Affeks

Mutsu just needs a small buff to accuracy imo Right now it has only really gun size as a strength, the combination of bad pen with only really good accuracy at range is bad. Your strength is in sniping, but the terrible pen doesnt let you really pen at all on long ranges. Forcing you to play aggresive, but then the bad turning circle and high citadel really makes you suffer at times. I love the ship and its fun to play, but it really doesnt give me the results other ships can.

ASHITAKA! ASHITAKA! ASHITAKA! Would buy any day.

If they keep the secondary range I will buy this carrier no matter what loadout it has. The thought having a brawl capable carrier is quite nice and there isnt many other carriers in history that has the secondary loadout close to Graf Zeppelin. If they nerf the secondary range count me out.

I dont think wg would give it 25 sec reload and I really dont think they should either since it is a very underwhelming gun. Low velocity and bad gun handling, with not really any redeeming factor other than being kinda heavy compared to other 14" guns. Other than that why would you ever defend the ship placed at tier 8 with the argument that it would be great at fighting lower tiered ships?! As well as the argument that CAs will die by other means by not turning?! "ITS BALANCED BECAUSE TEAM WILL KILL IT" lmao! If thats the case then why not just chose a ship that can devastate it no matter how much it angles. Then again you said "so what" so I guess nothing will get through to ya

Why is Conqueror stuck with slow firing 133mm guns with terrible AA capabilities when there was at least some Lion proposals with the 114mm guns instead? I mean right now you basically have the same secondary layout for tiers (7), 8, 9 and 10, so why not take this chance to switch it up a bit with the much more modern 114mm gun. It would mean a much more balanced AA layout as well as follow a modern progression. I mean even Grosser Kurfurst got the 128mm guns despite afaik there being no plans for it on the H-class BBs. I dont think there will be any more chances to put the 114mm mark V (7) on any other BBs so I would really like if they were at least represented on one of the Lion variants.

Wrong! Modelling and making paper ships is much easier and much faster to make in a number of ways compared to ships that existed. Ships that existed had many details that were added during and after construction, many of which were poorly documented and thus difficult to research and accurately model/balance As for proposed ships and unfinished ships, most were still in sketching phase or with most small details still undecided, thus freeing up a lot of creative space for game designers to push it through development faster like reusing assets or modeling whatever they want as opposed to dig and dig to find pictures and documents describing the tiniest of details. As for the paper ships themselves are piss easy to find, just use google for half an hour and you can find enough ship classes for 3 RN BB lines. Think again pls. You are completely forgetting that Scharnhorst has 20 sec reload while KGV historically had 30 sec at best... AT BEST. Historically Scharnhorst could reach 3.5 rpm = 17.14 sec reload, so Scharnhorst is actually nerfed. Think before you post, Scharnhost's guns are more like a hybrid between cruiser and BB armament because of the 50% better RoF, its not comparable to normal Battleship guns lmao.

This is probably what I hate about WG, once a ship is announced they refuse to change anything about the model, and way to often they refuse to change anything about the consumables either (radar for missouri for example). Its like they completely cut of the ship from the modelling pipeline of the development process after they announce it. I hope they actually take the time to load it up with 114mm guns, I mean Conqueror has the 40mm STAAG AA guns so the ship should be well within the period when 114mm mkV guns were planned for ships.

I find Gneisenau guns to be so underwhelming a secondary build is literally a must. On the other hand though I have tried IFHE on Bismarck and Freddy a few patches ago and the buff is enough to make the 105s pen tier 8 DD hulls and tier 8 BB superstructure, so yeah it helps on those but the fire chance reduction is not worth let alone the 4 extra points wasted. However on with the 128s with IFHE can pen 32mm and 38mm plates meaning the brawling against enemy BBs and even some cruisers just that much stronger especially since BBs are so large and easy to hit targets for secondaries.

Yeah sure, thats not really the question here though. THis thread is about whether or not IFHE build on GK or Gneisenau is worth it after the range and reload buff to the 128mm secondary guns on those ships in perticular

quality post

personally if they just removed the french flag it would be 10 times better already.. nothing against the french, but any flag in that place only looks stupid imo

How about Russian Premium version Seydlitz with 203s and German renamed version with 150s? I dunno I really think the german 150s are a waste on Nurnberg and as secondaries tbh they need more love

idk I played her 6 games and sold it because I found the royal navy light cruiser gameplay to be utterly boring. I feel like I mastered it well (87.5 % WR with Fiji), but the playstyle felt like a point and click game. With that said though the gameplay style that I used and works pretty much for all ships like this: Find cover - shoot ONLY after you know you have secured an escape route - Smoke up if you get detected to drag out the time before you need to switch locations Remember your heal repairs 2% of your health every second as long as its light damage, meaning you can tank all the HE shells you ever want without worrying about dying from it or burning to death. With that said though map awareness is probably the most important, know when and where to hide and NEVER show anyone your broadside if youre not confident you can actively dodge them.

I actually used to enjoy this ship as well, I used to get crazy citadels here and there. However it seems those days are over and my initial worries about this ship seemed to be true after all. About overpenning Cruisers, that has happened to me all the time at very close range ever since the release of the ship, but never has it happened at 8+ km...

bugger I was going to make that post!!!

Old Dunkek camo was already pretty bad imo. This aint good, but it sure is better. I used to run Dunkek without camo or with one of the standard silver camos because it was that bad (too lazy to install a mod and it was before they added the XP bonus to the premium ship camos)

Theoretically Akizuki with 1000 m/s but practically I would say Moskva's 985 m/s shells, they are barely initially slower than Akizuki, but maintains almost the same velocity at even up to 20km, giving it a better time to target than even Yamato at the longest ranges.

Disclaimer: this is not a "buff secondaries topic" The lack of layered range for secondaries have baffled me for a very long time for multiple reasons. 1 AA has layered range, why not secondaries 2 The max range of secondary guns historically vary a lot, a 100mm gun cant shoot nearly as far as a 152mm one. I'm not saying that 152mm should get 20km range, but just more than the 100mm would have to make some contrast. 3 Small caliber secondary guns are usually better than large caliber ones. Smaller guns usually have much higher RoF and are all loaded with HE, yet large caliber secondaries are often limited to AP shells that can rarely pen targets closing in. Even when large caliber secondaries fire HE, they usually dont have that much more firechance compared to smaller calibers despite firing slower than half as fast. Giving larger caliber secondaries more range will give back the historical advantage they currently lack. What would satisfy me and others like me? Its simple, on ships without uniform secondary guns nerf range on low caliber guns and buff range on larger caliber guns. Here I'll give you some examples. Bismarck/Tirpitz 105mm 7km -> 6km, 150mm 7km -> 8km. Yamato 127mm 7km -> 6.5km, 155mm 7km -> 8km. Or something along those lines get me? You know its not supposed to be a buff, but just something to give large caliber secondaries back some of their historical value.

That is quite nice indeed, this is gonna help somewhat. I dunno if I think its enough though, because WG already had to give the 150s the 1/4 HE pen despite the 105s keeping the 1/6 HE pen. This inconsistency has already confused players already. Clumsy if anything. Still the Japanese are left with slow firing 152s and 155s and 140s with the penetration value of a toothpick. The americans with the 5"/25s being a much better secondary gun than the 5"/51s despite the 5"/25s being a purposebuilt AA gun and the 5"/51 being an anti ship weapon.

You're right, forgot that one *Laughs in Dunkek*

Oh yeah and when that devestating torpedo volley hits.... oh wait the damage is abysmal Still fun though, I remember I got a fire on a Fuso in ranked, he repaired so I went yolo and torped him, got a flood and killed him almost from full with that. That was rank 20 though, none of these games in higher ranks :/

Yeah they really needed to limit Montanas secondary range to 6km. Montana completely outmatches both GK and Yamato so limiting her secondary range to 6km really put her where she needed to be. But yeah were talking realistically here, and realistically many nations used a non uniform secondary because they valued the 6" guns highly... but ingame currently having 2x2 105mm > 2x2 150mm due to RoF and fire starting while historically 105s are barely dual purpose guns even. Wait what? So if secondaries are so trash that means if the secondaries are both buffed and nerfed at the same time it means the whole ship needs to be rebalanced!? dafakk read the disclaimer I never meant for the secondaries to be buffed lmao. This is all just to make spammy firestarting low caliber guns be less usefull and larger caliber guns be at least somewhat usefull compared to what they currently are.

Yep Mutsu guns are a joke. They are comparably accurate at long range, but they shatter all the time due to shitty pen values. On the other hand at short range Warspite and Bayerns dispersion is actually lower (due to how the nation specific linear dispersion progresses). So the only selling point to Mutsu's guns are the size, penetration and accuracy is mediocre or horrible even. As for the ship itself I agree, other than speed its an ugly mess of disadvantage after disadvantage. Yeah sure its decently fast at 26.5 knots, but everything else is downright terrible. Survivability against both AP and HE is bad, AA is by far worst of all tier 6 BBs, turning circle is pretty meh, concealment is absolutely horrid and even the secondaries are complete garbage compared to Bayern or Warspite. I find both Mutsu and Dunkerque very fun to play, but they trade waaaaay too much just for a couple extra knots of speed. If you want to play Mutsu for great guns just buy Warspite, tbh even Bayern would be better to play for the guns. You only really buy Mutsu for the speed or the uber gimmicky torpedoes.

I guess, personally I dont use any of the optional circles other than concealment. Remembering your ranges on the fly isnt that hard tbh

Personally what I always envisioned for Tone was that she could get a consumable, that when activated will launch a squad of planes against the targeted enemy ship (or closest if no enemy has been selected or something along these lines). These planes could be armed with low damage HE dive bombs (250lbs or something in the same category that Kaga's DBs currently has). Now these bombs would mostly be used to finish very low HP enemies hiding behind islands or setting fire to ships. Whats important to note is that Tone had only 6 planes afaik, so the player has to be really conservative with what target they chose to attack, one wrong move and you could lose most of the DBs leaving you with: The other thing to note is that with low damage dive bombs you wouldn't want to just attack whenever the consumable is off cooldown, instead a smart player would wait untill an enemy is isolated and has used damage control party to set fire to them again. Compared to a normal HE spaming cruiser, you could very easily attempt to set fire to an enemy ship behind an island that your guns normally wouldnt reach. Personally I would love for this to be Tone whenver she comes out. Bad play with the bombers would either result in running out of plane reserves or just the enemy shrugging off the hit and repairing the fire. Yet smart play would let you set fires to enemies that normally would be difficult to reach. This also means that no need to be afraid of permaspotting with this ship and no unfair advantage for the CV on either team.