Redcap375

HE does more damage that it should IMHO. All the lines have been burred, best example is a certain DD penning 32 MM of armour. I mean, really? RN BB's starting this all off.

Not even gonna bite, not worth it and too old for that stuff. The man asked for an honest answer and i gave him one. I hope he enjoys his choice as that's what it's about at the end of the day.

I hope you understand where i'm coming from with this one. I would recommend the Balansgrad for a purely honest answer , all though I really wish you don't. It's trashing both the stats and Clans at the moment as it is a extremely strong ship (OP). It's making many a casual Storm league clans a nightmare and widening the gap between casual players and elites. My Clan mates used to love playing the Black, but with the addition of other DD radar ships and hydro and its painfully slow torps, it's kinda been left out a tad. It's basically no longer unique. However, it's a much more balanced ship and fun it seems. So the OPGrad but i truly hope you don't mate.

Well said. You, like many of us, know what a ship can do with AA and make no bones about it. You don't even need ManAA in most ships (like the Buf/Des/Cleveland ect). Having AA skills doesn't make anyone a potato just because they didn't pick FP or DE. What is does do, however, is completely cancel a whole ship class out of the game. Always smile when playing CV's (less so now)

My thoughts too

Read all the comments again, absorb it, then get back to me. You'll understand why. And please don't use the word Irony when it has no relevance what-so-ever. I too like the word but only when it's used correctly. Good luck with the balancing thing, truly. All the best.

Kinda sums you up on that one. no contempt there then. Little secret *shhhhhh*, i also play the other classes so i know what it's like, no need to bluff. But keep that one to yourself. Seriously, good luck with the "balance team" thing...Some serious waking up to do on that one son.

Very honest review. A non bias view with no axe to grind is very refreshing sir.

Depends on which side of the fence you are on. People forget about this: If your a DD then you thank god daily that they have AP bombs, so do CL. However, if your a German BB (as well as some others) or CA then your days CAN be really numbered. Depending if you equip t any sort of AA. Tirps are normally dead meat. AP bombs were a good idea but implement wrongly. They should have never have had the killing power against CA. Should have been BB's only. And how much experience have you had in CV's? Pre...cis...ely. Take it you don't like them in your DD's right? How did i guess.

How can you say that CV's dominate the Battlefield with 79 Plane kill in your Atlanta? Or your Mino? or your Hood? Ect... Now i understand that you are a DD player too, so i expect some resentment, i get it mate, really do. But please don't think CV's are OP because when you do meet a CV it's your direct counterpart (sad, but true). DD players HATE CV players as it takes away that one thing they live or die on.....Concealment. I am a CV captain, i will make your life a misery if you don't do something about it....Most don't and expect to play the same game when a CV is in the MM. What CV's need is people NOT to spec skills in AA or to switch their defensive AA consumable out for something like hydro. The funny thing is that most do, hence it makes life that bit easy for them. But it is THEIR CHOICE that they do so, like most things in life. The second is not knowing what to do with it when they have it. Popping the defensive AA when the planes are at extreme range and get out is one of the most basic mistakes people make. And it happens ALOT! Next is sailing in a straight line, happens ALOT! Next is not turning into the torps, happens ALOT! Please, it's not that CV's were too strong, it was the fact that noone could be bothered to counter them, in any form. Those that did (like me) had no problems what-so-ever with them thought this game. I would like to think i am one of the "good" CV players, yet even i am unable to get more that 56% WR in the Essex (68% in Tahio)? Is it because of the enemy CV player? Nope, not really to be brutally honest. It's because of the amount of AA that is currently knocking around in the game and has got stronger and stronger for the last 2 years to the point now. A CV is only as good as his team lets him. If they are plums then all the bombers in the world isn't going to help. Unless you meet a AA/CV div (alot now) then the enemy CV isn't the problem. There are OM/OMNI players that have alot (alot) high WR in simple ships like the Yam, Republic and Conq. Do they dominate the Battlefield? So how is my 56% WR dominating? Wouldn't i have something like 70+ like some have in other ships? The difference is that ships cant choose to equip themselves with anti shell defensive gating guns that can shot them out of the air. There is a set of skills that can completely nurture a whole class of ships (CV's). No other set of captains skill are as brutal or effective against another class. I know, i play ALL classes. Prime example is your Atlanta, imagine 2 of them (any AA ship) at the caps. 2 NO-fly zones, period. In-fact in some games you can cover TWO caps with one ship. IMHO, just like yours mate which I totally respect, is that i have never had a problem facing a CV and the amount of times i have actually been sunk by one is very very small. IMHO the ones that really want the re-work are the ones trying to make their own territory safe and not caring about other classes. I'm sorry to say and will get lynched mobbed but DD players are the worst for it, BB's players that refuse to have AA skills comes a close second. Consoles are linked with the change to the current CV rework. And please before saying how broken they apparent were, how about playing more than 33 games out of 3535 in them! Or are you another player that minces around without any thought of AA or even picking a ship (few of them) that has crap AA anyway? Please don't take that to heart but really does my head in when people say that not even a ship, but the whole class is broken because of this and without even playing the bloody line. It's like me trying to buy a car with the seller saying "It's got great handling on turns, handles like a charm and feels very comfortable" and replying "Have you actuality drove it yourself"....Errrr, nope? How much credibly has that chap got now. Am i going to take his opinion with a pinch of salt? Defo. You have a higher WR in tier 7-8 normal silver ships than i do in some of my tier 7-8 CV's..How is CV game play more dominate????? Has anyone seen any of the big online matches where CV's are allowed? Do they wipe the floor with the enemy team, even the best one's? Nope. Are they killing 4-5 ships a game? Nope. Bingo... Totally agree. Yet people still have it in their heads that they are some sort of killing machines every single game. Really don't understand it, never have. The only time i will say CV's can completely dominate is with ships like the Kaga and Sapain. They are 2 very powerful ships even in a casual hands with good MM (A Kaga in a tier 5-6 game is the most destructive force in this game, bar none). The Saipan in the hands of a good player is the single worse CV to come up against (CV vs CV) in tier 7 MM. But it's no more powerful than 2 Belfast's in a div that slaughter DD's. Or Stalingrads that are dominating the stats and effecting Clans. It's ok for players to have 70%+ WR in other ships but as soon as a CV has more than 55%, people are up in arms. There are far, far, far more players with more skill in normal ships that can alter the battle more then the small handful of players that are considered "very good" in CV's. The rest (like Dunc has rightly stated) do close to nothing. Anyway, forgetting about all of that, the rework is truly powerful. This what you have at the moment is chicken feed. If you chaps are struggling with CV's (lol) at the moment, i pray for your soul when this goes live. You asked for it.

How about i flip that statement of "No money, no Game" with: No game, no Money? Like you have clearly stated, WOT has a decline of players (myself being one of them when i seen the light *cough premium ammo*). That is because of WG making a rod for their own back. Not because of the console or PC debate. WG are turning customers away in their droves due to their business practices. Console online games are 10 to a penny and this will get lost amongst the rest. Dumbing down play brings in some types of players (children, younger kids) but get rid of older ones. When WW2 is concerned and the nature of the game it's self, they will be better off keeping the older (mine) generation happy. Kids likes modern stuff. I will remind you of that when it come to fruition. They didn't "intend" to bring tier 9-10 premiums into the game as well as subs, hummm look what happened.

If it wasn't for Clans I would not be playing this game at all. How far I have come in these years....

*cough* 4 points: 1) Because at no point did they connect Consoles with the CV rework stating that it was not a reason why it was being changed (rings a bell?). That was the REAL reason why they made the changes. You can not be that naive believing some of the divvle you was being fed. 2) You haven't played a single game in a CV so how can i take your word for CV's being OP? CV's arnt even my main and i can categorically state that at no point in this game (apart from 2 CV beta) has CV's ever been a problem for any ship that i have sailed. Please look at my Plane death numbers which for even Battleships, are staggering. WASD did the rest. The last year has been hell for many casual CV players with even Battleships like the Alsar, Jean Bart, Lion, Conquare and Republic able to cut down planes like they were butter. 3) Those "right hands" probably counted for 10% of all CV players. The ones that stuck it out to get to tier 10 and learnt to play the hardest class in the game. And how do we reward them for all their hard work? Accuse them of skill gap, really . Love it in society how we crucify the people who do well instead of patting them on the back. 4) I want to remind you and all those that WANTED this rework (saying anything, like them being OP, to get it) to suck up what will be thrown at you regarding the new CV rework. Because my friends, after playing quite a few of them its a new kinda PAIN for DD's, CA and BB's. You know when you pressed that magic button and the planes just evaporated on 3/4 of your ships? Yeah, well now not even a Woster can stop them being battered by AP bombs. You asked for this. But i'm sure you have played the rework and have first hand experience regarding the new CV's? Bring back balance? Lol.

I'm not going to lie when i say i am worried about Russian Battleships entering this game. Tanky, Hard hitting rail guns that are Op. Even though they didn't do a thing during the war. Like the IS3 or Russian line in WT that destroyed the game.

"The CV rework has nothing to do with console and is because of bla, Skill gap, bla bla, RTS, bla bla*".....................................What a bunch of ***** majority of CV players told you so.

Nothing wrong with the Des what-so-ever. Range or Reload is actually a tough choice and totally up to the captain. In randoms I would always run reload. In clans it's range (still like re-load better) In randoms my Des captain skills and even mod and upgrades are quite different to what i play in clans.

Not tin hatted mate, it's business. If everyone understands that WG it's a business then things become alot clearer in everything that they do. This is no different. Consoles are and have been for a while the future, money comes from kids now with skins, DLC and what-not. Games like Fornite that my young kids keeps on repeating when coming home from school that makes me wanna chuck every computer we have out of the house. 4-5-6 year old kids talking about tooling each other up and parents letting them play it, under-age, not giving S***. WOWS HAS to be console friendly, they have to continue to make money as it's a business. Like high street shops that are closing down because of online sales. Those that don't adapt to the current needs, die. Like this new WOWS premium account. We don't think for 1 second that it's got nothing to do with them making more money in the long run which it will (if you read between the lines). They know their customers when money is concerned. Now i'm not against business making money or some sort of anti capitalist, but when it directly effects the game then i'm against it. Right now it's killing the game and driving alot of people away from it. But they are milking what they can RIGHT NOW, in the short term, before it becomes another game like WT where people are leaving in their droves. Do we think Tier 10 Clan Battles was anything to do with fairness? £££££ Do we think adding premium ships that they said they were never gonna bring into tier 9-10 was by chance? ££££ Do we think giving people a taste of tier 6 clan was them being nice? ££££££ MOST premium ships are BETTER than there silver counterpart? £££££ The new arsenal with coal and steel? £££££ New World of Warships premium account? ££££ Nerfs to ships like the Hindy and Alsare? £££ Even the Nerf to BB AP shells*? ££££ *They know what is selling and grinding and what isn't. We think they are doing us a favour. But their first thought is "what can make us more money". Very few decisions are made for the pure benefit of us. Those that have been has always had my praises but they are very few and far between now. Kids and young folk don't care about gameplay, just shoot, shoot, damage and damage, gimmick, gimmick. That is what this is turning into and i am very sad for it. The gaming market used to be for teenagers or old skool gamers that were brought up on consoles like the Sega and Commodorer 64 but as technology is the norm with my 6 year old knowing more about computers and smart phones than i do then that is where more money can be farmed. Look at fornite and how much money that is raking in? A console game that is aimed at YOUNG KIDS. How many older players play that game hummm? "Daddy, i want a skin that looks like i am wearing someones cut off face for my Christmas present, please". I mean want happened to a good old bike hey? I have loved this quote from someone commenting on WG as a whole: Conclusion : WG is a business they have all the means (and incentives) to influence matches to be profitable. Play Freemium games at your own risk. Total War arena was a total flop that cost them alot of money. *sigh* I first came onto these threads to help people out and give them some advice to new players. How can i do that now knowing what this has changed into? How can i hand on my heart tell anyone to grind the CV line in it's current form to casual players? Even more so when they bring this new dumbed down damage machine that is the new CV re-work. My Only advice would be "fly around and kill things". That's not even tactics. Cv's have lost all sense of tactics. The only choice is what method are you going to use to blow that ship up. Excluding CV's and Bringing a ship like the Stalingrad into Clan's and soon to be more tier 10 premiums (IJN and French) is the straw that broke the camels back. The last bastion of equal play in a equal environment has now gone, never going to return. Great for business, crap for balance (please see LoL).

Everyone.. This can go round and round in circles and we will have both sides of the story. And i do respect people's opinions as long as their not biased or have their own agenda. People's own stats and server stats wont even convince the most die-hard amongst us, fair enough...Plus stats always get interpreted differently in some form or another. I bet this ship will remain top of the tier 10 cruiser list even when more and more people have it. Just like the Belfast, just like the Kaga and Saipan. All three of them had the same comments "it will die down when more people have it". See how that worked out (all three come in the top 2 in their respective classes and tiers, only one being beaten by another strong Premium ship). However, alot of popular streamers, the majority of my Clan and I seem to think it's OP, or for the more conservative amongst us "extremely strong". There is a reason why top clans are using these ships and i don't blame them. You don't use ships that don't cut it in clans. You wanna make it fair for everyone? Make it a loan ship like the rest. Then "casual" players can make their own minds up about it and believe who they want to. Hope to see you chaps in CB

Agree. However, any ship will melt with 2-3 cruisers firing at it not just the Grad. lol. Infact, the Grad will last a lot longer than most. Dedicating 3 ships to one Grad kinda sums up how strong this ship really is. And that's just ONE Grad. Into Storm at the moment and have mixed dealings with Grads. A few of them position themselves badly and present Broadsides but even when they do, i don't get the same numbers like i would against a Moskva for instance. They still go down tho like a ship should when showing broadside but takes longer with less citadels because of that bulkhead. We have seen a 3 Stalingrad push on the safe cap that was quite effective. Taking down 3 Grads when pushing Bow-on but spread out was quite efficient on their behalf as it creats nasty angles for the defending ships, including BB's. 3 lots of long rage radar to clear the way against DD was deadly (we sent a DD in intercept but got owned by chained radar). Very hard.

Troll thread. this ^^ Premuim ammo is the single biggest killer and highlights P2W in the rawest form regarding WOT. A tier 8 ship can still do very well against a tier 10. In WOT most cant even pen the enemy, never mind anything else. Anti Tanks included I hope to god they never bring that into WOWS. So help me.

Fair one. But having only 1 DD on the opposite team (2 maybe) reduces this risk. How about vigilance as captain skill? Like the moskva then. Oh and the Des and Hindy too. AP bombs wreck the majority of things, the Grad is no different. However, does this have defensive AA? I think it does, whats the odds. 15 secs more and that's relaying on the HE RNG gods to start one in the first place. Fire is always manageable like EVERYONE says. This is always kitted out with tanky captain skills (FP being one). Damage saturation also plays a bit part too. It's a battlecrusier and already covered the concealment. With skills and upgrades it's completely manageable. Like a Battleship which is it. The Moskva also turns like a brick and that's manageable. Thing is you don't see many of them moving in open waters. Like a Battlecrusier should be. The moskva is bigger than BB's too. It has something which other ships can dream off...Radar. A full HE salvo from this can really hurt any tier 10 DD (AP shells STILL hurt alot too). But it still has radar. Please see Moskva again. For a callaber of the guns it has thank god they have a longer reload. But with skills can bring this down quite a bit. Fastest Reload for any BB at tier 10. Doesn't need to like the Woster. It's Just like the Hindy, Henry, Moskva ect which has the same problem. It's a perfect sniper, BB guns with cruiser accuracy. But look at that fire chance. Please see republic. So the majority of your negatives are the SAME negatives (in bold) as the Moskva. Just with the extra fire chance and no hydro. Hydro can be replaced by Vigilance at a push and the extra fire chance is completely manageable and relying on HE RNG. So the positives FAR outweigh the negatives. Remember the amount of People that say HE inst a problem and always quote that it's manageable, this is no different. Your putting a Battlecrusier in a game with a hard cap on BB's with cruisers making up the majority of the team. THAT IS NOT BALANCED. I competly respect you @Commander_Cornflakesas you know and have agree with most the things you have said in the past (mostly), but this one we are polar opposites. However, you have one and i don't. So people can make their own judgements based on that fact. Either that they believe that people are defending a Op/Extremity strong ship or they believe that people are being jealous and don't have first hand experience (hypercritical). Grad Stats (both player and server), observations and jugement should make the rest up. Regards,

And they are: Nothing to hide here mate. Turning? slowish reload (but factor in AR and reload mod.lol)? It is a Battlecrusier after all remember. Because half must mean 2 more cons.

Diplomatic answer as per usual but your right, for the most part. It does indeed burr the lines which in a equal competitive environment is simply unfair. It's a Battlecrusier in a game full of cruisers with a cap on actual Battleships.. It basically gives you an extra Battleship on the team, if you will. Which ever way you spin it, it does. I still personally believe it's OP. The Belfast is OP too but it doesn't have torps? So, it's still a OP ship regardless. The stats are still high (2nd behind flint) even though every man and his dog has one now. So when people say "wait until more people have it then the stats will drop" is just BS. It will still dominate the stats. Just like the Kaga and Sapian It's taken over the Moskva role which was a very strong ship to begin with and gave it EVEN MORE pluses. 1) Heaver hitting accurate guns at a excellent range with flatish arcs. You are not safe anywhere on the map if you move in the open. 2) The versatility of a cruiser (radar and Defence AA) 3) More HP to boot and solid bow-on (Like everyone plays them) 4) Better Fire chance. 5) Better Torp belt 6) Additional bulkheads to stop citadels often (hit it will full broadside conq AP and not one citidel) 7) Auto bounce shell? Ho ho ho 8) Reduced aiming time for the shells, perfect cruiser killing (and DD) machine. It's negatives are just like the Moskva regarding 1) concealment and 2) longer fire duration. Well flags and tank build takes most of the latter away (2) so that's that one and it's concealment (1) is ALWAYS worked around. It doesn't need to be anywhere near the caps if it doesn't want to. It's more than accurate in hitting anything from a distance. That is not enough negatives to make this ship balanced. It excels in Clan because of the static nature of the game. It finds an island to hug, covers one side and provides covering fire to any cap it wants. When the time comes to push it has radar and it's tanking ability is epic for a *cough* cruiser? Lol. Factor in damage saturation from HE shells and it's more than capable in pushing anything off a cap. Anything. Like any cruiser in the game it still gets hit hard when showing it's broadside but it's got more HP to deal with that, as well as extra bulkheads. A Des and Zao will still get deleted alot quicker than a bloody Stalingrad will. The Mino can get one-shoted by a Grad and no amount of angling will save it (Overmatch). Nothing to do with "you have it and i don't" crap, as i too will have this after clans. (if i don't go for the next PREMIUM tier 10 BB that is)

But only a 8 km range....

First night not one Grade. 11 wins, 3 loses. Second (last) night full of them. 6 wins, 8 losses.