fnord_disc

It doesn't have enough torpedoes to use them as its primary weapon and the concealment is too bad as well. It's not a torpedo boat... what the hell.

Nah, you're just an utterly horrible player...

Yeah, I'm not saying they're complete cloud castles. The torpedoes on Fletcher and Gearing were never used in combat either.

What I mean is, no cruiser can penetrate other cruisers frontally. Nor can Spee. Not being able to penetrate other cruisers frontally is normal for cruisers and Speed is a cruiser, so? Yeah, the speed is a problem. But that just means that positioning becomes extremely important to have any success in the ship, because the concealment is also very mediocre. I won't make any final prediction on the ship until I see the dispersion. Everything depends on that for me.

Explain to me how that's not a problem with your tactics and your positioning. If you play the ship like a Minekaze, then yeah, you will get shafted. That's not what it will be good at.

I really don't think Akizuki is too weak right now... Don't get me wrong. I'm opposed to the general philosophy (from torpedo boat to weird universal boat) that sits behind this split. And I also think the performance of the ships will suffer for the average player. But is Akizuki, with its current stats, too weak? Oh, hell, no.

The torpedoes used are experimental turbine torpedoes. The torpedo at T5 is the last torpedo actually fielded in combat - the rest is all experimental AIP turbine propulsion. I more or less predicted this would happen because the standard G7a and G7e are too crappy for destroyers and they're not strong enough as gunboats either. It was fairly clear that Lesta would pick all these experimental torpedoes to buff the ships.

No cruiser can do this, and I wasn't talking about angling. Just about pure broadside citadels. With 20.3cm guns the citadels start disappearing around 12km, and this will certainly not happen with Spee. Getting uptiered in Spee isn't more painful than getting uptiered in an Aoba.

Dunno, detection is 13km. Even with an elite captain it only goes down to the low 11s. The torpedoes are comparable to British T7 and worse than the Japanese T5/T6... With battleship dispersion I think this ship will be all right, but borderline underpowered. With cruiser dispersion it will be very strong.

37.5° for six guns. That means you show 52.5° of your broadside = enough to be citadelled.

Arcs are the same as Scharnhorst. Penetration is a little worse, but enough to penetrate any cruiser at any range. Functionally behave the same as Scharnhorst. It all depends on the dispersion.

Okay, then it's all down to dispersion now.

28cm/52 on Spee uses 8.5 crh projectiles compared to 10crh on Scharnhorst. Spee has 910 m/s MV vs 890 on Scharnhorst, so arcs are about the same. How balanced the ship is will depend on RoF and dispersion characteristics. Might end up very OP with cruiser dispersion. German DDs look OP as hell. They're seriously using those experimental turbine torpedoes...

As far as I know, supersonic drag approximations use polynomes of some nature. But I don't know if the v³ coefficient is generally relevant... if it is, it probably is in the range of 10^(-5) to 10^(-4). I know even less about higher-order coefficients.

My gut feeling is that numerical errors are not the problem at this point. I've also done test simulations with extremely high precision and they're not appreciably different. In my opinion the issue is clearly the linear drag constant. I should add that cw_2 = 100+1000/3*D; is a purely empirical definition - it is not supported by fluid dynamics. The way I got to this was just by analzing the curves I have official values for, increasing the linear drag and fitting a regression curve. This was just the first attempt. Additionally, the linear drag component also includes the c_D right now because it's still multiplied by k, which is probably not correct. c_D is physically speaking tied to the quadratic drag term. My next step to optimize this formula would have been to make a clean split between the linear and quadratic coefficients and correlate them to the different variables. That means splitting k*rho*(cw_1*v_x^2+cw_2*v_x) up by merging k and cw_1. cw_2 is then surely dependant on D and inversely on W (because a=F/m) and perhaps on other things. A correlation analysis would have to show what exactly goes on there. This is a quite promising route to go down due to the numerous official values we have, but I never got around to it.

I tried simple optimizations, but I discarded them again in favor of mining the constants and trying to figure out what originally threw my calculations off. Interpolations are ultimately only useful for the ships you have points for. As far as I know, Belfast uses the same 6crh AP Mk IV that Perth uses, and the shell constants for Perth were mined. c_D is 0.33 and K is 2609. If you simulate with these values, the curve will probably wind up being somewhat higher than the experimental values published by WG. This is a systematic error that, as far as I can tell, comes from a slightly different linear drag component. I had to stop work on this matter before I could truly refine it and the cw_2 = 100+1000/3*D; is just where my 'research' was up to. cw_2 seems to depend on more than just D...

Tone is still in early design to find an interesting plane dynamic for it. It will come next year at the earliest, if ever.

Some people try really hard to blame their own losses on the mods of others.

There is a multitude of ways to be precise down to 1° if you happen to be in a situation where you need it. Use the angle indicator on your crosshair.

This is a pointless argument because ANY gameplay mod is conceivably an advantage, otherwise it wouldn't exist in the first place. Make the AP icon slightly larger? Now it's easier to tell whether you have AP or HE loaded and you have an advantage! Put it into the vanilla client! No, it's not superior, just more efficient. I can do the exact same using slightly more time. You realize that the minimap gives you right angles, yes? Just add/subtract the differences and you get the relative angle to the target ship. You won't be off by more than 4-5° compared to what the mod would tell you and you need to wriggle to bring your guns to bear anyway. If the target is roughly ahead of you, you can also use the angle display of your default crosshair by aiming the guns to the bow away from the target. The crosshair will display the angle difference as the guns rotate around. That gives you an angle display built into the vanilla client right now. The only argument I'm willing to accept is the turn thing Tyrendian mentioned.

You have a point here, but in my opinion the game gives you the same functionality with the minimap. If you play the game at high resolution, the icons are precise down to maybe 1° of arc, so if you see a pixel nudging to the side, you know they're turning. And if you have a mod that displays current heading on the minimap, you get even better accuracy. I do agree that it would help with seeing turns, though. edit: And before anybody ponies up the argument that this mod drastically reduces the effort necessary to judge these things: yeah, it does, but WoWs is not a fast game. Even in a very heated battle there's enough time to look at the minimap for a second or take a careful look at enemy ships, so an experienced player can do the same in any situation.

The "probability of penetration" only refers to the autobounce mechanic. It doesn't take armor or shell characteristics into account, so the mod doesn't do anything that you can't do yourself with a well-trained eye. I don't use it and in my opinion it doesn't give players and unfair advantage. I have no problem with anybody using it.

Will probably lose 20km torpedoes, though. Not sure about 12km.

German torpedoes are a free-for-all. All the German surface ships ever used in combat was the G7a, but there were dozens of experimental torpedoes that Lesta can use. There's a huge variety with tons of different propulsion systems. I don't understand the slow speed-high damage thing, though. If anything, German torpedoes were low damage-high speed.

I just wanted to say how much I loved this map when it came up just now and that I finally think WoWs map design is moving in a good direction. The chaos on this map was glorious and the whole game was just 10/10.