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Fix French light cruiser AP


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Reaper_JackGBR #1 Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:57 AM

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This is just horrendous, noobs everywhere who show full broadside at under 8km and you just can't punish them with French light guns because they can't find the effing citadel, every salvo you score 5-6 waterline hits that overpen, EVERY, SINGLE, TIME. 

 

Moreover the shells appear to randomly fall way short of the ship you're firing at when aiming at waterline at close in distances. These shells are broken as anything, they can't penetrate any other cruiser, even ones with no armour. The tier 4's guns penetrated and performed better than the tier 5 or 6, that's just wrong. 


Edited by Reaper_JackGBR, 21 April 2017 - 10:57 AM.

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beercrazy #2 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:03 AM

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i don't know about the pen problem as I haven't got higher in tier yet than 3 with the French ships but the falling short is defo a thing I have seen and even talked about it with people I have division with when watching em play while I as usual am dead

 

 

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creamgravy #3 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:25 AM

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It's low tier counter meta play, these guys your trying to shoot are pro. :trollface:

 

Spoiler

 



hgbn_dk #4 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:26 AM

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Only reached t-V myself... Thinks the ap on this ship is the best so far in the French line..No problem dealing out citadels on broadside cruisers.. Guess RNGsus is not on your  side

Reaper_JackGBR #5 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:38 AM

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View Postcreamgravy, on 21 April 2017 - 11:25 AM, said:

It's low tier counter meta play, these guys your trying to shoot are pro. :trollface:

 

Spoiler

 

 

They overpen the citadel regardless of broadside angle, there is literally nothing I can do, no cruiser at 4km distance should be be able to laugh off your AP for 1900 dmg salvos with 6 hits while he does 4k HE damage to your angled ship in return. 

Edited by Reaper_JackGBR, 21 April 2017 - 11:45 AM.

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Xevious_Red #6 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:43 AM

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I thought this was just me. I switched to using HE after spending all of tier 2 and 3 getting zero citadels with AP

Bladezfist #7 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:47 AM

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T1 - 4 AP is garbage, probably best to sail full broadside against other french cruisers firing AP at you. T5 seems to be a bit better, not great but I am starting to get games with 10+ citadel hits, it seems like 8km or so is a sweet spot for firing AP at french cruisers from french cruisers. Get any closer and it is constant overpens.

TheCinC #8 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:47 AM

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That has been not my experience so far at all.

What was your target?

 

I am more concerned with the Tier I, even though I don't expect to play it again soon, when I did, it seemed to be made out of citadels, even when using HE against it.

Never seen so many HE citadels before..


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creamgravy #9 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:51 AM

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View PostReaper_JackGBR, on 21 April 2017 - 11:38 AM, said:

 

They overpen the citadel regardless of broadside angle, there is literally nothing I can do, no cruiser at 4km distance should be be able to laugh off your AP for 1900 dmg salvos with 6 hits while he does 4k HE damage to your angled ship in return. 

 

Yep, low tier French CLs are very thin with zero armour. They're essentially destroyers at mid/close range, shoot AP through the nose and HE when showing broadside :great:

 



Reaper_JackGBR #10 Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:57 AM

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View PostBladezfist, on 21 April 2017 - 11:47 AM, said:

T1 - 4 AP is garbage, probably best to sail full broadside against other french cruisers firing AP at you. T5 seems to be a bit better, not great but I am starting to get games with 10+ citadel hits, it seems like 8km or so is a sweet spot for firing AP at french cruisers from french cruisers. Get any closer and it is constant overpens.

 

yes true, but this is wrong in so many ways. 

The game philosophy runs as follows: 

Showing your broadside at close range = death/taking heavy damage. 

This has held true so far since beta until now, I'm sorry but a cruiser showing broadside at 4km NEEDS to be punished for it, doing less than 2k damage is unacceptable, this needs to be fixed. My 152's seem utterly incapable of citadeling anything, not just other French Cruisers, while I have scored citadels with my Frenchies, they're few and far between, almost as if BB RNG was affecting me, not cruiser RNG. 


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creamgravy #11 Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:26 PM

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View PostReaper_JackGBR, on 21 April 2017 - 11:57 AM, said:

The game philosophy runs as follows: 

 

Showing your broadside at close range = death/taking heavy damage. 

 

This has held true so far since beta until now, I'm sorry but a cruiser showing broadside at 4km NEEDS to be punished for it, doing less than 2k damage is unacceptable, this needs to be fixed. My 152's seem utterly incapable of citadeling anything, not just other French Cruisers, while I have scored citadels with my Frenchies, they're few and far between, almost as if BB RNG was affecting me, not cruiser RNG. 

 

Not's not quite true, many broadside ships can't be citadelled at close range.

KM cruisers are especially good at trolling like this. I still have nightmares about trying to citadel countless broadside Nürnbergs in my Warspite before understanding what was going on. :teethhappy:

 

At high tier the skill is getting close enough to go 'full on noob'.

 



Gnirf #12 Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:35 PM

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I have had a lot of citadels on the other French cruisers during yesterday and today with AP, but AP effectiveness goes down qiuite fast when enemy ships are angled so I mainly use HE and switch far more between AP/HP than others, I had 4 icts in one single salvo against a Svetlana at 5-6 km so it is not impossible, at least with T4 T5 ships. But planning and sometimes withold fire due to relatively slow reload pay sometimes dividends, more so in French cruisers than in others. 

And yes most battles I have had decent AP performance when I have used it, I have not found them worse than other cruisers by a marked degree, I found their guns comfy to use. The Fire chance is good in T4 and 5 so I prefer HE.



Cybernetic_X #13 Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:49 PM

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The thing is; There is nothing that seperates the French line at all.

Aside from the 203's from T7+. It's not as "quick" as WG made it out to be. Using 'Engine Boost' consumable made it the same speed as that of the IJN cruisers.

 

It's just dumb imo.



Reaper_JackGBR #14 Posted 21 April 2017 - 12:54 PM

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View PostGnirf, on 21 April 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

I have had a lot of citadels on the other French cruisers during yesterday and today with AP, but AP effectiveness goes down qiuite fast when enemy ships are angled so I mainly use HE and switch far more between AP/HP than others, I had 4 icts in one single salvo against a Svetlana at 5-6 km so it is not impossible, at least with T4 T5 ships. But planning and sometimes withold fire due to relatively slow reload pay sometimes dividends, more so in French cruisers than in others. 

And yes most battles I have had decent AP performance when I have used it, I have not found them worse than other cruisers by a marked degree, I found their guns comfy to use. The Fire chance is good in T4 and 5 so I prefer HE.

 

Svietlana is one of the easiest ships to citadel in game, she can be citadeled by low tier German DD's. 

These French cruisers so far are just utter garbage above tier 4, can't citadel a broadside Leander at 2.5km with 152's, slowest reload of all 152's, HE shells have poor flight time and poor arcs above 11km, speed boost is negated by the fact that base speed is slowest of all CL's at tier 6. Armour is reasonable at tier 6 but not lower, AA is awful except mid range, torpedoes have good range but there's not nearly enough of them, rudder and engine seem to get knocked out a lot. 

 

At tier 5 they're good only because all tier 5 cruisers are in a very bad place except premiums and Furutaka. At tier 6 they are outperformed by everything, equaling in ability at best to Nuernberg. There is literally nothing a Gallisonere can do that a Budyonny can't do better. She only beats Cleveland in torps and Aoba in...wait she doesn't beat Aoba at anything either. 


Edited by Reaper_JackGBR, 21 April 2017 - 12:56 PM.

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Aotearas #15 Posted 21 April 2017 - 01:00 PM

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Welp, since I'm going to visit my family over the weekend I'll only have time for some light gaming everyone now and then and will probably use it to grind the low tier Frenchies. Guess I'll see how this pans out, not holding my breath though since I essentially have little to no interest in actually grinding the line over the other cruiser lines at this time.

SexyCroat #16 Posted 21 April 2017 - 02:15 PM

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Im actually amazed you people tried those crapster cruisers, i mean we all knew they were bad in testing, they arent better on live server either...

 


Pivke #17 Posted 21 April 2017 - 02:27 PM

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View PostSexyCroat, on 21 April 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Im actually amazed you people tried those crapster cruisers, i mean we all knew they were bad in testing, they arent better on live server either...

 

why not? some people didnt/dont go on test server. might as well try them on live.

oh, and maybe the ships arent such crap? there is a strong possibility that the testers were poor players, and they said its the "ships fault" for them sucking at game...

cant trust random testers and youtubers, ever...

play the ships yourself, and show them how its done.

 

i know im going to try them, despite all the bad press they got.


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SexyCroat #18 Posted 21 April 2017 - 02:29 PM

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View PostPivke, on 21 April 2017 - 03:27 PM, said:

 

why not? some people didnt/dont go on test server. might as well try them on live.

oh, and maybe the ships arent such crap? there is a strong possibility that the testers were poor players, and they said its the "ships fault" for them sucking at game...

cant trust random testers and youtubers, ever...

play the ships yourself, and show them how its done.

 

i know im going to try them, despite all the bad press they got.

 

go ahead m8 my free exp is more valuable than that

 


ShinGetsu #19 Posted 21 April 2017 - 03:12 PM

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Tier 5-6 aren't bad. They're just... bland.

Actually I'm having some fun with Galissonière, in particular when I find a DD at close range : my turret turns very well, the HE hurts, and the ship evades torpedoes very easily.

But I don't find the ship very interesting overall. I know I'm a good player, and that's probably why I actually am able to do something "decent" of such mediocre ships.

 

Algérie seems more fun, and I think I had my share of 152mm when grinding the russians, anyway, time to go back a bit on 203s.


Yes, indeed. It is called CL4PT. Where the transitory lands of the admirals of the fleet converge.

In venturing north, the battleships discover the truth of the old words. The smoke fades and the destroyers go without citadels. When the HE spamming is threatened, the bell tolls, unsinking the old admirals of the fleet from their graves. Kamikaze, Saint of the Torpedo. Taiho's aircraft Legion : the Cross Droppers. And the reclusive ship of the useless sacrifice, Yamato, the giant. Only in truth, the admirals will abandon their caps, and the devastated will rise. Nameless, accursed cruisers, unfit even to be CLs.

And so it is, that AP shells seeketh citadels.


tajj7 #20 Posted 21 April 2017 - 04:51 PM

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Only on the tier 4 but just gave up using AP completely as HE was much more reliable, like you said full broadside of other cruisers at sub 10km ranges and overpens, 




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