Verblonde

Do I remember correctly that she has rather improved AP angles too?

Personally, I'm not reporting submarines in Coop automatically: as a mode, Coop doesn't matter really, so I don't see that playing submarines does much harm there. Quite apart from anything else, I suggest that playing some Coop games enable us to better comment on submarines; that said, I got my 'experimental' submarine games out of the way several patches ago, and have no enthusiasm for any more until/unless WG fix them properly. Not holding my breath.

She's pretty - I wants one! Distressing lack of 'Italian' stripes on the bow though (poo - with knobs on - to historical accuracy)...

In the interests of completeness: this week, my clan appears to have a prevert in our midst: (Burn the witch...etc!)

Because I'm an idiot (which is, I believe, the correct term), and so others don't have to: Some (very initial) thoughts based on a few Coop games, just to get a feel for her: She's quite pretty, but then you can get the same aesthetic for nowt with the French line, although FR25 gets bonus points for the Italian stripes on her bow. I got the basic 'ship only' package (whilst I'm an idiot, I'm perhaps not a *complete* idiot); if anyone really wants the Golden Sun permaflage, you have to get one of the bloated bundles (both of which include silver, if anyone was wondering 'why superships'), at least as of now. In terms of sneakiness, she's not entirely awful: 6.3 km with a CE captain. The specialised sneaks are better, but most things at that tier are similar or worse in this regard (although good luck when you get up-tiered). I've only played Coop so far, but the dakka feels (!) less awful than I was expecting, despite losing the French MBRB. The range isn't bad (especially if you use Sansonetti, and trigger his ability; 12.7 km base), and the ballistics could be a lot worse The YOLO torps are perfectly okay for Coop, but - due to complete absence of a stealth window - they're going to be much harder to use against real people. Of course, you can try the YOLO Emilio trick with the fuel smoke, but you only get about half a minute of smoke, so the usual stuff about having an exit plan when pulling that stunt applies. @Jethro_Grey's point earlier about the torps is well made - I managed to get five torps into a QE yesterday, and it didn't sink (well, not right away; a bit of dakka sorted him out but still...)! Pick your YOLO spots with care... It's worth mentioning the engine boost: FR25 gets the standard French 20% boost, not the 25% boost that the silver line gets; you're not as fast, but you can go for a lot longer (171.6 sec with coal mod and captain skill). Base speed is two knots slower than the silver T7 Italian DD as well. So, she's fun in Coop; I can't see myself getting much use from her against real people though (but I do have both of Haida and Z-39). As a mediocre player, I'm perhaps not as attuned to skill ceilings as most folk on here may be; for a typical farty, I reckon FR25 is perfectly serviceable, but many will probably get themselves killed trying to use the torps. As to the weighty matter of which premium DD is the most dreadful, I personally - so far - much prefer FR25 to Schönberg...! Just to be clear though: I don't think FR25 is worth buying (especially not the bloated bundles), but rather that she isn't unutterably awful...

I saw exactly the same thing with my EU clan, and (because of time-zones) I'm usually the last person playing before the end of the weekend window...

She occurred to me too, but I'd suggest she's arguably better than Harekaze II, yet most probably in a similar league. So, another one reaching for the acme of awfulness yet falling short of being an unmitigated disaster...?

True, but the AP is moderately worthwhile, which elevates her above the entirely awful (plus you get used to the torps, especially if you've played Asashio); whilst I'd never actively recommend anyone actually buy Fenyang (despite having her twice) I'd suggest we need to look elsewhere for the truly appalling. Harekaze II makes a noble reach for bloody awful, but has competent sonar (and usable torps), so falls short? I still keep circling back to Schönberg; there's plenty of mediocrity out there, but not too much actively dreadful...

That's a surprising pick; okay, she's worse than Aki, but does she really plumb the true murky depths...? Whilst I don't usually take mine out in proper game modes (well, I have Lo Yang, for a start), I think I'd much rather play her than Schönberg, for example...

<shudder> I'd forgotten about her; or - perhaps more properly - my memory had blocked her out in self-defence...! As a matter of interest, which premium DD do people generally feel is the most dreadful?

Good news, for once (assuming it's not a weak April Fool)...

My view FWIW is along the following lines: In general, torp DDs (particularly thinking about the Shima line) aren't underpowered, but they are harder to be influential in. So, it's not so much that they're weak; they can do an awful lot of damage, but the question is more whether it's the right damage to the right targets. Gunboats have the potential to be more influential, as they tend to be more effective at killing other DDs, and the side whose DDs last longer generally wins (excluding the impact of CVs and - possibly - submarines). That's a spectacular over-simplification, of course, but I feel the overall impression is valid. Of course, player skill is significant too: for instance, as alluded to earlier, many torp boat drivers don't use their guns (the skillful and appropriate application of IJN DD guns can make an enormous difference); meanwhile, you need - generally speaking - more skill to make effective use of a gunboat because handing the loss of stealth when you open fire can give many players a lot of difficulty.

Neither can I, at least not with a quick search. As a usual rule of thumb, the newer a premium ship is the less likely to it is to appear on a container drop-list (although there are exceptions, such as the - infamous - initial launch of Agincourt, and the more recent Forrest Sherman). Presumably, you had everything on the drop-list for the container you opened, and it must be one that gives silver as compensation.

Which container type was it? Most (all?) containers that may include ships have an associated list of possible ship drops, and - generally - not everything is on those lists. For example, I can't get premium ships from SCs; not because I have every premium in the game, but rather because I have everything on the current SC list...

Dev Blog (San Diego less rubbish - ? - plus more buffs to a couple of submarines, and fiddling with a couple of new superships): https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/308

As a matter of curiosity, did the recent buffs to submarines change anything vis-a-vis ramming? I had a couple (literally two) of occasions with older iterations where I got my DD sunk by a submarine surfacing underneath me, and not getting sunk themselves; I was wondering if the recent adjustments made any difference here (I know it's harder to sink a sub with dakka now)? As it stands, I usually try and be in a different bit of the map to submarines, but sometimes fighting the is unavoidable, and it'd be helpful to know if ramming them is viable in a DD (possibly with ramming signal fitted), since you have to more or less run them over anyway to use the 'premier' (according to WG) ASW weapon...

Not much, really, although BBs do have one of the less ineffective ASW weapons available, assuming the underwater w4nker gets detected sufficiently close to you. IMO, the best bet is to play modes that don't include submarines, at least once you run out of reports (that should be given to everyone in Randoms playing submarines, on general principles).

The most common advice is words to the effect of stay at lower tiers until you're ready, which is fairly sensible (or was until the T4 CV plague took hold); rushing too high too fast is generally a bad idea - assuming your aim is to do well and win. Personally, I don't subscribe to the view that you should stay at low tiers until x WR is achieved, as I think that's an unrealistic expectation in many cases (and the whole 'good players only at T10' thing is a horse that's long since bolted); then again, I'm not a very good player, so that will inform my biases.

Pretty good post, apart from this bit; with one or two exceptions, most of the forum population are extremely helpful and friendly, provided - and this is important - one isn't a tw4t. Given WG's behaviour over the last few years, I can understand a certain amount of cynicism in certain quarters, but the bulk of people on here actively want to help new players. It's worth bearing in mind that quite a few people don't have English as their first language here though, and many of the 'x happened, therefore the game is broken' (when the player didn't understand a basic game mechanic) posts are repeat performances. Both of these factors can result in somewhat more terse responses sometimes. Given that this is the internet, I'm actually surprised how (comparatively) courteous people still manage to be on here though.

Being sensible, it's an interesting point (in the OP) about having the support CVs engaging in 'positive' behaviour, rather than negative; normally, I groan inwardly when I get a CV game - it's an intriguing possibility if a version of the class could be produced that had the opposite effect... Whilst the stun effect is almost certainly a bloody stupid idea, the basic idea of true support CVs *might* not be?

<resists urge to post relevant Monty Python gifs...>

You're almost certainly a far better player than I am, so apologies if I'm teaching my grandmother to suck eggs here: I run the LU on Gearing; in Randoms enough people don't understand the vision mechanics to allow a lot to be done with the extra sneakiness (even with the reduced DPM). Assuming one's anti-radar/hydro kung fu is reasonably strong, you have a lot more scope to get into positions where people may not expect attack to come from. I should mention that (as far as I recall) I haven't played LU Gearing against submarines, but I imagine the impact will be the same as for anything else that relies heavily on concealment. I think a gunboat build is felt to be pretty decent; I don't use such a build because there are other things that are rather better at it (Daring/Vampire II come to mind for instance), at least for me. If the lunatic new spotting thing for CVs comes to pass, that *might* make the gunboat approach more viable still, as the elimination of stealth should be less damaging for something balanced less around stealth (i.e. 'normal' Gearing, as opposed to LU)? Bravely run away. I'm sure you know this, but a key aspect of DD play is avoiding fair fights wherever possible! (Edited for clarity.)

Because she looks pretty in a new dress:

I'm sure someone will be along with a spreadsheet presently to explain that the 'silent majority' of T9 players are stoked at the prospect of seeing more games with (super) CVs and +2 MM, and - as such - we should be paying WG extra for the privilege... Being sensible, although I'm mildly narked that my T9s' pref MM is going down the toilet, I do have far more T8 premiums that may get uptiered less frequently if the 'sky falling' predictions about the impact of the superships on MM come to pass. So, swings and roundabouts...