Verblonde

I haven't looked, but can't you just switch Dasha off (you just see/hear a standard captain)...?

Yup. A significant number of people on here (and other fora, I gather) objected to this when it was announced weeks ago, and WG took zero notice. I imagine you won't be the only person this morning who's having a "what the h*ll?!" moment... It rather looks like the matter is done though, so all we can do is be mindful of this when making the decision as to whether to buy T10 permaflage in future (and when advising others).

TA captain, and after playing with Ikea ' fluffy bunny kisses' (TM LWM) torps for the last month or two, something with even moderate damage will feel cataclysmic... I better hurry up and finish the latest regrind (about two-thirds of the way to the T9 at the moment)...

As hilarious as this would be (something like 75% of my PvP games are in DDs), it probably wouldn't be good for the game. If there isn't a CV present, a competent sneaky DD can have a massively significant impact on a game's outcome (even I can make an impression, and that's saying something) - radars prevent us from wreaking an unreasonable level of havoc. That said, we always get a massive radar spike when a new line that gets it is introduced (most old lags will remember the US cruiser split, for instance); all we have to do is play a bit more cautiously than usual and use it as a splendid opportunity to practice anti-radar methodology. It's a bit of a pain, but will pass when the next new thing hoves into view (polish yer AA for the KM CVs for instance)...

I don't think there is, although I vaguely recall reading that they'll be converted to silver at some point (I might be wrong, and I don't recall how much silver though)....

I don't think that's completely true: knowing how to properly manage DCP and healing potions is really useful in dinkier ships too, and I've found being practiced at forward planning where your guns need to be pointing in advance to be of great help on all but those ships with the fastest turning turrets...

Nah - I had to thrash the nuts off mine in Coop to get the tokens for the main Russian event (I had a weak moment and bought Buggration, so I got Mikoyan in week one); she isn't unutterably awful, but I have plenty of more fun ships to play, so she'll probably gather dust now until we get the next snowflake (or similar) event... Reading your original post, I'm a little surprised how much I'd forgotten about - must be old age. Highlights for me (in no particular order): Arpeggio, to my surprise - I'm not any kind of weeb, but the captains are a giggle, and I thought the freebie ships were a splendid balance of work versus reward. I even bought the Atago clone, whatever she's called (because a chap can never have too many Atagos). Plus, against all my better instincts, most of the lairy colour schemes look really good. I don't remember much about the RN cruiser event itself, but I do rather like London - actual real historic ship, and quite fun to play in Ops. Reminds me: next time Narai turns up, I ought to give the T7 a run-out (completely forgot this time). I approve of the white/gold (or whatever) cammos too, although I can do without the enormous text across the things' posteriors. I like the Ikeas a lot, so that event was one of my favourites, especially since I managed (with some spending) to bag all the permaflages. My hazy memory seems to recall the rewards being a bit better than the current Russian event. The various 'magic' captain grinds/campaigns have been a plus, since I've had the time to complete them (still working on the EU one), and so saved some ludicrous amounts of coal. The Russian cruiser event has been okay, and due to a mixture of Buggration, leading to Mikoyan, and a single 300 box, I got the Riga permaflage, for if I ever can be bothered to grind her (I quite wanted Tallinn, as she's the only slightly-historical one - Hipperski); 'okay' isn't really a highlight though. I also didn't spend any money (doubloons) on crates either, which is quite rare for me - my minor protest against the Moskva permaflage business.

I'd love a T9 season of Clans. Didn't we have one a while ago, or am I confusing it with some sort of Ranked thing? Either way, it's a splendid idea!

Wise words - I'm utterly rubbish/Cursed in Halland, and she's one of my favourite ships at the moment... (I've just had a horrible thought - if Vesuvius ever blows its top, Naples pizza will be lost forever...! The horror, the horror...)

If I were feeling cynical, I might guess those two needed a sales boost (at the time Kii was thought to be a bit flaky, and Roma struggles with the 'no silver line' problem) and with one stroke they became the top silver generators, bar MO. Technically they've also done similar things for Ashitaka, but she's T7 (good for Narai though), and - I think - Yamato, but the bonuses are the same as regular T10 permaflage. Although you didn't ask, might I make some suggestions re: coal: It's too valuable to use on flags/cammo and any other 'disposable' things that may come along. Probably, the most useful thing to do with it is high tier coal ships (use a coupon), although they take a while to earn - besides the daily coal (minimum 1.6K per day if you do both dailies and get all three resources crates), keep an eye out for any missions, modes, snowflakes etc. that give coal too. IMO coal modules - for key ships - are a good close second, and cost rather less (17K without a coupon), but every time you buy one, it slows down your acquisition of a ship by, what, a couple of weeks perhaps. Cheaper coal captains can be worthwhile too, especially if they have enhanced abilities and/or you're short of captain xp. As mentioned by others elsewhere, I would urge concentrating on getting one of these to 19 points, then the other (or both at the same time, if you're playing enough): when you get a 19 pointer, all the captain xp you earn goes into the elite xp pot, which can be used on any other captain to jump to the next point, if you have enough of it. 19 pointers do give you a performance edge, but this elite xp generation thing is a massive advantage and is worth making a bit of effort to get, even though it is a bit of a long-term project (as you've noticed, the common gaming thing of each 'level' needing more xp than the last applies here too - the 18-19 point jump is 300K, from memory!). You'll realise immediately that, if the first 19 pointer speeds up the development of the second, then the first and second together make the third happen even faster, and the effect snowballs from there. If you're playing your 19 pointers reasonably frequently, it reduces the pressure to acquire 10 point captains significantly (and/or enables you to switch captains between silver ships with less expenditure/hassle). BTW if you have a 19 pointer that belongs to a silver ship, but also works on one or more premiums of the same nation, you can cycle through them all, hoovering up daily first win bonuses and maximising your elite xp income in the process.

All things being equal, nothing available at the moment matches Kii (and Roma) for earning potential when they have the Kobayashi cammos. The next best thing is a T9 premium that you can do well with: the French one has been removed from sale; the British don't have one; the KM ones might be worth a look when they're released, but until they're actually in the game in a final, final form, we don't know how good they'll really be. Although regular T8 premiums can't touch Kobayashi/T9s for earnings, they can still be quite worthwhile - the dockyard event starting next patch (that gives the option of an inexpensive KM T8 at the end) *might* be worth a look if the ship sounds promising to you, but wait for some real reviews first - the initial impressions seem to be along the lines of "it's okay, but no great"; might be worth a look if you don't have Tirpitz already. My feeling is that the 1,500 doubloons/35K coal ones are worth having (once you've mopped up the freebies from Ops etc.) - an instant 10 pointer is often very helpful once you're into the +2 MM bracket especially. The ones with enhanced abilities (the Does, Dunkirks et al.) are especially worthwhile. Bear in mind that - as far as I know - they all come trained for the T1 silver ship of their respective nation, so you'll have to retrain them for use in any silver ship, with the usual associated costs. The 175K 'extra magic' captains are - IMO - not worth it for most players, unless you've run out of stuff to buy with coal. They're well worth making an effort to get via campaigns etc. (like the current Polish one) but I generally wouldn't suggest emptying your coal store for one. YMMV of course.

Well, processed Erythroxylaceae and ladies of negotiable affection won't pay for themselves, y'know. Being less facetious, a lot of the new stuff is 'free' and designed to encourage people to play more (=higher server numbers, lower wait times, impression of a healthy game, increased likelihood of people spending real money etc.). Overall though, new ships are a relatively easy way to add 'newness' to the game without having to spend a lot of time trying to come up with something entirely new (like submarines); of course, it won't be as effective as more significant new additions, but it's a tool that WG use...

WG haven't said, but I think the general feeling is that the current arrangements are mainly for test and probably don't reflect how things would be in a finalised introduction of subs. The omission of Huanghe is doubly eccentric when one considers that both Perth and Leander get DCs...

I agree - I'd cheerfully buy variations on the 'national' permaflages for most of my keepers around that tier range (I think I have all the existing ones) mainly for the silver boost. One of the reasons I mainly play higher tiers is I tend to make a lot more silver there; if WG are sincere about wanting people to play a more diverse range of tiers, why not give them the option of tools to make it worthwhile (besides the RB, which quite a few people don't like)?

Shouldn't we applaud the introduction of 'okayish' premiums (at least if they're fun/interesting)? Endless powercreep would get deeply irritating... BTW the best pizza on earth is to be found in Naples. It is a great source of distress to me that said pizza is several thousand miles away (and over at least one closed border)!

If I may, I refer you back to my points about why one might buy permaflage. I'm getting really bored with all this now, so if people can't make the empathic leap to understand why the 'other' camp might be upset, then it's their issue.

They absolutely do stop affecting a T10 silver ship, and start affecting a T10 semi-premium instead. That subtle distinction does matter.

Most risk-averse choice is to do nothing. Probably the most sensible choice in terms of economics is to just sell Moskva (and maybe Kirov) before the patch hits; this is complicated by the presence/absence of the LU, and one's desire to use doubloons (or not) for dismounting. Personally, I'm taking the reset option on the grounds that I haven't taken the latest x2 yet, and I really need to learn to suck less in cruisers, so this gives me a good excuse. That said, I waste the usual 50% silver that happens every time you do a reset. I didn't do anything until the final patch notes were released, and I won't be the least surprised if we have to get rowdy with WG on Thursday, if/when they [edited] something up....

Right here seems to be the nub of the matter, and your view on this seems to largely dictate which side of the argument you fall. You are of the view that what was paid for was a permaflage for a T10 silver ship; there is no doubt that on Thursday morning affected people will have one fewer permaflage for silver T10s in their collection. You are of the view that what was paid for was a permaflage for Moskva; there is also no doubt that on Thursday morning people will have the same number of Moskva permaflages in their collection. If position 1 is correct, then purchasers of the Moskva permaflage have certainly lost something; if position 2 is correct, then purchasers have lost nothing, and everyone with a Moskva gains something. Needless to say, WG are taking the view that 2 is correct (well, they would). I don't have a Moskva permaflage, but for all of my existing T10s that I've bought permaflage for (various DDs), I can confirm that my motivation was option 1. I wouldn't be the slightest bit aggrieved if, say, everyone in the game got a free Gearing permaflage (I don't fly off the handle every time Graf Spee gets given away for example - same thing), but I would be very annoyed if I lost mine without compensation/a like-for-like replacement. FWIW the reason I think along these lines is that I buy T10 permaflage for purely economic reasons, and not aesthetics (so far).

I have to admit to being rather surprised at this myself. The permaflage bit of all this is - IMO - the only really pi$$-poor part of the whole business (the credit differential between those who have Moskva in port and those who don't is a Richard move too, but I don't view that as serious as, for most people, it doesn't involve actual money); it also doesn't make any sense to me from a business perspective: The cost to WG of providing existing Moskva cammo owners with something along the lines of a permaflage for the replacement silver T10 would be chicken feed (give people the freebie from the current event - no extra dev costs). A lot of folk who have the cammo are going to think poorly of WG after this (always a bad thing; new customers generally cost more to obtain than keeping old ones around and spending). The chances of people buying permaflage after this will be lower, even amongst those who aren't directly impacted (me, for example), as they now see that permaflage is no longer 'perma' (well, as much as anything in a game with a finite lifespan can be). Recall the mantra of an angry person telling ten people, and a happy one only four (or whatever the real numbers actually are) - WG have managed to generate rather more of the former over this than the latter, I suspect.

As a general rule, the bulk of the Russian cruiser line is very much about the guns (the infamous 'railguns'); these ships usually have horribly short-ranged torps, so you often don't get to use them, unless someone messes up royally. Even those with better range on their torps are still optimally built mainly with the focus on guns. If there are cruisers that reward more of a torp build, the Russians aren't them. All that said, if you want a laugh, manly YOLO combat at ludicrously close quarters in Coop can be fun....

It's not the first time WG have done vaguely this sort of thing either: there was the pay real money for steel mission thing a couple of winters ago...

Nope. I've just bounced to T4 of the Russian cruiser line, and didn't have to buy either of the T2 or T3 on the way. Exactly the same thing applies with Donskoi: if you don't want to play her again, you just throw free xp at the problem and then buy the new T10. I fear you may have not understood the concept of time - by your logic, none of us have great-great-grandparents as they existed at a moment in time far to the past of when we exist now. Same principle with the two Moskvas.

As of now, that's a yes - no changes, that I've seen, have been announced for Moskva (besides the transition to semi-premium). Of course, the semi-premiums are liable to nerfing (not that any have been as far as I recall), but as of now, the only differences will be: New Moskva has reduced servicing costs, so will make more silver overall. New Moskva gets a permaflage; whether this is an improvement will depend on whether you had one already. You can put any captain you like in new Moskva, which you can't with the existing one (without paying/expending xp). In terms of the pure ship, there is no down-side to the transition. Also, who cares about module demount/not? The new ship is the same as the old, so you'll still probably want the same build as before the transition. As I've said already, the only really pi$$-poor thing that WG have done here is the whole business with the permaflage. Not giving people who had the things in port the silver (to even things out with the 'researched only' crowd) is a mild Richard move, but I'm not losing sleep over that, frankly.

I was thinking of resetting the line; I badly need more practice in cruisers, and that might force me to get it... Lose more silver (via selling all the ships), but gain something vaguely useful (RB points) back in return, whereas if I only sell Moskva, I just lose some silver and get nowt back.