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It is not true. Minotaur is as strong as Zao is.

Oh, btw. Rumors goes, that Missouri get's Baltimores radar

Na poważnie to wygląda tak: jeżeli ktoś ma takie staty na wysoko tierowych CVkach, które jako jedyne przypominają odrobinę "hyper carry", to znaczy że naprawdę nie jest dobrym graczem. Baaaardzo dużo mówi tutaj 1.1 zatopionego okrętu na bitwę. Albo mistrz gra na FD i oczywiście skutecznie wspiera team, albo po prostu sobie nie radzi. Nie patrzyłem co tam alfred gra, bo sam byłem VIII na X, to raczej sie skupiałem żeby nie zdechnąć zbyt szybko.

Znaczy, chcesz mi powiedzieć, że 41% WR i 1.1 okrętu na bitwę, to jest nieźle na Haku?

ŻARTY SIĘ SKOŃCZYŁY!

Yup. I also like Leander, but it's a bit weaker then Fiji tier vs tier. From tier VI they get proper opponents as well as proper tools. Their HP is also a bit better, so now you need at least 2 citadels and then some to take them down. Which means they can survive more and heal more.

It is not a simple MM issue. Cause the problem will still remain in any other mode that is not random games. Right after radar introduction there was a semblance of balance on randoms, but rankeds were still dominated by BB's and DD's. By limiting BB's with MM capping, you will not resolve the issue, you just "hide" it. And this is a bad way to do balance. BB's are popular, and will always be popular. So they should be made less powerfull, and it would solve more then only CA problem on randoms.

Well in all honesty, I kinda agree with you. They are not totally useless. But the thing is, that those that are usefull, are boring (Zao), and those that are fun, are useless (Des Moines). Yes, you still can have good games in them, yes, you still can have an influence on the game. But the problem in my opinion is, that they are much less impactful then other classes. And while this has been going for quite some time, we still see their main opponents buffed, while CA/CL strenghts being taken from them. Is playing Des Moines fun now? For me it's terrible. I can't hunt CA's, can't hunt DD's. Cause even if I do get one, I'm still targeted by 3 - 4 BB's and it's a pretty slim chance I get out of there alive. Is it fun for playing Hindenburg? He's just a Zao wannabe now, since it's amazing brawling capacities are even more hindered by BB domination. Even more goes for lower tiers. That's why I exclusively play RN CL's right now, which have amazing tools and in fact are the only real cruisers that are usefull and have amazing carry potential, on par with BB's. For using the extremities, like useless, completely useless etc - I didn't use those before. But now, I just think, that maybe using such absolute terms will actually make a difference. Maybe someone there will think that they went a bit too far, that this game is not going where it should, that numbers of players on other classes is just too low. DD's and CV's doesn't counter BB's. How many torps can you put into Grosser Kurfurst with hydro on? How many Lexington TB's will manage a drop on North Carolina? How long and how many hits it takes to put a single BB down, how much effort from whole team has to go into removing a single BB. It's evident in your replay - how many time you spent on peppering one, tier VII BB, while being in tier higher cruiser with assist? And, even so, he would propably sunk you if only he used AP, this one full broadside hit you received would propably end you. Where's balance in that? Why BB's are being so hard to destroy, while each class is a piece of cake for BB? Game does not "weight" BB value against CA value. It can't operate in terms one BB is worth two CA's. I accept the fact that BB should counter CA - I don't accept the fact, that BB doesn't have any real counter to themselves, with such potency as they have. BB can easily kill DD if he spot it, at least as good as CA. He can easily kill CA. He can defend himself rather well from CV attack. Has a lot of HP and armour to fight other BB's. So, if I like winning games (not exactly, but for the sake of the discussion), what is the argument that should convince me to play CA when BB is better in every aspect? And in that term, CA is completely useless and incapable of carrying game. Cause when you face a BB player as competent as you are, you have no chances in winning that argument. But what's even worse, your role and your possibilities, unique for your class, are now being given to BB's in name of "BB needs to do everything, cause nobody protects them". Which is of course a whiny lie of bad BB players. Since the BB community is huge and vocal, they get buffs and buffs and buffs. What other classes get? Buffed Fighter Decks. Nerfed invisi fire, "armour optimalisation". So I think it's a rather high time for pretty absolute terms.

I think you also need to watch that replay again. Tirpitz was not "solo rushing", he had a lot of help coming behind him, and as you pointed - not much DD's to stop his advance. CV was totally unimportant at the time he was spotted. You had a small chance of winning the game, since your opponents were a bit unskilled (all of them below 49% WR), if you just keeped your focus on the B cap, ignoring the CV. But, again, you went for meaningless damage. Although your damage is of course impressive, your play is not. And it certainly plays exactly to my argument - even doing crapload of damage, facing terrible opponents, you still didn't manage to pull the win. Now, how do you think that game would go if you would sail NC for example? Cruiser and BB skippers below 49% WR? I think you would just trample them and wipe the floor with enemy team like that. But since you're playing Chapayev, and relying on freakin fires to kill enemy BB's, you just threw one third of the game to remove Gneisenau, a BB tier lower then you, while having help (I think it was Aoba with you, but not 100% sure). This is exactly what I'm talking about, a inability to carry games, even when you're top tier, faced with bad opponents, and in one of the best cruisers in game (which is of course another point - you use 2 examples, of Atago/Takao and Chapayev, that actually are somewhat close to the BB potential). No, I do not. As I already mentioned, posting screens with good results are a moot argument. However analysing gameplay as well as checking your stats gave me enough information. I'm very glad you find RU cruisers and Takao usefull. That is one point. The second, and more important, is: what counters BB's so hard, as BB's counter CA? What is a reliable source of instakill on a BB? You watched replay of cro? Every cruiser from enemy team was dead. What was left were a CV, DD and 4 BB's at some point. We're talking about how Zao overperforms - it doesn't. It performs as good as her BB brothers. Therefore, she must be nerfed, cause she's OP. I can't wait for a wave of BB whining about high tier RN cruisers. Since Neptune and Minotaur clearly keep their performance high, on par with BB's, this situation is surely a mistake by WG. No other ship can be on par with BB masterrace.

Watched the replay. It's almost exactly as I said. You first burned some Tirpitz, didn't sink him, and he proceed to butcher your team. Went for cap B, capped it with help, wasted 7 minutes burning Gneisenau down (which would propably sink you if only he didn't shoot HE at you), and then you got back at C, capped it, and went for CV (which is the only exception to what I wrote). So, basically, you being top tier, did a lot of meaningless damage, or damage that took waaaay to long inflict, and, instead of helping your team initially at C, which might result in won game, as would not focusing CV but BB's on cap B. So you spent whole game, farming BB and CV, not doing anything worthwile apart from sinking gneisenau. I think my point still stands.

Great, will watch it later and see for myself

You have the replay? Would like to watch it if it's possible.

I will tell you how much info can one take from that single screen, based on my experience as a cruiser captain. We can then watch a replay, if cro has one, and we could see how much of my post is "far fetched". 1. Note that he has only 1 critical hit. This does not happen whent you shoot at cruisers and destroyers, since their modules are pretty vulnerable. Threfore, it is safe to say, that DD's and CA/CL's weren't his primary target. 2. Note the staggering amount of hits. When you fight DD's and cruisers you don't do that much hits, since a lot of hits deal damage, which is not the case against BB's. Therefore, it is safe to say, that such big number of hits was needed to fight BB's. 3. Note the arsonist and witherer medals, as well as high caliber. That means most of his damage comes from HE and fires. That kind of damage is extremely rarely done on DD and CA/CL's - safe to say his damage was done to BB's mostly. 4. No citadel hits also would point at HE spam. 5. Exp for lost game - it's pretty lowish for a 200+k damage game, with 3 medals, base captured, help capping base, defending base and shooting down 14 planes. That would mean, most of that damage was being done to BB's. Since exp is obviously decided on % HP of target, it would suggest only few ships actually camed under his fire, and those that did, were propably BB's. 6. No confederate medal for such high damage game would again suggest, that pretty limited number of ships suffered that 200k damage - propably two or three BB's. 7. Since map seems to be "trap", my guess is that our cro encountered some BB's, withered them down for a long time, took 'em down. Propably before that he helped capping one base, after that he solo capped another. But those are just guesses. In the meantime, enemy team controlled the map and, in the end, won by points while leaving cro_pwr with 200+k damage and lost game. regarding exp, check this screen: 1. Damage distributed between cruisers, destroyers and BB's. 2. Damage done only to BB's

This is hilarious You know what's absolutely THE BEST in your screen? Apart from posting it as a "proof" that cruisers are viable? The absolute bestest, numero uno, and whole point of this discussion, is that you lost that game And it is also pretty obvious what were you doing. You bited BB's, with 20+ fires started, only 1 ship sunk. So, pretty much, you was this useless dude, who just spams HE whole game at some BB's, hoarding damage, but not contributing anything worthwhile to the team. GJ!

Może i mam, CC jest dla mnie nowe jak na razie ale na razie u mnie na rozkładzie brytole, więc się nawet nie pytałem. Ale dokonam zapytania w odpowiednim czasie

Jak się dorobię, to pewnie i zrobię

Nie grasz Czekasz do śmierci aż znerfią BBczki że będą 3 na stronę, jak nie znerfią, to kurzy się w porcie

Perth jest lepszy, bo jest bardziej uniwersalny

First of all, don't you dare speaking like that about USS Albany. Everybody knows it's batshit OP, but it's soooo good, that even the devs are astonished how good she is. EXACTLY. Come on WG, nerf those BB to the ground already. Everyone, apart from BB players, are already tired how overpowered they are! Not like you nerfed Zao three times already right? So, cmon WG, and hit those "favourite class of classic forum dad" with nerf bat, and hit 'em haaaard!

Flinta nie każdy ma

Bardziej jak Atlanta z dymem i bez HE

Belfast, w mojej opinii, jest sporo gorszy niż Fiji. Raz, że nie ma torped. To jest mega duża wada dla tego okrętu i ludzie sporo czasu poświęcają jak super że ma HE. Ale kiedy szarżuje Cię Scharnhorst w Twój dym, to te HE możesz sobie o kant zada rozbić. Torpedy są absolutnie kluczowe dla tych okrętów. A dwa, że nie ma naprawki. Więc każda strata HP bardzo boli, a wszyscy wiemy jak łatwo stracić HP na brytolach Natomiast Perth zasadniczo jest Leandrem. Ma i torpedy i HE. Jest więc lepiej wyposażony pod względem zadawania obrażeń niż Leander. Cierpi odrobinę w kwestii survi, natomiast "dynamiczny" dym i własny spotter plane nieźle to wynagradzają. Tak jak Belfast jest dla mnie gorszą wersją Fiji, taką lepiej dostosowaną do słabszych graczy, tak Perth jest mocniejszą wersją Leandra, ale odrobinę bardziej skomplikowaną. Zdecydowanie polecam Pertha, niestety nie mogę tego zdaje się poprzeć statami, ale z moich obserwacji wynika średni damage na poziomie 70k i bardzo dobre win ratio. Na 10 gier jakie nim machnałem (mniej więcej), zrobiłem chyba 3 krakeny, i co najmniej 2 kille na bitwę. A jednak mogę, myślałem że wypożyczone okręty nie będą się wyświetlać. Gry głównie solo, ze 4 zagrane w dywizji.

No si, ale patrzysz na to przez pryzmat grania głównie na deskach, ja patrzę przez pryzmat grania na krążownikach. Żaden inny krążek nie daje Ci takich możliwości. Zao jest na poziomie, ale tylko dlatego że w praktyce działa podobnie jak Minotaur - robisz swoje pozostając niewidocznym. Różnice oczywiście są ogromne, jeśli chodzi o gameplay - long range HE spam vs close range AP spam. Ale te krążki mogą robić swoje tylko dlatego, że nie interesuje ich zbytnio temat pt. LOOOOOOL jestem graczem BB MUSZĘ WSZYSTKO ROBIĆ NAJLEPIEJ. Jak schrzanisz na Minotaurze, to najczęściej jest to Twoja wina, a nie wina fartownego strzału jakiegoś randoma z 18 km. I takie rozwiązanie mi odpowiada. Ja nie mam aż takiego problemu z innymi krążkami z racji tysiąca przepychanek jakie już zaliczyłem. Myślę, że nie ma lepszego pojedynkowicza na krążownikach ode mnie obecnie. Radar oczywiście boli, ale zazwyczaj wybieram takie spoty, że w razie problemów móc się w miarę szybko skryć. Generalnie, o ile nie jestem naprawdę z "tyłkiem na wierzchu", to Des również nie jest jakimś mega problemem. Myślę, że nieźle nam idzie, jak na graczy z "kraju czwartego świata" łasego na Tachibanki za darmola.

We'll write some feedback from our side, as organisers, a bit later. We would like to encourage everyone to write down their opinion on the event - it would also help to show WG staff, that those kinds of events are much appreciated by community, so honest and detailed opinions are very welcome! Also, a one in a lifetime chance to see how Dropsiq and Izoz looks in real life...