El2aZeR

Aww, thanks!

Thoroughly inevitable if you plan on developing a class based game in which each class is supposed to have fundamentally different roles and playstyles, as demonstrated by literally every other game out there that employs such a system. To remedy this would require you to remove at least two, if not three out of four classes from the game. Or take WG's approach of giving up balance entirely, instead choosing to make the most played class overpowered while [edited]-ing on everyone else. Now ask yourself, do you really want that? Well, you could also play one of the various AA cruisers. Too bad that these are among the most difficult ships to play in the current meta. Which is precisely why some of the most "toxic" games are also among the most popular. Oh wait, I in fact can't think of any popular game in which it is even remotely fun to lose. In a PvP game losing doesn't need to be fun, neither in video games nor in competitive sports. In fact, depending on what type of game you want to develop losing needs to be frustrating as all out so that the player has an incentive to get better. Using the various game mechanics needs to be fun, getting targeted by them does not. Because balance does not mean having each class have the same amount of potential influence in any of these games. Your little off topic anecdotes don't do you any favors as you have fundamentally failed to understand how balance in such a game actually works. You probably don't even realize they cement my arguments perfectly while completely undermining yours. Ahahahahaha, no. The races share the same basic principles. Fundamental basics such as economy, macro and micro are all the same, it's how the races do it that is different. They all play on the same level field, they're not as completely different as people make them out to be. Playing any race for a prolonged period of time will enable you to play any other with little difficulty as well. You may need to learn some strats, timings, unit compositions and abilities if you want to play at a higher level, but no one needs to tell you how to mine minerals/gas, expand, increase your supply or even just make and control units. That is not the case in WoWs nor any other game which employs fundamentally different classes. Playing BBs for a long time will not tell you how to play DDs. Playing cruisers will not tell you how to play CVs. At best three classes share the same basic control scheme and that is it, with another one being completely different in every way. And even in StarCraft no race has the same chance to win depending on the game time (early, mid and late game), because the system is explicitly balanced around it not being the case. Causes are neither excuses nor are they only relevant in one specific context. Addressing issues such as this requires you to identify the cause, then dealing with them in an appropriate manner. You don't fix BB overpopulation by nerfing CVs, for example. Whether or not the developer holds interest in doing so is completely irrelevant, causes remain the same regardless of whether they do or not. Honestly, when the guys teaching me game design said that it will make me see how little players actually understand it and make me want to rage at their stupidity I thought they were joking.

Wat. First of all, things don't have to be fun to play against. In fact, it is often entirely undesirable to have fun when losing. Mechanics have to be fun to play with, end of story, what they do to the target is mostly irrelevant. That is a design principle of all games. Second, your dream of each fundamentally different class having even close to the same amount of potential match influence is utterly idiotic and goes not only against fundamental game design principles, as demonstrated by literally every successful PvP title that utilizes such a class system out there, but against natural law itself. Diversity and equality are on opposite ends of a spectrum. You cannot have both. Deal with it. And third, yes, CVs have more potential match influence than any other class. CVs are however excessively dominant in the current meta far beyond their initial match influence due to factors that are outside of their control, several of which I have outlined above. Get it now? Or is it still too difficult? Need some pictures maybe? If you want to balance a game around the lowest possible denominator then you may as well not balance it at all. Both have the same outcome. Players will make mistakes, yes. That is precisely why CVs as a class, and in fact PvP games in general, work even if they were balanced perfectly. The side that makes less mistakes will usually win. There is nothing wrong with that. On the contrary it is precisely what a good balancing system will aim for. Better than losing guaranteed. And if you honestly believe you should still have equal chances of winning despite one of your teammates being utterly useless then I have some bad news for you.

It's nice to see you're incapable of understanding simple statements, even when their meaning are explicitly clear. "An outstanding CV player has no problems trouncing two who are "only" good." -> CVs scale a lot better against themselves with skill compared to every other class due to the nature of their mechanics and play. "CVs are dominant in current play due to little part of their own." -> CVs scale even better when general enemy average player skill is low and the current meta is playing into their hands. When that is not the case CVs will have a hard time regardless of their own skill or how bad the enemy CV is, the most extreme example of which can be seen in the competitive side of WoWs. Seriously, what is there not to understand? Is it truly that hard?

Utterly untrue. CVs are ironically the most team dependent class in the game due to their fundamental inability to contest objectives despite their high match influence. If your team is bad there is literally nothing you can do to win the game in a CV. I've had plenty of matches in which I lost despite killing up to 2/3rds of the enemy team myself. You can accelerate pushes by denying the enemy vision and providing it to your own team yourself. And, as I stated previously, taking things slow only plays into the hands of the enemy CV.

Technically speaking detonations are perfectly fine from the quoted viewpoint. After all, the player who detonated someone else engaged with relevant game mechanics and was (hopefully) entertained by the results. Very cheap entertainment that gets boring fast to be sure (which is also one of the reasons why detonations are fairly rare to get), but the principle still applies. Alright, the player who got detonated most likely wasn't entertained by it, but that on the other hand is fine with the principles of game design for PvP games. (Not saying I like detonations, but in the context of random, co-op and scenario battles I do think they're fine. They have no place in either of the more competitive gamemodes, though.)

No it isn't. Contrary to popular belief CVs don't scale well in numbers without sufficient skill to back it up due to the nature of CV play and mechanics. An outstanding CV player has no problems trouncing two who are "only" good alone. And before you state your disbelief, I've been there and done that. Playing against two CV players of inferior skill level is almost no different than playing against one, even if your teammate is afk. And ofc if your teammate isn't afk your advantage rises even higher regardless of how bad your teammate is. On the other hand you create situations in which two good CV players can be put on one team and two bad ones on the other, increasing the amount of influence the former can have to the extreme. (Among other problems which I won't elaborate on right now.) CVs are dominant in current play due to little part of their own. To list just a few factors that benefit skilled CV players extremely: - players are unaccustomed to having CVs in a match - players do not use counters to CVs that are widely available and extremely effective - players tend to have a solo play mentality - average skill is so low that if it were a hole you fell into you'd die of old age before hitting the ground - BB overpopulation has pushed the primary CV counter (AA cruisers) into a bad position - current meta revolves around camping Having a good CV player against a bad one initially only means one side gets a spotting advantage. That's not insubstantial but can be overcome. Literally everything else is served up to the skilled CV player on a silver platter by either his own or the enemy team. If you find yourself with a bad CV and realize he's getting smashed your own team needs to start applying pressure immediately (if it is not already doing so). Playing passive only gives the enemy CV time to fly more strikes, set said strikes up perfectly and otherwise probe and whittle down your defenses one by one. The more time you give him, the bigger his advantage gets. Too bad that this requires people to put their big, heavily armored and armed ships in harms way, something the average player is simply unwilling to do. Instead he will camp at the edge of the map then complain about how overpowered CVs are when aircraft inevitably come for him. As a DD the best you can do is to encourage teammates to move closer to objectives by laying smoke for them, then use their AA cover to take it and scout ahead. Of course if they don't want to, well, sucks for you. On the other hand, do you honestly believe that you should have even the slightest chance of winning a match when a good majority of the team doesn't want to play the objective in this team game? Don't bother with Grozo or Kidd if you think you will be able to sail around alone without need to worry about aircraft. It's incredibly easy to put them into binds that will get them killed as a same tier CV if you know how to.

Some diabetes, anyone? And to stay on topic

Maneuverability of high tier CVs isn't so bad that you can land enough torps under DFAA to alpha him down to low HP if he maneuvers correctly. Midway could maybe do it, but that would require enough TBs to survive flying into CV DFAA. Meh, I've wiped entire USN strikes without even trying in my Taiho/Haku.

Ah, well, that's true. Can't wait to see the idiots who bring a GZ into ranked. (Seriously, though, GZ should be banned from ranked at least until testing is over.)

This is funny because at higher ranks a CV is almost completely dependent on the team.

To be fair if you bring a DD that can't handle CVs you will be a liability to your team anyway. Since, you know, all actually good choices can handle CVs just fine.

I'm honestly surprised to see the amount of people thinking Enterprise will be an option. Don't get me wrong, she's a great ship for randoms (if you can make her work), but facing a 3/1/2 Shokaku at a higher level in a ranked environment will be an impossible task. The only advantage she'd have is in striking power, but considering there is literally nothing left to strike for a CV in ranked even if you take enemy fighter superiority out of the question that's pretty much nullified. Only thing you can potentially do is to saturate smokes with long drops so someone hiding in it will be forced out. You may prove me wrong, but given my experience with Big E I'd call that doubtful to say the least.

Certainly. In fact, as I stated previously, if T6 MM was better than it is now putting Pensa there would make her pretty overpowered unless you revert some of her buffs. She's not for everyone and definitely not an easy ship to play. Those who played and enjoyed her usually can thoroughly understand why others hate her so much. Master her though and you've mastered cruiser play in general.

I mean I dunno why anyone would bother doing this, but I approve. :D

Considering the new up time of CV DCP a snipe is thoroughly unrealistic under DFAA. 30 seconds is plenty of time to pull back your fighters, get new ones in the air or get some support from friendlies. Hitting only 2-3 torps + flooding isn't enough either if you run appropriate skills and premium DCP. A good CV player will recognize that you're attempting to snipe him anyway and play accordingly. It's not that hard to figure out. Don't see bombers for several minutes despite knowing the enemy CV is active? He's probably coming to snipe you. Also Taiho and Haku have pretty monstrous AA as well if you've specced MAA.

Don't blame the ship if you fail with her. When played right Pensa makes short work of cruisers. She can even take on BBs and come out just fine when top tier.

:D

While this is generally speaking something that is long overdue for all classes, there is no need to create a random scenario. WWII offers plenty of famous battles that can be exploited for this purpose, making such a tutorial a lot more appealing. Basic example for CVs: The Battle of Midway First section: - game spawns several USN TB squads, lets you attack IJN fleet with it - concentrated AA, DFAA & fighter cover will chew them up (can also be done in an ingame scripted event by the AI to prevent players from getting stuck trying to successfully attack when it is predetermined that they will fail) -> teaches new players that it is generally not a good idea to attack groups of targets, targets with fighter cover and/or targets with DFAA Second section: - game spawns several USN DB squads, enemy formation is now broke up, has no DFAA and fighter cover - goal is to attack Akagi, Kaga and Soryu, for the sake of new players this should be done with manual drop only - targets will conveniently die after all targets have been attacked -> teaches new players that DBs don't do too much damage, but are useful in setting fires and destroying AA mounts. Also basic stuff like attacking isolated targets and using DBs Third section: - game spawns your own small task force and lets you deal with an incoming air attack - several fighter squads are spawned to defend you - goal is to eliminate all enemy bombers without getting sunk, basics of controlling your hull, clicking enemy squads to focus fire with AA, DFAA and strafing are explained -> teaches new players the basics of fighter control, strafing, usage of their own hull and AA Last section: - game spawns several allied AI fighters and DBs, while giving you direct control over some TBs - goal is to sink Hiryu, again manual drop only - AI fighters will occupy and kill enemy fighters, most of the AI DBs will conveniently miss or kill escorting ships -> teaches new players basics of TB control and that they're your main damage dealers, while being capable of setting full duration floodings in combination with DBs This should set up new CV players with the basics, they can then be left to figure out more advanced techniques on their own as you don't need to hold their hands forever. Or if it is deemed necessary just set up more tutorials afterwards, Philippine Sea e.g. would provide a great setup for advanced fighter techniques.

6.6km base concealment? At T7? Are they for real?

*diabetes intensifies*

This is the AI some players accuse of cheating or being too good.

Expected some sort of rant about balance or game mechanics. Got complaints about friggin' camos instead. Wat.