Xevious_Red

So if they always do the same damage, and always do the same amount of flak bursts, and always have the same accuracy, what differentiates (at long range) between an IJN DD that has virtually no AA (but 5km range) and a DM which has tons of AA (and also 5km range). Does the DM fire more barrages per second?

Interesting. Will all CV have access to all 3 types of planes, or are some limited to only 1/2 types?

I've gone with not sure, because until I play it I can't really say. The flying the planes looks more exciting/cinematic than the current CV UI, where moving symbols across an almost 2D view is slightly dull. However only having 1 squad has the potential to be pretty dull too once the "newness" of the plane view has worn off if there's not enough of a challenge/counterplay. If I have to bait and jink through AA to pick someone off it could be fun. If I just fly some planes up and dump some torps and then get another squadron to go again it will be pretty boring. Regarding the skill gap, currently a great CV vs a potato one will have the great CV doing lots of damage/kills, providing loads of spotting AND stopping the potato CV from doing any spotting/damage. This gives a double whammy of not only doing loads for your team, but also cancelling out an enemy team member. With the rework it looks like not only will spotting be reduced due to having 1 squad instead of potentially 8, but that you can't lock the other CV out. So the great player will still be more useful due to more damage and better picked targets, but the potato CV will at least get to do something.

You could possibly do it where they have a squadron with a long cooldown (e.g. 3 mins). You use it like a normal ship, launch your squadron (probably park behind an island first) and do CV stuff with it, then when it has used all it's runs you go back to normal ship mode and play it like every other ship while you wait for the CD

Was good seeing you. Our team had a kagero that refused to go to the cap and spent the entire game shouting at our team in broken English. His 44% was not a surprise.

Unless they were in smoke this isn't true. It was patched a while back so that firing AA guns makes your air detectability at least the same as your AA range, specifically to stop minotaurs etc "stealth AAing"

Personally I like the highly boring option - "don't need to.stock grind anything ever"

It doesn't need to even be that many it depends how many games they play. If you have a great player with hidden stats play 100 games and win them all, vs 100 bad players that play 1 game each (each one plays the good player) then according to stats websites it would show 100 games played, 0% WR. So you could have more bad players hide their stats, but if the hidden good players actually played more games it would swing it negatively

I know certainly some of the very good players have hidden stats. Papidepupi was generally considered one of, if not the best CV players on EU. Saw he was streaming the other day and decided to check his account out to see what crazy WR he had got to (in OBT it was around 95%). His account was hidden.

I like it. It's kinda derpy and arcade bit quite fun. Since its entirely optional I see no harm in it

One of my concerns is with unlimited planes, unlimited range, and the ability to spot your own targets using the planes, they can potentially just sit at the back churning out squadron after squadron with no real downside beyond possibly a delay if the squad gets shot down. The other classes either need to risk return fire when they attack since they get spotted, have a team mate spot for them, risk being detected by radar/planes to sneak close enough, or gave a very low chance of success (long range torping). The current RTS CV risks running out of planes - if you keep flying into that des Moines you'll eventually run out of planes. The proposed rework doesn't risk anything, and doesn't have a reliance on any other team member either.

That was mentioned in the stream that it would also have an overhaul of the tactical map including reversing manouvers. I'd still want to be able to steer manually anyway.

They would be more likely to give a reset to all captains. Some of the skills may just go (service time for planes). Some may become less desirable (+1DB/fighter). Other classes may want to take/drop skills -BFT/AFT/manual AA etc

Again depends what they have the base fire chance as. If the rockets for example only have 1% chance while DB have 80% chance then the DB would be better at DoT, while the rockets are used for cap resetting/lower skill hitting fast moving targets/module breaking

Depends how rockets end up getting balanced out. From the video ones - yeah would totally agree with you. Fly in, dump 18 rockets, get 2-5k damage and maybe some fires. Repeat for all 4 runs and you have probably killed the DD. If you haven't then the next 4 runs will. Rockets may well end up as 6 per volley or 9, and the dispersion area may be larger - making them ok at decapping, but not much good at actually killing

I'd expect doubloons for premium ships. Tech tree ships I'd expect cost in silver back, and probably the xp spent unlocking back as free xp

In all likely hood yes. I personally sit in the middle ground - I tried carriers (250 games), I was competent enough in them - not going to claim to be a Unicum by any means but managed to hold my own, and I understood the mechanics (how to strafe, how to counter strafe, exit strafing etc etc). Problem was I just didn't really enjoy it. Never begrudged those that did, and never had a problem facing them, I just didn't fancy continuing playing them myself. For me, more tutorials wouldn't have rekindled my interest. The new rework I don't view as some kind of amazing revolution. I can't guarantee it will make everything (or even anything) better. It may well be a load of rubbish. But it does look interesting enough for me to want to try it.

Because if you are a company that introduces a product that you expect 50 people out of 100 will buy/enjoy, and it turns out that 4 people like it and 96 people hate it and won't touch it with a stick, then you ask the 96 why they hate it and what you can do to improve it. You don't ask the 4 people what they think will make it better. It was never going to be how to make it better for the existing CV players. It was about how to get the people that tried it and stopped playing, tried it and hated it, or just refused to try it. While it obviously sucks massivelynto have your preferred game style ripped asunder, carrier mains aren't actually the target audience. The real target is BB Kevin's "what would make you enjoy playing carriers"

This may be partially your problem. The first part is good - going forward, killing enemy DD and securing cap. Great stuff. You then however push forward and do a bunch of damage. Ok damage can be useful. But it's not your primary focus. You then notice the other flank has fallen and you lose. After you have taken the first cap, assess if you need to remain there. If the cap is under threat by an enemy DD then stay. If you are needed for spotting then sure stay. If however you are just farming damage off a retreating BB and trying to torp them then you are wasting your time. Instead you need to be looking at the next cap and seeing how you are going to take that/fend off enemy DD from there. If your team owns all the caps and you are farming damage that's fine. If your team does not own all the caps and you are off farming damage then you are probably contributing to the loss. As a DD caps are your main focus, and stopping them from being retaken. Torping a BB is good for lols but don't go out of the way to do it

The single squad is still better at recon than a DD - it can fly faster and do a sweep to reveal enemy direction of travel letting you know opponents early game. The spotting from the air allows you to spot behind islands to confirm cruisers positions without needing a DD to get Los or using a radar charge. Because the only downside of losing the squad is a longer CD rather than the loss of points/a ship then you can do riskier suicide spots, particularly is some AA can be avoided using WASD steering. A usual tactic is for 1/2 ships to hold one cap and get crossfire. A CV concentrating on these two (particularly from a more risky forward position) could probably wear them down enough or kill them so that a DD can spot. Currently DD are frequently used as lone wolves to spot/harass. Planes could find these DD preventing them from harassing your team. Depending on how much AA a group of ships puts out and how much you can jink through this you might find they can launch 3 torps even if they lose the wave of 12. Previously this was sort of pointless because of plane reserves but with no reserves this might become viable

A possibility might be to have a "hangar capacity" under the new model and still avoid the "being useless" of being deplaned - have the carrier start as shown in the video (e.g squads of 12). When they have received a certain number of casualties depending on ship/tier they instead launch a smaller wave (e.g. 6 planes). If they reach a second threshold of casualties this becomes 3. (minimum, can't drop lower). This means you could strip a CV of some of its power if it throws planes away recklessly while never making it not be able to do "something"

In several of the runs the AA was turned off. MrConway me tioned he thought the close range AA was set to zero for the video. The rocket strike on the zao (?) Was more telling. In addition to the 3 leaving after the initial strike, they also lose 4 to a flak cloud and another somewhere during the attack. This reduces it from 4 volleys down to 2 volleys + possibly a single plane volley

Ok so having watched the video several times and listened to the stream I do have some points/questions for those making statements: -People saying it's skill-less damage. The video was attack against ships that were either sat still or moving in a straight line. Imagine how "skillful" footage of BB/cruiser/DD would look if they were shooting a ship that is sat still or going in a straight line. Until we see footage against actual players it's harder to tell. Most of the attacks seemed pretty easy to dodge in a DD except maybe the rocket barrage which just looks more annoying for a DD. -"AA is massively weakened" A large portion of the video the ships had their AA turned off. MrConway said that he thinks the close range AA was set to 0 for the purpose of the test. The time where a zao (iirc) that had AA on got attacked they lost 4 planes In the first pass. -"You can't scout" while you can no longer scout potentially 8 places at once (Hak), you do still have access to a unit that moves 150-200+ knots making it far faster than a DD and able to fly over terrain. I'm fairly sure it can be used to find enemy positions, even if it's not great at keeping them perma spotted.

Well there seems to be a split opinion between them being damage monsters that click kill everything, and useless unable to hit anything that isn't picking it's nose

It looks like the TB are toned down - although there are 10 planes In a squad, they seem to only drop 3 torps between them. Although they can then turn around and do a second drop from what it seems