thiextar

Just a crazy thought here: What if players wouldnt get randomly detonated for no good reason? Nah, that would be crazy

Its wargaming, if they ever got something right, it would be weird

Apparently it was time to repost that for the 3rd time ^^ Also, you do realise that fixes and rebalancing of cv is coming wether you like it or not right? Wargaming stated that on reddit 3 hours ago... The best thing you can do if you like carriers is actually to give them good alternatives and ideas for how to do it. The fixes are coming regardless.

1. You contributed something the first time you said that you disagree with it, not the 20 other times you said it without any new arguments. 2. You obviously still do not listen to what anyone says as you are still moaning about damage not being too high, something that is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion point. 3. If the carriers are reworked to have proper counters, and ships are reworked to be able to defend themselves against them, this will obviously result in lower battle efficiency of carriers. If this results in the carrier becoming underpowered as a result of said rework, the carrier would obviously have to recieve buffs in other areas to compensate, no one is disputing this. 4. Im not being killed by carriers because i have adapted to the most boring meta imaginable, thus ive been holding a steady 65% winrate. 5. I said that they should have removed the class waay before the rework, back when it was practically abandoned they could have removed it with little negative effect. The reworked carriers are actually more akin to bringing an entirely new class to the game rather than reworking an old one, as they are so different, and the old carriers were pretty much never in matches anyways. 6. Broken and overpowered means two completely different things, please look this up. 7. I get what your opinion is, so can you please stop spamming it relentlessly? If you have something new to bring, id be delighted to read it, but the last 2 pages of your posts is just repeated gibberish. 8. Wargaming knows that carriers are broken, and are working on fixing them, here is a qoute from sub_octavian on reddit: "In the very near future we are going to make an update on current CV changes and tweaks. Some of you thought we went silent, but that's due to several things being prepared actively. We are determined to address a lot of concerns, and are not going to relax." The point of threads like this is to get ideas for possible fixes out there, some kind of fix is coming regardless, so might as well make it a good one by getting as many ideas out as possible for wargaming to maybe read and maybe be influenced by, even if the chance of that happening on the eu forum is kinda non-existant.

Nope, not as long as you pick your targets wisely and bait out dfaa if you really need to attack an aa cruiser. It makes it so that your supposed counter would actually have a viable defence vs you. Anyways, you are contributing absolutely nothing to the discussion point of this thread, its about specifically changing dfaa, not about overall carrier balance, and its obvious that you just want to defend your precious toy, so can you please stop derailing the topic and let people discuss dfaa?

Literally no one is claiming that carriers deal too much damage, or even that they are overpowered. Broken != Overpowered

" From Reddit: Captains, Due to a technical error In update 0.8.3, the Radar range of USN premium cruisers Montpelier and Wichita changed to 10 km instead of correct and the intended 9 km. This will be fixed in update 0.8.4, as we specifically reworked all Radar ranges for all ships to be systematic, and would like to avoid any inconsistencies. We're absolutely sure that it will not significantly affect Montpelier's combat capabilities and Wichita was originally released with the correct range. We value your trust in us above all and want to own up to our mistakes. Thus, all purchases with Montpelier and Wichita in Premium shop made after update 0.8.3 and until till 23:59 UTC, 3rd of May can be fully refunded. This refund will be available until until 23:59 UTC 31st of May; to claim it, please file a ticket to Customer Support. We apologize for any possible inconvenience and thank you for your patience. With Regards, WoWS Team " So they can offer full monetary refunds, they just didnt want to when thinking of rebalancing gc....

So in conclusion you dont want anything to counter carriers, and you want to be able to strike anything anywhere any time....

Well no... People were "Whining" because obviously carriers were incredibly broken and needed fixing.... Its not the communities fault that wargaming failed to fix them and just made the problem worse, that is 100% on wargaming. The easiest solution would have been to remove them right then and there as we knew that the game worked perfectly fine without carriers from all the carrier free matches.

You missed my point, let me rephrase it: Carriers were even more broken and unfun to play against back then than they are now. But they were only in like 1 of 5 battles, so in 4 of 5 battles, we got a carrier free meta, and that meta was infinitely more enjoyable than this current one.

Okay, hakuryu had 8 squads, but thats not exactly the norm... Anyways, the important point i made is that we have had a cv free meta for the better part of 2 years, because so few people actually played the old cv. Compare that meta to the one we have now, and tell me that you honestly believe this new meta is better and more enjoyable...

Old cv didn't have 8 squads at once.... But the big thing you've missed is that the CV population before 8.0 was close to non existent, which meant that you got cv maybe one in five matches. This meant that carriers didn't define the meta. What I'm saying is that we have basically had a carrier free meta for the better part of 2 years before 8.0 hit. And that meta was soo much more enjoyable than this current one.

Stalingrad changed the meta towards Henry's. Carriers changed the meta towards blobbing. Check avarege spotting charts, carriers have way more avarege spotting than anything else, so yes, carriers are the ultimate spotting tool. Check my stats, I have adapted quite well, but the meta I have adapted to is the most boring meta I have ever seen in this game.... So your damn right I'm gonna complain about it.

Anyhow, this thread is supposed to discuss possible changes to dfaa, and you have made it quite obvious that you are against it now @veslingr, but this is really derailing the topic, so i would be ever grateful if you let the people who want to discuss it do so now ^^, you have made your standpoint quite clear

Never said that

Carriers are massively topping spotting, while still keeping good damage and kills per game, one would think that they would have to sacrifice more to be the best scouts in game, thus one would see that topping the charts... Also your whole debacle of ships not creating metas is simply not true, because that is exactly what they do... Ships force players to adapt to them, this creates a meta. In clan wars, players have a bit more impact on the meta than in randoms, but it is still ships that force the meta, this is why we see a massive shift in meta in king of the seas whenever a new outlier ship comes out. This was last seen when stalingrad was released, it created a surge of different strategies between all the teams, before the meta stabilized differently than before stalingrad was released.

The problem with carriers has nothing to do with their balance. Its about the meta they promote, and the way they dont really have a counter. Also, you "forgot" to post avarege spotting, the one thing they dominate

Battleships absolutely wreck cruisers at close to medium range, the only chance that a cruiser would have in a 1v1 is long range kiting, but even then he will most likely lose to any same tier battleship.(talking about 1v1, so he cant use island play as he will have no spotting). At the same time, if the cruiser does have spotting, he can outplay the battleship with islands, and probably win every time. If both classes play optimaly and the conditions are equal, then the counter will win nearly every time. The carriers are the only exception to this rule other than a few very special ships that dont really fit into their class.

Because the blob meta is campiest most boring meta we have had in like 2 years.... And if not even aa cruisers with dfaa can split away from the blob, then quite frankly that is a failed meta.

dfaa giving you the chance to stop a strike does not equal immunity, it just means that you, just as every other class, have to play around the consumable designed to counter you. That is my point, since you complained that three dfaa ships would be immune if dfaa was changed like my suggestion, but the fact is that they already pretty much are when blobbing up, so no difference

"Oh no, i cant kill three aa focused ships of a class thats supposed to be my counter working together"

Then why do they also have among the highest kills per game, the highest survivability per game, and by miles, the highest spotting per game? Sounds a bit much dont you think? And what is up with you effectively arguing that carriers shouldn't have a counter?

But other ships cant reach the entire map, and they cant get anywhere on the map in 30 seconds, and they actually have to risk their lives to do damage. Also, something that you fail to understand, is that making dfaa properly stop drops, does not equal to aa cruisers being totally immune to planes. The consumable is active for 30-40 seconds, during this time you can go strike something else and then come back when its on cooldown. Carriers should have to play around dfaa, because right now their counter is just as vulnerable to them as everything else.

Fun and engaging game mechanics(tm)

And that is probably the biggest reason for how universally hated it is. The principle needs to change. Thats just not the case tho, i have played so many games where i kept shooting down strike after strike after their drops, but they just keep coming no matter how many planes you kill... As i said before, i posted a replay you should take a look at earlier in the thread. Take a look at that replay/result screen and tell me again that planes kills matter for surface ships.