pra3y

Actually the op is kind of messy. It starts off saying its not a post about CV players, complains about how AP bombs can destroy an AA built Montana ( if you're interested have a look at the link EL2aZeR posted. He tested AP bombs on various targets to see what they're actually effective against. Very useful and interesting), then complains about good cv players vs bad cv players and finally talk about how he's not going to play USN CV anymore cause WG removed his favourite AS loadout. I'll rather he just talk about their being a skill level disparity between CV players and therefore there should be an option to opt out of CV games, although I'll still say no since one reason apart from what has already been said by others is that CVs can also be stopped by non-CV ships, albeit harder. Plus shooting down planes give me xp and credit as well so why wouldn't I want CVs in game

Part of it is a CV debate. On one hand, you have a group of CV players who feel that the changes to the USN CV line is good and is helping to revitalise the line. Then you have another group who believe that WG has doomed the USN CV line by removing their favourite AS loadout, which is actually what holding back the USN CV line. BTW this is the 3rd or 4th topic on the general gameplay section on this matter. Initial stats suggest that the change has improved USN CV gameplay and made it more balanced between the 2 CV line compared to previously.

I know Moskvas are somewhat tanky but I never knew they can be this tanky: I still don't know how i survived all those shelling.

Dang it I was too late

That's why I posted why I posted. Sometimes people should just stop and think a bit about it. It was annoying to watch Flamu and Teacupyuri discussing on stream how overpowered it is when Flamu hasn't tested it out cause it was "disgusting" based on Midway's previous 2 TB iteration. 2x6 TBs They really drop like flies though if you push them too much. Given that we haven't seen a topic on how op those 2 TBs are after a week I think most people are ok with it.

Come on Negativvv I'm probably one of the last person that wants to be able to strike anything with impunity in a CV. I'm just sick of people not considering certain factors before remarking that the new Midway TBs are overpowered. I agree with you that the previous double Midway TB is OP. That's why I find that the new Midway is more balanced. On the CV player side, you get the chance to inflict heavy damage provided you pick your target wisely and don't make mistakes in your approach. On the side of the player getting attacked, you have the chance to shoot down those bombers. For both parties that is what I feel is fair. Even with the modules buffing HP, you still can't barge through groups of ships, drop your torps and fly off into the sunset.

I couldn't resist

Midway has tier 8 torpedo bombers. I repeat tier 8 torpedo bombers, not tier 9 not tier 10. They are slower and have far lesser health. If you can't shoot down tier 8 torpedo bombers in an AA built Montana at tier 10, its either because most you AA have already been stripped off or you made a mistake or both. If your team gets sunk by those tier 8 torpedo bombers, you team goofed up pretty bad.

You will not get absolutely destroyed by Saipans. Look at it this way. Alot of different player with different skill levels play the game. You have the equal chance of fighting a super-unicrum guy in Saipan or a potato in a Saipan. Sure you get destroyed now and then by a good Saipan player by how confident are you in saying you've never beaten a Saipan player? I once had a game against a Saipan player (of all things a clan leader ) who didn't know who to strafe. I shredded all his fighters in a dogfight so fast that he reported me for cheating, which was hilarious. Imagine, me in a Ranger, with dogfighting expert (a skill that can be pretty effective), making a Saipan cry cause he can't win against my one and only fighter squadron. I would also add that a Ranger's strike is pretty powerful provided you pick the right target or strike properly. It's actually more newbie friendly to force them to learn how to play CVs properly a) scout b) provide air cover c) do damage. Having AS or strike decks don't force newbies to learn any of that. If anything, those decks are like a form of escapism. Newbies go, " Oh man, I can't win against his fighters. AS decks give me one more fighters so I'll use that instead." They think an extra fighter squadron will help them when it actually doesn't against a more experienced CV player. They also don't consider the fact that do even lesser damage now without any access to a TB squad. I rather them being exposed to reality that CV gameplay can be difficult, but rewards them at the end of the day for their perseverance.

USN TBs have a pretty tight drop so anything that is not a BB can be 1 shot. Add the DB and you get a pretty deadly combo. When you play CV consider the overall game. He has limited plane reserves as well. So if you stop his fighters early game you can focus on his attack planes late game plus do not forget he has to try and stop yours as well if he's not a potato. CV fights don't necessary produce immediate results. If its a newbie playing AS its even worse. They don't know how to strafe or how to protect their team and they barely influence the game they're in. It's better that they be forced to learn how to play a loadout that will benefit them and the team rather then one that doesnt really force them to learn. Short term pain but long term benefit I feel.

You know what is the most useful? Being able to shoot down planes and deal alot of damage, which is essentially what the USN CVs loadouts all do now. Playing AS won't win you the game because the only actual influence you have is on the enemy CV. The rest you have to bet on your teammates making use of you supressing the enemy team's cv or scouting. On the other hand with a balanced loadout you can cover your team as much as possible while influencing the game by taking out key targets so that your team has an actuak higher chance of winning. I played only 1/1/1 Ranger, before the patch, 68% winrate, 83,900 avg damage and 28.21 avg planes shot down. Useless? I think not. How you use the strength of USN CV planes to your advantage is the main point. I can strike and defend my teammates.

I present to you around the world in 80 days in a BB: First, a Yamato reversing at the start of the game and making full use of it's excellent range: Next a pair of tier 10 BB looking for penguins by the border: Surprise surprise, another full health Yamato and a barely damaged Montana

I propose Superdupont

I know but I'm talking about it in the context of them being able to DoT good damage.

And thus in this case, you're the problem, not WG. Make some effort to learn how to play.

Really good AS players can deal decent damage as well as taking down planes.

Well, it's a learning and practice experience I guess. The learning curve for CV is just more demanding. Why not give it a try again. If you have any problems or question just pop by the CV sub forum. There is a CV tavern there if you need help.

Well if you look at his CV stats he is a *edited*. Not that I'm not one myself. There is always a place to improve as a player. If you can't improve as a player and blame the game mechanic all the time for your own incompetence then the problem is you as a player. Look at his avg damage, then look at his avg winrate and finally avg planes destroyed as a CV player. Even before this USN CV change, OP is only good at shooting down planes. But his contribution towards the team? Poor damage and poor winrate. And it's WG's fault? So can we blame him for making his team lose? Afterall it's also partially his fault that his team lost isn't it? People like him have to realize that they themselves are the problem. Blaming the game or other people all the time when they refuse to improve or find ways to improve is just plain bad. *This post has been edited by the moderation team due to disrespectful comments.

In a 1v1 click fighter, Ranger's fighters will dominate Saipan's. Plus if you bother to learn to strafe it's manageable. OP enjoys leaving complain threads all over the forums and not coming back to them. *edited* *This post has been edited by the moderation team due to disrespectful comments.

My bad then, but it was because of this statement: I still think it demonstrates the fact that you don't need a full AA built or overwhelming AA to be sufficient in dealing with CV planes. Playing smart with a decent amount of AA is sufficient to fend off CV planes, with added bonus if you're in range of friendly AA.

I think it is a misconception that a huge amount of AA is needed to fend off tier 10 CV attacks or that tier 10 planes are invulnerable to most AA. Was watching Flamu's stream and he and teacupyuri seem to think that the new Midway is OP or something just because of the 2 TBs. But when you stop and think about it, those 2 TB squad are not tier 10 TBs but tier 8 ones and are thus more vulnerable to AA fire. Try to attack any tier 10 ship without proper planning and those planes will just get shredded. I think most CV players will not have issues with buffing the AA of CAs but it has to be balanced out with debuffing the AA of BBs instead. Btw just to correct your misconception on how AA is ineffective here is me in a Fletcher against Midway planes:

What's the purpose of having CAs then? BBs are meant to be played active in concert with CAs, with BBs relying on their health and armor while CAs provide the AA as well as utility abilities. Having BBs have all this consumables undercut CAs and make them no longer a necessity. Why need a CA when a BB can do the same job as well as having better armor and health? There has to be a balance somewhere rather then just constantly buffing BBs by giving them this and that. Why not give CAs better benefits to encourage them to be better team players or ways where they can use their abilities better? The way WG is doing right now is to balance BB against everything else rather than balancing the game as a whole.

To be fair he wasn't stacking his attack planes plus he didn't pull his planes away from me even after suffering so much plane loss. I wonder if he realized it was actually me shooting down his planes.

Let this be a PSA to never keep on flying your planes over or near a DD no matter what tier you're at when it has defensive AA

Question is why do they need it? a) Missouri may be the only BB with radar currently but remember at one point in time WG wanted to give them to British BBs but backed down and said it was just for testing purposes. Trading a plane for it? Definitely worth it. With its AA, only a concentrated strike from a CV can sink it. In addition the plane now last way shorter than it use to be so not having a plane is just a minor inconvenience compared to the benefit of having a radar. b) Most BBs from tier 6s onwards already have very decent AA. Why do they need a defensive AA consumable? DoY lacks a heal? So what? If you put it 1 v 1 against another tier 7 CA that other tier 7 CA will die first since the DoY is a tier 7 "CA" with BB armor and health. It already has an advantage over its same tier "CA". c) Again why do they need it. Poor torpedo protection? Hydro doesn't last forever? Hydro last fairly long in the first place. Worst torpedo protection is not an excuse to benefit it. CAs have the worst protection against BB guns, should they get a consumable that magically buffs their armor? We can give it an active time of say a 1.00 and say it doesn't last forever. Come on its all just bs excuses. The consumables just give BBs and added advantage over classes that they shouldn't have an advantage over. Where is the balance? 22cm said DDs are the only one who should counter BBs. If thats the case why do they have a consumable that counters their counter? If they have to sink then they have to sink, why should they have an advantage? Because some BB players will cry? Like Spellfire40 has said, giving BBs cruiser consumable isn't a good thing. Why would a BB need cruisers then. Everyone can just stick to playing BB since they can perform the same task as a CA, providing their own AA cover, hydro or perhaps in the future an entire line of BB with radar.