EsaTuunanen

Sims got set for closed beta conditions with its "chronic" smoking game which allowed effective use of shorter range torps also in more open areas. Then with heavy smoke nerf after closed beta it got Wakatake's Tier 3 torps as "upgrade". When tech tree USN DDs again got their torpedo changes with introduction of Soviet DDs positioned as ultimate gunboats Sims was probably overlooked. (like Yubari with all game changes) Still bow in or away isn't that representive of average gunnery duel conditions because of only two guns available is simply little unless target is some really bad on guns ship.

So why on average detonations don't happen after ship having taken enough hits for half of its hitpoints if every hit has same individual detonation chance? Because in that case total probability for having gotten one "bad roll" should increase with number of hits received. Among my latest detonations were: Meeting Kamikaze in cap, I fired one salvo getting some hits and second salvo got some hits... While Kamikaze shot one salvo and kaboom. Not sure if I had slight damage, but Minekaze fired one shell from rear gun and kaboom. Schors firing one clearly mostly missing salvo: Kaboom. While I've survived plenty of matches with dozen+ hits taken, down to one or two k hp, even down to hundreds... And once that 1 hp survival. (last hits were from BB) Would be interesting if player stats kept track of killed ships per class. As for part of kills being CVs something like max 5% might be good guess... With 2,36 kills per match and having CV in gunsights in something like 1/10 or less matches. Because I'm believer of "First come, first served" targeting of enemies instead of chasing uncertain damage/kills. Share of kills being DDs is harder to estimate because of also having matches from not meeting them or team mates getting spotted DDs to just that "small game" hunting. (cruiser or two to one way or another) Battleship I've detonated with torps at least couple times. Cruiser detonations I remember five, in last autumn one Furry detonating from first torpedo hit and four detonations from gun shells.One Atlanta, with RNGesus first showing mid finger with something like twenty shells missing, until thumbs up and one shell falling short just the right amount: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ugwi7meogof1f9u/AAB_ln75_8kZbJSYywWE75zua?dl=0 First salvo headshotting factory fresh Königsberg 1m 51s into match. (would have apologized but had next target waiting) https://www.dropbox.com/sh/08taybkmlczh6zc/AACUrTskuxIeCaSVFG85ii6ba?dl=0 And two other Königsbergs, both for once actually already more or less badly damaged.

Kinda reminds me about one Solomons match few months back. In early match I adviced cruisers to not go into center to get uselessly sinked by enemy team's focused fire. Not so awfully many minutes forward and four cruisers had paraded and suicided in there. Fortunately there was one other good player (or at least he clearly used that common sense) in that supposedly so bad Furry Taco and we carried that match to victory... Distorting WR of those four.

No doubt mankind has normal IQ distribution. But it's darn awful assumption that player base follows that. And there's the part that intelligence isn't completely unambiguous to measure and no doubt certain type of intelligence is more usefull for this. And are players even trying/wanting to use that IQ for learning this game? Probably skewing achieved skill correlation to normal distribution further: Lots of average IQ players playing below potential, and low IQ players playing even worse. It would be always easier to that direction. Just like how computers can suddenly make what should be average or very smart and educated person look completely illogical and smart as brick. "Good ol" dumbing down/moving goal posts... If enough samples can't reach the standard, define potato as the new standard.

Which actually turns to 56 detonations per 441 sinkings. (12,7%) Flag used only rarely... As in trying to remember to use one or two as sacrifice for RNGesus after detonation. Not many destroyers in this list considering number of them lost just in WW2: https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/463wu2/historical_magazine_detonations_the_list/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Navy_losses_in_World_War_II http://www.naval-history.net/WW2aBritishLosses10tables.htm So I think we can conclude that destroyers definitely aren't too hard to detonate. Except for completely avoiding getting fired at there's been no relation between detonation and number of hits received! Almost every destroyer (probably around 10) I've detonated has had full or high hp. Only really low hp destroyer was 4½k Blyska... after that next "headshot" was first shell hit detonating factory fresh Izya. And same applies for me getting detonated. It's often from high hp or from full hp, usually by that first salvo from particular ship. Or even one individual shell... Especially from IJN DD, which seem to have special nuclear HE shells, while themselves being almost immune to detonation compared to gunboats.

So are Atlanta and Des Moines also the most OP ships of their tiers because of their paper DPM? It's undeniable Gremlin has lot better torps than Gnevny. But claiming them as best torps of tier is as big fat lie as you pretending being innocent to arrogancy. 8 km range sure allows some "target of opportunity" launches more and collateral/bonus damage hit from other enemy once in a while, but that's the only part better than in IJN or USN DDs: First of all travel time for full 8 km range is almost minute. That gives lots of time for normal/random course changes to throw aim off (or for CV to target same ship) or target ship to die to heavy hit from team mate. I don't even want to try calculating how many torps miss because of that. For better hit chances you need to always get as close as possible, so there's no real automatic advantage over Minekaze. And there are times when needed big lead would make torps run into island before crossing target's path. And torpedo reload speed is slowest of Tier 5 DDs for only two launchers. Both Nicholas and Minekaze can fire individual torpedo launcher salvos at double ROF. So both of them are better for that area denial/distraction/hoping for lucky hits -spam if enemies don't sail in straight lines. And if enemies sail in straight lines Minekaze wins hands down, while Nicholas rules ambushes/brawling. And just like players say about Mutsuki after Minekaze triple launchers also don't give as good spread control as dual launchers: Against lower hp target like damaged BB or cruiser Minekaze can fire just two launchers leaving third for emergency/target of opportunity/target's course change situations. With launchers ready again in 45s instead of 70s.

And why would player skill distribution be that bell/gaussian curve? Just like you said there's no doubt lots of those casual "pew pew pew" potatoes, bots, one IQ point above braindead fail boaters and "I'm playing for the funners". They might even make big majority of the players. But because of this being team game their WR doesn't really represent their true lack of individual skill. They would make big bump to bottom part of the scale below mid point. After them there would be those players actually trying to do their best and trying to learn to become better. These would be more evenly distributed along the scale: Because some of them having started playing game earlier than others and doing various number of matches per day. Then there would be third group of players more or less already having done that learning of the skills process.

Considering overal number of various ships lost destroyers weren't any more prone to magazine detonation than other classes. https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/463wu2/historical_magazine_detonations_the_list/ Main danger coming from propellant/gun powder igniting. Actual explosives needed to be stable to not go bang from small knock (+withstand forces of being shot and penetrating armor) and were inside steel shells... So those would detonate only after major force from actual explosion (not conflagration) of propellant or from continued exposure to fire/heat. For amount of propellant destroyers had sub-10 kg (11kg for Soviet 130mm) per shell, while battleships had upward 300kg (360kg in Yamato) per main gun shell. Then add battleships/cruisers having lots of destroyer caliber or even bigger secondaries... So there was rather huge amount of volatile stuff inside citadel of fully stocked combat ready ship. Just like gun shells also explosive of torpedoes and depth mines wasn't any "shake before use" nitroglycerine needing good high energy hit/impact for detonation. In torpedo fuel would be obvious risk of starting fire, which would eventually cook off explosives in warheads. Long Lance being major exception and couple magnitudes bigger detonation risk... Because of pure oxygen being very reactive and causing powerful fire even in lots of normally incombustible materials. And lots of normally combustible material burning explosively. During Battle off Samar IJN heavy cruiser Chokai was disabled by single 127mm shell causing detonaon of eight Long Lance torpedoes and Suzya was damage by ship missing bomb detonating one launcher of Long Lances... With resulting fires fast detonating other launcher's torps causing further heavy damage and fires. Sure earliest short range destroyers didn't have much of "loose space" even for crew size of destroyers increased fast with increasing range and speed requirements. And while always smaller ships than other classes destroyers also had lot less and smaller caliber weaponry so I don't think they had such big magazines in relation to ship size.

Actually depending on MM luck if checked more comprehensively I suspect distribution might end toward result of one class in certain electric engineering related exam with scale from 1 to 5: Dozen at 2/below Shy handful at 4-5 Few in between. How's that for distribution? Though not so nice thought that some of those class mates might be actually doing some electric installations...

I wouldn't even try to automatically fit players into Gaussian/bell curve in this kind of thing.

So why your signature has Sims in that upper row if it's that fun "wiggle all you want and keep firing" gunslinger? Again Gremlin definitely isn't printing press for credits. Though unlike advertisement for Sims Gremlin is that Universal destroyer.

And why should the most common value be in the center of the scale or some mean average? http://www.perceptions.couk.com/damned_lies.html You forgot suiciding and/or dying in the most useless place.

Here you go http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/28504-funny-wows-ships-nicknames/

You think game goes that far in modeling when to save server resources even new puff of smoke is generated only if you've moved far enough from older smoke puff? And solution to close together situated guns disturbing each other's shell flight if is to add (insignificant for human) firing delay between guns.

Splash damage from shell missing the ship can disable engine/rudder. It can even detonate ship.

While imitating idea of compartmentalization they're actually called sections with every ship having four of them: Bow, midsection, stern and superstructure. Citadel is special module/section inside midsection with "unlimited" HP pool to keep taking out damage regardless of amount of hp in other sections. And BBs are one class which can easily have one section running out of its hp pool while ship still has good amount of hp: Repair/heal adds to ship's total hp pool instead of sections. Because of that for example superstructure can become completely immune to HE shell damage. Same section HP pool thing affects equally torpedo hits. I once hit below 20k hp Myogi to bow with enough torpedoes for 43k max damage. It survived with something like 6-7k hp, and I didn't live long enough to try again. Because of that I don't anymore fire all torps at once to bow of battleship when charging close. That's also why if you're going to get hit by torpedo in destroyer it's better to take it into bow than midsection. Bow section has smaller hp pool than midsection possibly allowing to survive otherwise lethal hit. I've myself occasionally survived because of that. And of course also seen enemy take hit and survive. Don't yourself use excuses. Also gunboat is supposed to be paper for rock of torpedo boats. Just rather flimsy paper if IJN DD player is good. And as for higher tier BB losing to lower tier... Every single ship is weak even against supposedly inferior ship if played badly.

That would work only if you can aim absolutely correctly and guns don't have big dispersion. That multiple scattered shots at once gives chance to hit also if aim wasn't fully correct... Or target maneuvers from correct aim point. Heck, even with destroyer guns firing separates shots doesn't give really notably better hit rate than fulls broadsides. In fact easily opposite: You fire one shot at correct aim, but dispersion makes it fall short so you correct for that... Possibly making low RNG shot miss or over target shot missing even more, causing you to over correct that.

That could be actually even bigger reason for WG to not put it into open sale than actual performance. With the reputation its gotten everyone and their dog would be no doubt buying it. And that could make game play disturbing effect of "Derpitz" introduction look "tempest in a teapot" in comparison. Which shouldn't be wonder because average skills aren't enough to bring out its full capabilities. Besides ship handling/weapon skills part there's all strategic gameplay part needed for getting victory. Ease of stealth firing at some battleships/cruisers might easily have hampering effect to more victory chances increasing jobs.

And BB's already have shots from one turret guns scattering. Sometimes as if turret got split in two...

Well, going into unscouted territory with countering ship's remaining in enemy team and without knowing what's behind corner is either inadequate planning, or calculated risk taking. I guess next complaint will be about destroyer getting nuked by cruiser when blundering into front of one's guns.

So what's the detectability of Mahan? Awesomely short 7,9km so Kagero has all the chances for controlling engagement! So how well could Mahan's mortars hit away running destroyer from that range? Not so well, while IJN's flat trajectory would give lot higher hit rate even without target "coming closer to meet shells". And how many guns of Mahan can fire forward? Straight forward only two. And how many guns can Kagero have firing backwards? Four, firing high damage, high fire chance shells. That alone basically evens Mahan's ROF advantage. So it's the Mahan which draws way shorter stick in such chase fight.

Interesting game mode as idea but feels like that's the probable outcome. And IJN BBs with more range and better long range accuracy would benefit more than slow shorter ranged USN BBs. (stationary targets ideal for max range sniping) While team with more destroyers and ability to cap better at start would have advantage over team with less DDs, which isn't good thing considering MM's abilities. And team with AFK or bad border humping DD players would get screwed more than currently.

You don't want to get there yet. Because with your current performance it would probably end to this kind of situations: Look familiar for "receiving end"? Yes, that's cruisers getting their butts handed to them by destroyer's guns. I don't think you really want to yet play in Tier 4 yet. Because you don't get anymore separate new players match making and even with Tier 3 Tenryo your survival rate and average damage are bad. Also hit rate seems to be dropping seriously from bottom tier ships... And except for IJN destroyers this game is lot about gunnery and being able to hit enemy, so that when that low HP enemy shows easy target he doesn't get many shots at you. Your Co-op and low tier random battle accuracy/hit rate is quite nice, so not sure what happens after that. Is it that you used to go close and got hits that way, but can't anymore hit with increasing range necessary for not dying instantly? When you start getting handle of that hitting targets upwards to 10 second shell flight time next needed step is situational awareness. And not meaning captain skill. You need to constantly monitor your surrounding (especially that minimap thingy) for where your team mates are and same for located enemies... Especially for enemies capable to hurting your ships seriously. Purpose is to not be clearly separate from your team and easiest target for enemy, which leads to fast return to port. Especially if you make yourself easy target for enemy by showing that big broadside. After "suicide avoidance" part you want to preferably attack that lonely enemy pushing ahead of team mates. Also enemies against which your ship class is strong should be prioritized. That helps to keep team mates alive, which in turn helps you to stay alive... Both by continued existence of more targets for enemy to fire at and more fire at enemies sinking them faster.

Gremlin is player skill based ship. Performance ceiling is very high, but there's equally higher doorstep to get over without falling on face. Have seen some unexplainably bad performances in it by team mates and enemies. Nicholas would be lot more forgiving for player's mistakes. Good Kamikaze/Minekaze player would easily outgun bad player in Gremlin and better Nicholas player worser player Gremlin. Not so good players would have easier time in affecting to match in either IJN or USN DD. While torps looks very strong/OP on paper Tier's slowest reload for just two launchers and sluggish speed makes them unreliable damage dealers. As in standard 130mm APs are faster at killing broadsiding cruiser, unless at potato throw distance: Minekaze is lot better in open area torpedoing with quite fast reload and very high torpedo speed. And with twice the number of launchers/torps also Nicholas is better if enemy is pushing agressively, or coming from behind corner/choke point. Stealth firing alone is just way too slow damage dealing method to carry "sub standard" team unless enemy team is really bad or there are few good team mates to prevent team's fast collapse. Besides that neglects one of the primary goals of gunboat destroyer: Pushing forward to cap, scout and deny area for enemy destroyers. Hiding in rear lets enemy destroyers run rampant unless someone else takes care of them, which can easily lead to losing caps and/or fast collapse of flank. And doing that destroyer hunting needs BB like planning ahead because of DD's fragility combined to Furry Taco fast gun traverse. So sorry to be blunt, but I don't think you would feel any OP in it.

Start practising. Lovely suicide team here if you follow minimap with two BBs and to CLs uselessly suiciding into torps. Two others have been victory by points. One with friendly cruiser sinking just before he got fourth last enemy and I managed to just slip from other enemy cruisers into cover for long enough to counter reach 1000 points. Latest one was in Fault Line with team getting two caps early and big lead in points, until team started to die with enemy pushing into caps. Then skilled enemy Fuso avoided two torpedo attacks so I just rushed to get cap originally capped by enemy. That would have been enough for win, but then enemy Mutsuki plain suicided... because what else is unsupported ~50% hp Mutsuki looking for high health gunboat? One I don't remember anymore. And then there was that 9 kill carnage and screwing "working as intended" match maker back. Missed meeting only Fuso, one cruiser and other Nicholas.