playing in the ocean map just now and bow on towards a Fuso and NM, I bounce most AP shells no problem, then come the HE.... OUCH, it hurts A LOT! (the heal kinda save my [edited] long enough to win) So I decided to check the module and armour model again to see what may went wrong. So "casemate" module is really big, notice there is a part that is one deck above the rest of the module? Those are where the secondaries are located. Guess how many armour covered that part? 25mm which is actually fairly accurate to real life That's not where the fun ends, the floor of that deck is actually armoured (also fairly accurate) 44mm (38mm infront and after it on the same deck) but this won't stop shells damaging the "casemate" module Question: How can a single module be divided in half by armour that is thicker than what covers it? Let's see it this happens to fuso and NM New Mexico New Mexico is a typical example of All or nothing armor scheme, the "casemate" are safely behind 140mm(!!) of deck armour (and more belt armour), while the "wows_inner_ssc" probably have a relatively small HP pool (Even though it includes all the secondary battery) Which means that after HE depleted the unarmoured upper hull, HE will start to deal 0 damage and will not touch the "casemate" module Fuso Fuso have a massive "casemate" module BUT, The module is bound by 35mm (top), 99mm (bottom) armoured decks and 152-305mm (side) with NOTHING in between, so it make sense to make it as one module (unarmoured decks will be holed by shrapnel anyway) This means that Warspite's "casemate" is basically hanging its [edited] in the air with a rather big HP pool. I must concluded that some one make a mistake with the module placement, even though there is nothing wrong with the armour model. So I think they should divide this module into two by the 44mm armoured deck Before someone jump on me and say that it is "working as intended", I must remind that person one thing, the Queen Elizabeth class battleship have 152mm side armour for the forecastle (secondary batteries) BEFORE modernization. During the modernization, those 152mm armour were removed and deck armour were added, so they basically decided to turn the secondary battery into the "nothing" part" of the armour scheme and focus more on protecting decks below it. If this doesn't change, by the time the Queen Elizabeth class BB roll out (God knows when) with A hull and B hull, people will find that B hull is actually worse against HE, so it is better to change it sooner.

I know Jacky Fisher doesn't like the QEs that much anyways... I really wonder how much bad luck you have to be citadeled by tier VII from any angles, since it rarely happens to me... admittedly I wasd A LOT when I fight higher tier BBs, but that have more to do with losing turrets then anything else. Perhaps I don't have the Warspite for that long to tell how the game shift, but I can't agree that German and RU cruiser line make the Warspite less competitive. Since I would love to see the enemy team filled with those thin-skin cruiser more than anything else. Also with the great damage repair party, tanking one or two tier VII or VI cruisers is rather safe. And the AP are really consistent and can do damage to high tier BB and bow on cruisers reliably. Anyway the ship still works great for me and your opinion may vary. One more thing on Warspite AA, when the Queen Elizabeth class BB is in game, it is almost certain that it will get the hull upgrade with 20 DP guns . Which means the New York/ Texas scenario reversed

Well... nagato and colorado can also take cit through the front against their own guns...

I played today and didn't notice any differences thus far

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/59399-premium-ship-review-hms-warspite-20/page__st__80#topmost Littlewhitemouse's review of the Warspite have a very detailed discussion on the repair party. The guide have many useful advise too! I hope it helps

Special thanks to Magoyras who manage to win by capping Lets buff this ship. I surely wouldn't mind if WG buff her gun range to 20km, so with the spotter plane up, she can hit the record shot distance, around 24km. Jokes aside, I have been looking at the armour model of Warspite and there are definitely changes going on, especially around the bow area with some internal deck armour. From what I see, they are trying to make armour arrangement more accurate to real life. The work have not finished and there will be changes (until it is as detailed as say... Fuso's armour model) BUT the changes are relatively minor and have not affect me too much. As for those who really have a problem with its range, get a premium spotter plane. I find it very useful for the extra range and give me a better view of the target course. For those who think Warspite have poor armour... I am quite sure Fuso is worse AND the damage repair is much much better on the Warspite (and with dreadnought flag is great). BTW, who say 5s immune is not enough? If you use a premium damage control, it have a 1 min cool down, on a BB! (and NO, You won't lose money using two premium consumables in tier 6 if you do alright) Honestly, tier 6 BB are all great AND different, it is better to leave it this way.

Great Job! I think WG is still working on Warspite's model, it seems that it got updated quite a lot, seems that there are updates in v0.5.5 test server too. (I can't look at it though) One thing to note though, Since Warspite does not use All or Nothing armour scheme, there is no well defined armour bulkhead to define a citadel area. Citadel in battleships not only covers the mechanically important vitals (e.g. Magazines, Boiler/engine rooms), it also includes Buoyancy/stability critical areas, or in other words, flooding in seemingly non-critical part inside the citadel will greatly impart the ships stability. (like SMS Lutzow and SMS Seydlitz) I think RN engineers are aware of this. you can see form the deck plan of hold. Notice the bulkhead with two 4e (1 inch HT) plates that cover all the important compartments with some extra? That is probably the area that is critical to the stability of the ship, so I kind of agree the citadel placement.