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    General CV related discussions.

    I have just returned to playing after a long gap from WOW to find the CV play ruined. Not really much to add that hasn't been posted in the above 180 pages on this thread. No chance of getting my money back for all those CVs I bought that to me are now completely useless?

    The Invergordon Mutiny of 1931

    I remember one of my neighbours, who served as a Royal Marine (on ships in 1950's , Korea etc) once told me that even in the 1950s, sailors still serving who'd been on those ships (or in anyway associated with those ships) still carried a black mark in their Service Documents. As an exercise in Leadership, the history and the mismanagement of the incident was still taught to my generation of young officers in the late 1980's. You mention the worry at the time of Russian style revolution, but I note that one of the lead mutineers did subsequently move to Russia (Wikipedia). Invergordon was one of the Fleet anchorages in WW1 (poor old HMS NATAL still lies there - a lesson in temperature control & storing cordite!) and the recent sea trials of the new HMS Queen Elizabeth made good use of it. Of course the great mutiny of Spithead in 1797 was also caused by poor pay (no pay rise since Charles II etc), but I'm sure our current Ministers have remembered all their history as they currently debate this years pay rise ..... or lack of (as usual )

    Operation Killer Whale - How To Win

    000_LULU_000 - probably no "right answer" as to CV positioning. Advantage of hiding in square J1 (outside harbour) is that you are totally safe, and thus can concentrate of flying the planes rather than keeping en eye out for your position wrt enemy air attacks or ships that a weak team has "let thru" (I think there is still a glitch that bizarrely allows aircraft to land & take off quicker if stationary????). However playing "inside" the harbour, as you suggests, does allow you to be nearer the fight (" lower plane travel time") AND for the North East Homeplate, allows you to be a Team player and get there :) Totally agree on the strafing of BOTs - in fact this is an ideal game to learn the mechanics of Manual control with CV aircraft, with Tier 6 aircraft against lower Tier, BOT pilots. In a separate thread, I'd love to see some "how to play" for the other missions. The CV options seem to be stuck against higher Teir fighters and ships with alarmingly good AAA Defences :(

    Operation Killer Whale - How To Win

    This is my favourite game as a CV captain (playing in Ryujo). CV positioning: stay OUTSIDE the harbour and drive your CV down to the South West square J1 (ideally on auto pilot and finally stopped, facing North). Enemy will never find you, you remain in a very good position for the 1st stage of battle (striking enemy within harbour) and there is a 50% chance that you are in a perfect position to make a last minute dash (in total safety)to the Homeplate/finish line “if” the game selects the one on the Western side of Map. Avoiding flying near ANY coastal gun installation (they will shred you!) send your aircraft SOUTH down column 1 until they can make a run in against the enemy BB that starts @ I4. You can probably sink him in 1 strike – or at least get him flooding/burning to eventually sink. Use you Fighters to SPOT the DD that accompanies that BB to allow your Team mates just approaching the Western Harbour entrance to NOT get caught out and hopefully get some rounds into that DD (or the BB if still floating). Your 2nd strike can now be set against the enemy BB alongside @ I5. If you run your TBs in on a South Easterly heading, you can use the manual aim to get ALL 4 torps from each wave to converge and hit this BB – probably enough to sink him (certainly flood etc). Use your DBs to set fire to the enemy CV alongside just to East of that BB. Use your Fighters to destroy the enemy Fighters (hopefully early) then to provide AA defence for your team that should now be inside the harbour attacking the remaining coastal installations/ merchant ships. Phase 2: leave your team to finish off the enemy INSIDE the harbour and get re-armed etc to take out the 2 x enemy CVs that appear in 2nd & 3rd waves from North West. Your strike planes WILL need fighter escort, so your team will probably need to wear the 1st enemy TB strike against them. Hopefully your fighters will get stuck in overhead or near to the enemy CVs (x2) – good this allows them to SPOT for any Team mates whose guns can reach that far. Next priority for the fighters is to SPOT the enemy DDs approaching the Western & Middle Harbour entrances – possibly SPOTTING enemy Torps earlier than your friendly Lead ships might do on their own. Now the game has 2 choices: if the Home plate is in the WEST (best for you) then ideally get some aircraft over to the North East entrance to the Harbour to SPOT and support any friendly ship that has taken on the honourable role of defending that approach to the harbour (if your team wants ALL 5 stars, then someone (ideally a BB) need to “take-one-for-the-team” and sacrifice themselves up there to prevent enemy from entering the harbour that way. You can support him by SPOTTING). If the Home plate IS in the North East, then your CV is in the wrong position – live with it ‘cos you will never make it in time! But as the rest of your fleet pushes North East – you need to defend the Western & Middle approaches with your aircraft (again – leave your CV where it is!!). Finally – keep an eye on the time. Don’t be afraid of pushing out “4 minutes left” etc type calls to herd the less time aware (polite phrase!) members of the team. Some friendly units will need to start driving towards the Home Plate from the 8/9 minutes left point!! Mission fails if you DON’T get 50% of ships to home plate, and there is nothing more frustrating than watching a clear win being wasted because some friendly BB/CA/CL decides to chase down some easy kill thus denying the rest of the team the win.(first 2 posts in this thread say the same thing!) Small print: this plan works well in current Killer Whale set up – enemy CVs are all similar or lower Tier and enemy ships do NOT have AAA defence that they have in other missions. Remember any plan only survives until 1st contact with the enemy etc

    Can't manual attack

    yes the USN CV fighters are better than the IJN, but the "balance" is the better anti ship capability that the iJN have. If you are new to CV play and are clearly starting out on the IJN line, try & pick up and play the USN T Langley - try it in a couple of CO OP games and get a feel for how the USN play style is different (also make you a better IJN CV player in the longer run). I much prefer the IJN CV line - but the answer (as suggested above) is the "teamwork" really works! rather than rush in to attempting to strike at game start, if you come up against USN fighter opposition, then "draw" them back over friendly Cruisers and use their AAA to even out the odds. Ultimately it is about "having fun" - but I know what you mean about the long road of frustration getting there!!!
  6. Got her - luv her. Only played COOP so far (10 games to get a "feel". Have opted for the 2,2,1, air wing load out (can't see advantage of IJN DBs). each TB sqn comes with 6x Tier 6 Kates, torps drop as a "wide 3 with a following narrow 3" - I'm sure there'll be a You Tube video shortly, Thoughts: that torp drop is an absolute killer against Bots, against PVE, not so sure. Having been on the receiving end of a KAGA Torp drop, I can say that that 2nd wave of 3x narrow does catch you when you think you've made that successful turn in towards, but as the CV captain, using manual drop does make it harder as you are effectively dropping 2 waves of torps - could just be me as a crap manual TBdropper! - but even against BoTs I was struggling to get a god coverage without "front or second" wave of torps missing. Note that her "visibility" is bad (someone less lazy than me will give a statistic), but I find some thought needs to go into where you want to hide with this ship. Having previously complained about the credits/money loosing aspects of CVs, I was averaging 70 - 100k credits per COOP game, (Random/Ranked should be higher) , but nice to be able to play CVs without having to rob a bank! Good looking model, my thanks to WoW for yet another interesting ship to add to the game.

    U.S.A Aircraft Carriers

    Perhaps unfair for me to comment as I do not yet have any Tier 8/9/10 USN CVs, but your proposed MOD 5 of 2x Ftrs & 3 x TB sqns, although remaining in the same aircraft numbers total to existing CV loadouts, is going to be seen as too powerful. Without the numbers to hand (I'm sure someone will quickly post them), not withstanding the OP AAA @ these higher Tiers, the potential damage by 3 TB sqns is surely way in excess of 3 x DB sqns - thus is adding imbalance to the game? Whilst I'd love to play with 3 USN TB sqns (6 torps in the water per sqn, cross dropped against an enemy DD), you just know the anti CV community will call "foul" Good discussion though, I await others to post their thoughts.

    Bots' names

    Famous Admirals and some Russian ones as well......

    CVs Trees really messed up

    Agree, a premium IJN would be good. I am one of those players that is hugely influenced by the the "look" of the historical ships, so I mostly agree with Ferdinand's original post - just a shame that he felt obliged to use the "f" word in a forum visited by youngsters, perhaps an edit is in order?

    Carrier tiers and types

    I agree that the MM is the problem. Not wishing to get into thread drift, but it is the poor CV that suffers most when placed in a higher Tier battle. I accept that the planes we see are just graphics and the characteristics are not truly reflective of their capabilities (which sort of match the Tier that the CV is in), but the differences between progressive Tiers IS significant. I ended up in a Tier 6 IJN CV today playing in Tier 8 games, six times in a row. I played ALL the tricks, but settled for acting as RECON and SNIPING the other CV (damned un-english). (Or did I miss the addition of Phalanx CIWS being fitted to all Tier 8 ships in the latest WG crusade MOD against CVs!!)
  11. No cable connected (smartassnoob) good comment. However, to use that sort of anchor (a "spare"?) would not require a derrick or crane, but rather "breaking" the cable up forw'd, and using ropes & tackles to manoeuvre the cable aft to connect to the (spare) anchor. Time consuming and cumbersome, but achievable. But as pointed out, really only practical if using this stern anchor as a spare. (i.e. you're NOT using both of your forward anchors) - look at pre WW1 RN ships at anchor or at a bouy where the cable has been broken and connected to bouy/first anchor) if using these "smaller" stern anchors for additional holding (to stop swing) then I guess a suitable length of rope hawser would be brought up and attached. Anchor would be "lowered" rather than "dropped" using a winch. No weight of cable to hold ship, only the anchor itself, but sufficient to stop swing, NOT stop ship drifting away on tide. That's how I'd do it - but the carrying of stern anchors really dates from a Navy way before my time ........so all guess work from this poster! https://www.bismarck-class.dk/technicallayout/anchors/anchors.html a link discussing Bismark & Tirpitz Stern anchors (spares!) - note the decision to remove Bismark for weight reasons before her final sortie, and Tirpitz's use of one so as to keep position @ anchor in Fjords. From experience, anchoring in Fjords is difficult because the depth of water goes very quickly from "suitable" to "too deep" in a matter of yards.

    Strange massive Team Killing event-bug or cheat, please check.

    Already answered by several - but for newbies reading this far - a very useful trick if you end up head to head against a torp firer (esp if playing against Bots in COOP). If you cannot avoid passing an enemy ship, head to head then steer as close to him as you dare, his toprs will not arm and thus pass underneath you. To answer Original Post : it does sound like a mis calculation, I would be amazed if you have caused that much flooding from 1 torp. Sadly I have picked up "pink" status more than once, invariably at lower tiers where Bots (COOP) or other players have turned the most illogical way. Still my fault, of course so no complaints, but on those very, very few occasions I have NEVER experienced what you are describing.
  13. True that different anchor designs work in different ways (knobster), esp true if you are a merchant ship or off shore Rig type where you will always anchor in the same seabed for whole ship life. But warships tend to have anchors that will work in sand, clay, shingle and for last 100 years have flukes that pivot so as to get better hold. Charts will tell you whether the ground is considered "good holding ground" - not a good idea to anchor on bare rock and coral might well snag your anchor on weighing. Forgot to mention in previous post, that in seas like the Mediterranean - which have very little tidal range, ships frequently berth either just bows on or stern on to jetty - this is called Mediterranean mooring. Advantage = takes up less jetty space - but will need an anchor deployed as you make your approach (either bow or stern - depending in which way around you park!) to "pull you off" when you leave. So if you look at Italian ships (non in game so far) they will also carry a small anchor at stern. (cosmo) - again very true for survey ships and rig support vessels (dive ships use this to "hover" over dive bell) - but warships cannot afford the weight of such apparatus, and remember, anchoring offers a chance to save fuel and conduct much needed maintenance - although in wartime, a warship captain would consider "risk" and decide at how much notice to get underway he might relax his machinery to. In an emergency, he could even "cut" his cable (technically he would break it at a joint), tie a float to the cable & anchor he leaves behind on seabed, and rush out of harms way. Only to return later to attempt to recover buoy. Very frequent practice in Napoleonic era - hence requirement for so many anchors on sailing ships. Finally, it is the weight of cable that "holds" the ship in place rather than just the anchor "digging in" to the sea bed. The stronger the wind / current the more cable is laid out on seabed. I heard a story of an ambitious RN executive officer who thought it would be a good idea to run out ALL the cable in several miles of depth so as to allow access to the cable hold for cleaning. Needless to say with that much weight out, the ship's capstans could not pull the cable & anchors back up! so the ship had to sheepishly drive on until the anchors eventually touched bottom at the edge of continental shelf and thus reduce the weight on the capstans. The approaches to Portsmouth harbour are currently being dredged so as to allow the new CVs enter next year. Along with numerous mines/bombs from WWII being found on a regular basis, they are pulling up cannons & anchors going back over 2-300 years!
  14. quick answer (guessing without reading up on IJN specifically): pretty certain it is used (as mentioned above) as a means of preventing ships "swinging" at anchor. Sheltered anchorages in the Pacific suitable for large ships are not as conviently placed as those in Atlantic - think attempting to anchor in a small lagoon where the depth of water rapidly drops away to unusable depths, leaving a very small "usable area" that several ships ALL need to drop their pick. So off Spithead (Portsmouth), or Scapa Flow = large area, good depth (20-30 metres)= large number of ships can anchor at same time. mid Pacific - small "shelf" (lagoon/island) = small area = only single ship AND may not allow full swing at anchor. Swing at anchor simply put is calculated as a circle, centred on where anchor was dropped, and = length of ship + length of cable put out (if I remember my Nav!!) = 2 & 1/2 times the depth of water in metres. If more than one ship anchors , none of these circles can overlap. So if the "weight" of the ship is held in position by the bow anchor, a smaller(?) stern anchor can be used to hold ship "fixed" in position, thus allowing no swinging circle, thus allowing more units to anchor at same location. Why don't all ships carry this 3rd anchor, designing BBs is all about the balance between weight and protection (consider the Royal Navy WW1 Battlecruiser design, which took risk, which subsequently proved fatally flawed). Anchors & cable are clearly heavy, and the higher up in the hull they are mounted creates all sorts of stability issues (ignoring crew comfort!) which in turn affects gunnery accuracy and more. (again, look at later designs of BBs to see how low down the anchors sit versus pre-dreadnought designs) Again - a "guess" from me, but when you look at the history of why Hong Kong, Singapore, Truk, Pearl Hbr etc became so strategically important in such a vast area of water - it suggests that good anchorages are rare and far apart in the Pacific, to maximise use of isolated, but small, spots requires a solution that allows more units to anchor than would otherwise be considered normal. Of course, the photos might just show a "spare" - and my theory above is complete tosh!!!

    Coop battles.

    Entirely agree that "rewards" for COOP should not match RANDOM/RANKED, however...... Semantics with words, "Rewards" versus "negative credit". I add nothing new to this topic, but add weight to the many, who pay Premium, support the makers by purchasing Premium ships, but due to lifestyle circumstances (living in Hotels/poor connection issues) play mostly COOP. Well that's me, but I am being DENIED the ability to play above Tier 7 as the repair costs exceed any credit that can be earned. WoW's current business model is going to drive the "many" away and leave them with the new players (playing for "free" @ lower Tiers ONLY). Shame because the "many" enjoy their product and were quite prepared to pay for the premium aspects for an accepted return for their money, but not being fleeced.