Pikkozoikum

I remember a unicum call that countering. But we also talked about "counter" and not counter. I also said, it depends on how you define counter. Some would only count "counting", if they get a button, that instant hits and destroys 12 planes. People often forget, that other ships always do dmg, even with counter measurements. (Smoke firing? Citadel hits, while angling etc)

Well, that also depends, how you mean that. Grouping with 5 Minotaurs would deny the strikes - just as example, exaggeration intented. Also if the DD is not spotted, he can't strike. If the CV is already attacking a single ship, well, the strike will likely happen, but also not 100% sure, that the strike will hit. But the same, can you deny a BB from shooting you? You can't if the BB is shooting you, you can't deny it. Beside that. it is now way better, than pre 0.8.0. imo. I remember how I one shotted ships with my Kaga. I feeld sometimes bad, if a T6 or T7 bb took all the torps or died thorugh a perma flood. I also remember, when I moved with a Tirpitz and me as Nagato around. Not far away a DD and cruiser. Don't remember, guess it was a T8 Us CV with AP bombs, who one shotted first the Tirpitz, then me. Even grouping was pointless. Also unicums did way better earlier, if you check their stats. Especially when you consider, that this uncium not only did better, he also countered the worse CV player in the other team, as well.

Good positioning, map awareness, WASD and some have smoke

What a well fitting meme! :D

Well, small balancing issues are everywhere, and I would also suggest, that CVs should have -2 planes deck number for every type, Kaga -4. But that are smaller balancing issues. But I'm not saying, CV is totally broken and OP. I think, it's mandatory for a good CV player to avoide high risks and heavy plane loses, picking the right targets. (was also the case with RTS) It's se same, if you would play BB, a silly player would rush into his death into 3 DDs, getting torped to death. A good player would wait for spotting and looking for good position. Does make that BBs unbalanced, because the DDs can't torp a good bb player? That would be the wrong conclusion. So just saying plain "there is no counter" is wrong. Even a no AA ship can play smart and "counter" a CV. (It depends, how you define counter).

I rarely really deplane (having less than 3 planes on deck), because I mostly go for isolated targets, or targets with weaker AA protections. If I deplane, then it's because I played bad or the enemy was really well grouped (and I played bad wasting my planes). But it doesn't feel like I would really need sling shot

You don't need a sling shot for hitting AP bombs, they don't improve the aiming. Sling shot only avoides the long and mid range, but ends up in the short range. They changed the AA to overlapping and lowered the single zones dps. That means the long range is so weak, that you don'T have to avoide it with sling shot. The mid would be a bit more worth. But the short is now the highest dps zones and sling shot doesn't avoide that.

Is that even an issue? I mean the long range has low dps, avoiding that, doesn't give that much? I never used it, because it feels like to do that is not worth the effort

Zur Zeit unter den T5 Kreuzern mit 1500 Battles Winrate Platz 2 Flugzeugabschüsse Platz 1 Schaden Platz 1 Bexp Platz 1 Scheint kein schlechter Kreuzer allgemein zu sein

The germans 88mm are some famous and well known guns. So we can do the special rule, that all german 88mm guns have a special penetration of 1/4 penetration just like most seconadries of the germans. Also every ship type: BBs, Cruisers, DDs have special gun rules. Why shouldn't that count for Subs? It's unlogical, if some are allowed to have special rules, but other not. And as game design it makes only sense, to give the deck guns the capabiltiy to damage superstructure. It's even realistic, then I can't remember, that the superstructure were able to shatter HE shells. Thus it makes only sense in multiple ways. If you don't care about proof, then I can't help you. It's like I would say "In Battlefield are vehicles, those could work in Call of Duty as well" and you say, "No it's CoD and not Battle Field". you can compare similiar games and take over some mechanics. That works. Somtimes it's better to take already existing mechanics, instead of creating new ones. I don't see a point there. Denying the enemy team a kill - that's game breaking, totally. If this is just such a big deal for you. Then you can just make it, if submarine has 100% hp and dies by suicide, he gets a penalty for 1 TK. It's unlikely to abuse that. Who is able to survive a whole game without taking damage and than doesn't notice, that he is slowly dying from 100% down to 0%, that's very unlikely. How about you focus on good ideas, instead of complaining about stuff, that you don't like? We won't make any progress, if everything gets denied.

2. The special rules are not for gunboats. That are nation traits. Thus subs can have national trades as well. The Kii has 1/4 penetrations with her secondaries - a special rule. Is Kii a gunboat or a seondary-build ship? No. So special rules exists, and can be applied on subs as well, otherwise it would be a special rule for subs, when they are not allwoed to have special rules. 3. It's a fun mechanic like it's a fun mechanic that some BBs have torps. Or it is a fun mechanic to ram other ships. Do you not like fun? 4. and 5. Yes, but the point is, to make deck guns viable, we have to make them viable for every sub, not only for 4 subs... Otherwise there would be subs with 100% chance of shattering, which makes no sense game design wise. 6. As I said, it makes no sense to create a type of ships, and only one or two have complete different mechanics. It would be like giving the moskwa guided rockets. Thus you have to make guns viable for all Subs, not only IJN and France. You could do that in Steel Ocean, but nobody did that, only when they underestimated it, and died because of bad planning. Everyone can suicide easily, just move full broadside in the first 2 minute. If someone suicides in the first minute, he gets 0 ep. I see there no difference in the end result, if you get an undamged bb at the border, though the sub could still be more useful, even after suiciding. I mean, otherwise you can also suicide by just staying surfaced? wont take not much longer, actually it would go faster, because the draining could take a bit longer than one salvo of a cruiser or bb. When you don't like it, I can't change it. I think it wouldn't make BBs op. Every team would have BBs with this kind of smoke. In Steel Ocean that was even the case, I like the idea to give the big ships a teamplay-tool

Harugumo disagrees with you. Ships have special guns rules. All japanese 100mm guns have 1/4 pens. Special AP mechanics for US ships. German He secondaries have also higher penetrations. There are already many special rules as you see. Read the full text. I said it's for those cases, when a ship is on low HP. I played Steel Ocean and it happend often, that there is a low hp DD chasing a submarine. There are many IJN subs with 140mm There is Surcouf with 203 mm. Making guns avaiable also means make subs like Surcouf as prem viable. Otherwise it would't make much sense Actually I don't care about special rules, I'm IJN player, and those have 140mm guns. If it is such a huge deal for you, then the last hitting ship will get the kill. It will grant captial ships an escape tool against everything, sure. But keep in mind, while they get a tool against everyship, they game gains a new shiptype against those ships.Also there are on both sides captial ships with smoke mortars, so it's actually balanced teamwise. Also the advantage is not even that huge, since BBs can't smoke fire.

Introduction I played a lot Steel Ocean, a similar game with submarines and some mechanics there were a lot fun, which I'm missing in World of Warships. I want to give some suggestions based on my experience with the sub gameplay of Steel Ocean. Table of content Silent running + Team spotting Deckgun Damage, when out of Oxygen Fog mortar for BB and CV AA Aquisition range Icon for submarines DC for cruiser 1. Silent running + Team spotting 2. Deckgun 3. Damage, when out of Oxygen 4. Fog mortar for BB and CV 5. AA 6. Aquisition range 7. Icon for submarines 8. DC for cruiser

As I described, the other CV will passive spot the CV and then the own CV will get easily shot down. A CV doesn't have the size or armor to sustain focus fire

There are two things, that I don't like at the moment 1. I always wished, the CV could move more with the Fleet and also that the CV is more involved. Which is rarely possible, because the other CV would passive spot the CV, thus the enemies can shot the CV down. 2. At the end of the game, when only one CV is left, in the winning team the CV have to bother with the fighter planes, which sucks and are just annoying, when it is already won. The fighter were implemented to prevent CV sniping, but this is not the case, when the match is already lost/won I had this idea. In the naval history Fog mortar and Fog shells for guns existed. I would like it, if the CV would get that. Maybe 1 or max. 2 charges. The CV could smoke in a circle shape, not a wall like DDs and this on a shooting-range like 1-3 km or something. The CV would also lose her CV-fighter squad. That would mean the CV could go more closer to the team. The CV could give support AA fire to the team and the team AA cover for the CV, while the CV has to smoke herself. In some cases the CV could also smoke teammates. The issue with this idea would be, that CV sniping is possible, especially against worse players. But I would like, if the CV (the vessel) is a bit more involved to the battle.

It's not a translation, that is your interpretation. You came up with facts, which are irrelevant. I was showing the last week and an increase in High and low tier CVs to check the statement, that there is no increase. But I see an increase, otherwise take the same numbers, pls calculate with them. If I did an calculation error, then I might be wrong, otherwise not. Stay impersonal.

Actually the facts that are presented are mostly not relevant. I mean lets talk about the cap-attacking potential of the CV! Is that an important fact? Nobody talks about that low number... because it's not a "Fact", that could show, that the CV is "op". Many people don't use the correct context of facts. Like "I show you one game, Oh one game with 100% wr, op!" Sorry, but that are facts for stupid people. Like another guy earlier said, we have to see the big numbers, not single samples. Otherwise I show you 4k base exp Yamato games.

If I take those data only compared to the total numbers of high tier it is for Rework: 2.4 % players and 2.11% Battles RTS September last week: 1.98% players and 1.71% Battles Higher poplulation in higher as well. Here the numbers Type - Tier - Players - Battles "they know they failed to increase population " - I commented on this statement. I showed, that the population increased recently. The Reason why - doesn't matter. Just proved, that it raised. So It's not wrong, or did I a wrong calculation, is there an error?

Yes, sometimes it's better to not trust other statistics blindly. But also somtimes the own view is influenced and subjective. Thus both should always be considered. Own view + the view of others and statistics (Correct) numbers are not lying, could only be misinterpreted

Is this a dream? Thanks! But what I also would manage, want I'm missing There is a huge thrill for the Sub player, when he has to hide. In Steel ocean, when a submarine stopped moving (0 knots), then he became invisible. It was so thrilling to not know, what is happening above, not able to move and just hope to not get DC'ed 1. My suggestion would be: Subs are invisible for all, when they stop at the depth to 0 knots. The sub can't see anything or team spot. The DD has to blind drop, but is also invisible against the sub, since the sub can't spot there. That is a huge thrill and gamble. 2. Manual guns and AA Even if the guns are weak. it is amazing, when the sub uses the gun to finish a 300hp ship. It doesn't has too much op impact, but it will be hilarous to do that! Could be a special trait for the IJN having pretty good deck guns, the I 400 had 140 mm deck gun Give them a good sigma for good aiming and fast reload. So it might be able to sink a 1k hp Ship Could also be good in a Sub vs Sub fight, when both surface

It should be. As a Veteran it's easy, at least for me, I have tons of flags, camos etc. Also I gain sometimes 30d prem and stuff from CBs and other stuff. I didn't payed any prem days for years. Though I bought prem camous for the T10s. As a beginner, well until T8 it should be possible, but affording the T9 and T10 is nasty because of the high maintenance costs. But technically it's possible, just more grind. There will be later at mid tier the issue, that you will need credits, thus you might play a ship just for earning the credits and you can't progress even when you have the exp.

I looked at the last week and the last year ~same date on maple Last week The CVs low and high have a total % on the total battles: 3,98% The % player number of all players: 4,28% Sept 2018 The CVs low and high have a total % on the total battles: 2,65% The % player number of all players: 2,98% 43% more players, 50% more battles. Beside that, there will be maybe a support branch, also there can be more premium CVs like Shinano

So, what's the point? Bugs exist in this game and sometimes it takes a long while. Not the first time. It'was way smaller than before, the graphes also showed that. 1 battle? Why showing this? Maybe the whole statistic of every battle with your CV pre Rework and with Rework would be interesting, but I'm not here for stat shaming

the 400 pages before - the thread was sticky. But it isn't sticky now, and lately the discussion is not that constructive. No ideas about what is wrong and how to improve. In the german forum we have a topic for improvment and ideas without discussion, any discussion there get deleted

I play Kii, it's fun with the CVs :D