Mad_Dog_Dante

Nope.

Lol, that would be nice, press N to spawn CL. On a mor serious note: I took my Assashio into battle yesterday. It has an air dectecabilty of 2.3 km. Once the carrier knew my location he had no problem tracking me. The DD is too slow compared to the 0.8.0 plane speed, it can't outrun the current rate of freshly launched squads when the carrier is half map disance away.

I agree, I don't think the average damage output overall is an issue that needs adressing. Lowering the airspeed of bombers will lower damage output if a carrier player keeps his carrier ship at the same distances as now. They can increase their DPM by manouvring their carrier ships closer to the area's they target shortening flight times to target drastically. By doing this they will risk exposing their carrier ship, not only their planes. This requires more planning and can add a layer of strategy to carrier ship gameplay. Carriers will have to look for the best locations to send their carrier to in order to balance flight time, cover and safety. Just like surface ships have to balance gun/torpedo range, cover and safety.

Absolutely, direct carrier control should be available in one way or another if you want players to actually move their carrier ships closer to target area's. Alternating carrier and plane control isn't rocket sience. Switch to carrier control: the planes idle or follow a pre set path, switch to bombersquad control: the carrier idles or follows a pre set path.

I do consider boredom a big deal. I am not proposing tediously slow planes, but slower planes to the current 0.8.0 speeds, especially at high tiers. Consider it a natural decrease of it's action radius, much like gun range on other ships. I am not proposing a 4 minute flight time and an Alpha buff

The problem is though that the planes indicate they are spotted even when you are not. So the Cv will know he has to circle the area. He will find you eventually.

The last testrun i did was my standard Assashio build, which admittedly is not a nice ship to some of you. I sail that ship to relax. Somehow a friendly yamato had it in for me and cussed me out halfway the match for being noob and the cause of our team losing. I ended up top score, capped and killed stuff. I sailed around undetected mostly, but once the Haku got my sent (i was in their side of the map by then), he threw wave after wave of rockets at me in full baby CV mode. I was close to a Des Moines but i think most of his AA was already destroyed. I died eventually unable to counter his relentless spam and the shells of his teammates that were bored but happened to be in the area. This Hakus told me he loved our tears and laughed at tormented players as well. This patch brings out the worst in some. Spamming and abusing broken Hakus but cant help yourself adding insult to injury? This patch will probably show you who you are ;-) I played 4 matches: Flint, Minotaur, Missouri and Assahio. Won two matches, lost 2. I ended up 1st place on my team in every ship, but only had fun in 1, the Flint.

The test match before that I was trying out the Minotaur for the first time. Had a Haka in it too. I didnt call him an idiot though

So, I just tested an AA oriented Missouri build to see what is up with the tier X CV's. It was horrible. The match was okay at start and at mid, we capped all 3 cap points. But before i knew what was happening my team started dying all over the map. The end game was some of the worst i've ever been in. 2 tier X CV's throwing full waves of TB at me, calling me an idiot for stopping just to be torped in chat. I explained to them that my engine was disabled by their torpedo spam. They laughed at my torment. Meanwhile 100% healthy full TB waves were thrown at me. I shot down 4 planes with my Missouri AA build. All my HP was taken by torps.

I would like the option to sell my Atlanta for dubloons like I sold the Belfast back in the day of the firing-in-smoke changes.

So I decided to buy the Flint instead of saving up for the Black as I had planned, just to feel the difference between the Atlanta with it's weak mid range AA and the Flint which has mid range AA thats comparable to it's long range. Below is a comparison in port without captain and with AA mod 1 installed. Continuous damage AA Short Range Continuous: Atlanta 114 Flint 166 AA Mid Range Flakburst: Atlanta 1103 Flint 1397 AA Long Range Flakburst: Atlanta 2352 Flint 2352 Flak bursts Mid Range: Atlanta 3 Flint 6 Long Range: Atlanta 7 Flint 6 Hit chance Short range: Atlanta 79% Flint 79% Mid range: Atlanta 83% Flint 83% Long range: Atlanta 83% Flint 83% Result in my first battle in her below. It was a totally different experience. The AA felt reliable, not weird like the Atlanta AA feels. The Atlanta can be blapped by a good pilot, the Flint can be saturated by torps in smoke, but at a valid cost and with a proper counter: Hydro - which I picked over the AA consumable. I can't bring myself to choose Manual AA over CE in the Atlanta. The Flint's mid and long range 6 flack bursts make the 4 points of Manual AA a valid choice. Not so much for the Atlanta where CE is the better value in combination with the radar. All in all I am not opposed to the 'dead areas' in the AA system in general, but I am dissapointed in my reworked premium Atlanta. If WG keeps it like this I would like to be able to sell my Atlanta for Dubloons like I sold my Belfast back in the day when the fire-in-smoke changed. I simply can't think of a valid tactic to prevent getting HE bombed or rocketspammed to bits behind an island when I use the Atlanta as it is supposed to be used: an island hopper.

@BLUB__BLUB Thank you for trying to help me understand this, but i think you are still talking theory. Does any CV main here have post 0.8.0 stories about how they had a heavily fought-over victory against a couple of ships with massive plane casualties (not talking stupid mistakes here)? And consequently were left to scouting only for the remainder of the match because their squadrants damage output was marginal? Or couldn't attack anything for a couple of minutes because they had to heal up? Because I have gazillion stories about my surface ships like that :D

I know, in theory plane availability can be 'damaged' temporarily, but let me put it this way: how often do you CV mains feel actually handicapped by the number of planes you have available at any time during a match. Like seriously crippled up to the point where you have to sit back and recover, like heavily damaged but often great BB players have to. Or lay low and avoid direct confrontation for the rest of the match like heavily damaged but great DD players have to. How real is this theory currently? Does the lack of planes gradually get worse towards the end of the match often? Or does it often fully repair itself enough over time to have full and healthy squadrants near the end of the round?

Surface ships run out of HP, consumables and modules. Their effectiveness is reduced with each damage trade. Do CV's currently ever run out of planes enough to be defenseless or seriously handicapped?

The issue with this 'new feature' of the Atlanta is that it hurts it's core survivability tactic: using islands as armor because she has no armor herself. With the AA change an Atlanta can easily be countered by CV's dropping bombs from the island side unless you are far enough away from it for the long range AA to actually work. This potentially opens you up to every 152/203 mm cruiser gun and all BB's out there for easy citadels and HE pens, and offers only easy avoidable flak bursts in return.

Duh. We are talking a 1 tier difference in these surface ships. Of coarse its feesable to compare values and see where the Atlanta differs from the Cleveland and why it behaves vastly differently now. Even more so because they behaved very simular before the 0.8.0 AA changes. Also, I was facing a lower tier bombing squad in the example.

I disagree politely. In the old build I was able to help my teammates with my 7.2 km AA protection. I actually took pride in that and actively went out of my way to help my teammates. Having to sail along side another ship within 3.5 km range (med-short) isn't teamplay, it's a freight train. I will also completely mess up the dd's stealth play. I already can't support a capping DD with AA while hugging an island with the new AA change. That's fair to me, I can enjoy having to trade risking exposure to great AA support if the AA support is reliable. But sailing within 3.5 km (med/short range) of a DD so they can help me with their AA in random battles? Did you try fighting surface ships in an Atlanta in open waters?

@wilkatis_LV Hi mate, yeah I checked the ship and captain before taking her into battle. I changed the captain to test different setups. I always used the full AA build on my Cleveland (VI and VIII version)/Atlanta captain, so I'm very familiar with AA on those two ships. It was my first 19 pnt captain ever :-) @jss78Below you'll find the numbers listed on the Atlanta and Cleveland (values are in port witout a captain but with AA guns Mod 1 fitted) Continuous damage AA Short Range: Atlanta 114 Cleveland 630 AA Mid Range: Atlanta 1103 Cleveland 1397 AA Long Range: Atlanta 2352 Cleveland 2352 Flak bursts Mid Range: Atlanta 3 Cleveland 9 Long Range: Atlanta 7 Cleveland 7 Hit chance Short range: Atlanta 79% Cleveland 81% Mid range: Atlanta 83% Cleveland 85% Long range: Atlanta 83% Cleveland 85% At medium range the number of flak bursts of Cleveland are 3x of that of the Atlanta. Avoiding 3 flak pufs is dead easy, 9 at that range is pretty tough.

I didn't forget :-) Fully upgraded AA ship and 19 point AA captain. I de-slotted manual AA because I have been in this situation before with manual AA slotted. Planes attacking a ship right next to me and i didnt kill a single plane with sector and DEFAA activated and Manual AA slotted. Also in my second screenshot where i decimated an entire bombsquad in 1 go I was alone and as you can see in the 2nd screenshot i did not activate my DEFAA in that wipeout. They just dissapeared and i had 11 plane kills without any actual confrontation. I am used to actively scout, lure and bait planes into my AA bubble helping my teammates by using AA off/on toggle and the DEFAA. Currently the Atlanta AA is an RNG bubble I have little part in. I can't bait planes into my AA, because if i activate AA/DEFAA when they actually commit it's too late: they already passed my strongest long range flak. And apparantly they can turn and attack two more times with full attack runs. And i cant activate it too early because they arent committed and i run the risk of wasting 1 defAA consumable if they disengage or simply press F. All i do now is leave AA on all the time and hope the pilot is not good enough or has RNG wipe everything away in 1 swoop like in my second example. The result is this: I do not feel I am actively playing a role. It is like the CV is playing a mini game in my general area, and if he wins i get punished for just being there. And if he loses his planes just dissapear.

Why is a tier VI CV able to do this to a full AA tier VII DEFAA activated Atlanta accompanied by 2 BB's? And what am I to do about it other then pray to on RNGezus and wiggle my ship?

Thank you for your explanation, really appreciated. It helps me understand part of what happened. Still, it doesn't help me understand this: He was able to execute all 3 strafes of this 1 squadron with the complete 3 planes per strafe. Let that sink in. ALL 3 strafes hit me succesfully with 3 attack planes per strafe while I had DEFAA enabled, sector activated, and 2 BB's close by. The 3 planes i killed were killed after they had ran their attack, which makes the kills pointless. I did 4- 5k fully repairable plane damage. He did 11 k unrepairable ship damage to an uptierted AA platform.

I know right. AA is simular to opening crates currently. 2 matches later for example, I completely wiped out 1 squad of bombers at max range without even trying, DEFAA was not activated. It's shizofrenicly inconsistant.

Like it.

I'm all out of popcorn damnit.