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Public Test 0.6.0 Feedback - New Skill System

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Kandly #1 Posted 29 December 2016 - 10:05 AM

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Captains,

 

Please post all feedback regarding the new skill system here.

 

For more details, please check the Q&A below:

 

What didn’t we like?
1.           5 levels of commander’s skills made for too long of an upgrade at the end, and it was hard to justify the usefulness of 5 points.
2.           Different numbers of skills on different levels, and “way too deep upgrades” also reduced variability - for each ship / type, in many cases, there was only one optimal combination. This negated the purpose of the skills – together with upgrades, they allow players to fine-tune the ship for individual styles of play.
3.           In the current version of the game, there was an imbalance of certain skills in either cost or effectiveness.
4.           There were only a few skills suited for aircraft carriers.
5.           Current skill classification focused on the obvious – on the characteristics affected, not the style of the game.
6.           There was a "practical" limit (18 points) and a "theoretical" one (19); after these, a commander’s development was completely unclear.

 

How did we deal with these issues?
1.           Now the maximum cost of a skill is 4 points. The maximum number of points is 19; the speed of upgrading at the end was increased, and in the beginning – slightly reduced. This sets a smoother and more interesting tempo for upgrading a commander at all stages.
2.           The number of skills increased, the matrix grew “in width”. As a result, we get a lot of interesting new combinations, and a far greater variability.
3.           Many skills were changed for the better balance. For example, Preventive Maintenance – previously a very expensive skill with an unjustified-for-five-points effect was slightly weakened and moved to level 1 – now, the bonus looks more appealing, considering the new cost. Basics of Survivability and Basic Firing Training, on the other hand,  were too powerful for the previous cost of 1 point (and therefore, uncontested) – they were moved to level 3 (and Basic Firing Training got an increased effect on AA defenses).
4.           2 specialized skills were added for aircraft carriers.
5.           Classification was revised in terms of playing style. New skill groups — Endurance, Attack, Support, and Prowess — provide a better understanding of the purpose of the skills.
6.           After receiving the 19th skill point (which in the new version has an adequate cost, and not the previous 9,999,999 XP), a Commander starts earning special, Elite Experience. It can be spent profitably: upgrading other commanders, quick retraining, or redistributing skills.

 

What changes to gameplay should be expected?
1.           There will be fewer universal skill sets in the game and far more specialized ones focused on a particular approach to a ship. For example, a battleship will be easier and more effectively upgraded for survivability of anti-torpedo armament, but to fit everything fully into one skill set will be difficult.
2.           There will be specific skills, around which interesting tactics can be built. For example, Radio Position Finding will let destroyers and cruisers effectively specialize in fighting for points and hunting destroyers. Inertia Fuze for HE Shells motivates players to change firing HE shells from “throwing fire around” into aiming at weak points and doing direct damage. Adrenaline Rush will encourage the most aggressive play, and will provide an opportunity to emerge victorious from a complex combat situation - and so on.
3.           With the release of this version, all players can reset their skills for free. Furthermore, new elite experience will allow continuing redistribution in the future, so that experimentation will not have to be paid for with doubloons.

 

Any compensation? 
Sure, for your comfort there will be certain measures to make the readjustment process easier. The exact mechanics will be announced later. 

 

Best,

Kandly



Hobbes_95 #2 Posted 29 December 2016 - 12:43 PM

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First of all, I didnt't play in the Public Test Server yet, but so far I am very pleased with the general buff to Russian DDs. Having Demolition Expert as a Tier 3 Skill instead of a Tier 4 Skill, saves 4 points for a Captain build including DE and Advanced Firing Training, both of which are skills that are kind of mandatory on a VMF DD. Now i might actually rebuy Kiev, because it will be playable with a 10 points captain as opposed to a 14 points one.

On the other hand, I am not that impressed with Radio Position Finding, because I believe island ambushing should remain a part of the game, and that skill really destroys that aspect. I for one do not, however, plan to use it, because I think 1 skill point for situational awareness should be enough for any semi good player.



LudwigHuang #3 Posted 29 December 2016 - 12:56 PM

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The Change about the'Dogfighting Expert' is totaly unaccetable. Because the Tier7 Premieum CV Saipan is the only negative affected CV in now Arrange Rule! Saipan use IX Fighter and other Tier / CV use VII Fighter.  It is actually nerf about Saipan and not fair to the Saipan Player.

Edited by LudwigHuang, 29 December 2016 - 12:58 PM.


ollonborre #4 Posted 29 December 2016 - 02:43 PM

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The radio positioning skill is not what this game needs. Even a vague 180 degree direction is still too much of an advantage, as it removes ambush gameplay of all classes, but mainly DD's and cruisers.

 

The counter argument is that it is only visible to you, but all it does is limiting your personal situational awarness, thus limiting the skillcap. Not to mention there is still a chat, and if you are in a division on voice coms it's even easier.

 

WG, you changed your mind about the secondary module, so we know that sometimes you listen. Please see that the amount of flak given by the playerbase is an indication that this is not something we want.


Pay to access scrub

p1j2i3l4 #5 Posted 29 December 2016 - 02:45 PM

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keeps telling me the server is unavailable :/ never tried the public test before and now i want to i cant login

 



p1j2i3l4 #6 Posted 29 December 2016 - 02:48 PM

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Nevermind it hadnt opened yet :/

Hobbes_95 #7 Posted 29 December 2016 - 03:35 PM

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Thinking back about the Radio Position Skill, I don't think its impact on Ambush gameplay will be that big after all. Lets face it, who really wants to use it? In my opinion it might be useful on a US DD if you want to hunt DDs, or at the very best on a fast cruiser. The only reason a BB would take it is that they fear (the very rarely occuring) DD behind the island ambushes that much, that they think they need that extra protection. And that will also not work 100% to its desired effectiveness all the time. So in my opinion it is more or less a waste of skillpoints on a BB.

I think it could be acceptable, but lets wait for some test feedback before we delve into this any further.

 

All the general changes are great in my opinion, especially the commander elite xp and the smoother skill point acquisition curve.


Edited by Hobbes_95, 29 December 2016 - 03:41 PM.


Dropman12 #8 Posted 29 December 2016 - 03:44 PM

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Well its still in testing phase...but still

How is Radio Position Finding meant to be used? To help cruisers and DDs? Sorry, but this is nonsence, as DDs are too fast too be catch at first, and cruisers are still obliterated by BBs they have rarelly chance to even try it. Figtning DDs is about waiting for their mistake, not active searching. Only real impact is that every ship afraid of torpedoes will take it, as there is only little chance to for DD to torp and not being "known". Knowing where are torps comming from means you need to be really dumb to be hit. And lets be honest here, even before dodging torps was generally about BBs stupidity. So I really dont understand this...as CV skipper I really cant see benefit, I wount kill DD with this sklil anyway. In the same way, i cant see how to torp semi-decent BB captain with this perk. Kinda weird, given the fact BBs are the best performing class already....



krautjaeger #9 Posted 29 December 2016 - 04:49 PM

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In my honest opinion:

 

Basics of Survivability should still be a level 1 capability, it is essential for many new folk to keep on surviving whilst learning how to deal with fire and flooding. Being tier 3 means they will have to choose between this and Superintendent and that will not be fun choice at all, there will be fallout from that one. Make Basics of Survivability tier 1 again, and set Priority Target to tier 3 effectively swapping them, as the latter is something people will get used to understanding how works after they've played a bit. Just my 5 cents on this matter.

 

EDIT: In essence, you want people to be able to choose Basics of Survivability at tier 1, Expert Marksman at tier 2 and then Superintendent at tier 3 as it is the core package of so many ships and what people are used to. Experienced players find a way to work around it, casuals and new people not so much. I really do hope you reconsider.


Edited by krautjaeger, 29 December 2016 - 05:24 PM.


ThePurpleSmurf #10 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:18 PM

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I have just finished the first match on PT and the RPS skill is exactly what i and many other have feared. It shows exactly the direction in realtime where the nearest enemy is. In the game just a minute ago it was more than easy to kill a DD that tried to ambush from around an island, he had no chance at all.

My honest opinion, even i know you would like to hear it in a nice and constructive way? This skill is pure B.U.L.L.S.H.I.T. and will make DDs almost obsolete. They can not contest caps anymore, because once a DD is in a cap it is know he is in the cap zone and RPS reveals the exact position, because RPS shows the direction on the point and the limit of the cap zone reveal the distance. Torps and blind fire will come in like there is no tomorrow. It will also be near to impossible to win close games with only very few ships left by smart play and sneaky recap, because the exact direction is known by the enemy. No more flanking for DDs, because .. well you guess it. DDs will now become what BBs and Cruiser already are - for range speccing camper, raining fire down on enemy ships (btw, Demo Expert was nerfed too, so the BBs cry less i assume) and ignoring objectives.

 

34 thumbs down for this game destroying skill.


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mtm78 #11 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:18 PM

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Posted Image

 

I.. CAN.... NOT... PHANTOM... WORDS... TO.... DESCRIBE.... HOW.... MUCH.... THIS MAKES ME WANT TO UNINSTALL THE GAME.

 

So ok, I see smoke and I see closest enemy must be in the smoke so I torp him, he dies... wow such skill much WOW!

 

Then I try to torp some isolated BB, and he just keeps his ffin BOW towards me thus negating all MY SKILL in positioning just because the BBaby choose a perk which shows where I am at. Again, so much skill, much wow.

 

Guess I will try RN CLs next so I can hunt all the DD's trying to use their pesky concealment. 


"First they nerfed the carriers and I didn't speak out because I didn't play carriers.                                    Then they nerfed the torpedoes and I didn't speak out because I didn't play IJN DDs.

Then they nerfed cruiser HE and I didn't speak out because I didn't spam HE.                                             Then they nerved concealment on every class except BB's, and I didn't speak out because I didn't have common sense

Then the BBabies came for me, and there was no one left to speak out for me."        

 


USS_Trump #12 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:24 PM

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Feedback considering the skill Radio positioning Finding by competitive players:

Okay so I tested a bit with different people in the training room (especially the Radio positioning Finding)

I have to say it basically kills every 'skillful encounter in the game'.

 

For people that don't know how it looks like: it shows this sign/indicator constantly on your screen:

and it updates itself on a frequent basis.

 

The enemy that is the closest target and being radared by you sees this sign:

 

The problem:

 

BB vs DD/CA is basically impossible for both of them. The BB player can preaim and adjust his ship movement according to the enemy position, a devastating strike is nearly impossible in one go this way.

 

Every good BB/CA player that is in  a 1vs1 situation will benefit an immense amount of this skill.

 

Take the german BBs for example: they have hydro, everyone has situation awareness to begin with and with the new 1 point skill Priority Target he even knows how many targets are aiming at him.

If you are a DD and rely on your stealthy torpedos, you are nearly useless and need to pray to actually get many hits in. The BB palyer will just angle towards you and give you a small silhouette -  that shouldn't be what we want to see 24/7.

 

During Cyclones:

 

During a cyclone this skill will take away the ambushing effect in a way that is quite worrying. If you as a player know where someone is and want to ambush him, he can just angle towards you and preaim - good ambush, especially if you are a squishy target to begin with.

 

Summary:

 

This skill should not be implemented into the game at all imho. It takes away a lot of skill and tactical options (not even for competitive but also for randoms) and if a player is actzally doing a good move and achieves to sneak behind an enemy line/flank he should get rewarded for that and not just be punished by being shown via an indicator for the nearest enemies. This completely removes  strategic gameplay parts of the game that should be in there.
 

I am speaking for myself and many other competitve players  (many OMNI players for now that are testing right now) and we are really worried about that skill. We hereby declare that we would like to see this skill being removed from the game since it takes away a lot of strategic approaches, depth of the game(-mechanics) and playerskill.

 

 

 


Edited by USS_Trump, 29 December 2016 - 05:40 PM.

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mtm78 #13 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:25 PM

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View PostUSS_Trump, on 29 December 2016 - 06:24 PM, said:

and many other competitve players

 

Who might this be, just for clarification :)

 

edit: makes for 'more valued' feedback if you specify it ;)


Edited by mtm78, 29 December 2016 - 05:27 PM.

"First they nerfed the carriers and I didn't speak out because I didn't play carriers.                                    Then they nerfed the torpedoes and I didn't speak out because I didn't play IJN DDs.

Then they nerfed cruiser HE and I didn't speak out because I didn't spam HE.                                             Then they nerved concealment on every class except BB's, and I didn't speak out because I didn't have common sense

Then the BBabies came for me, and there was no one left to speak out for me."        

 


_FTD_ #14 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:28 PM

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View PostUSS_Trump, on 29 December 2016 - 05:24 PM, said:

Feedback considering the skill Radio positioning Finding by competitive players:

Okay so I tested a bit with different people in the training room (especially the Radio positioning Finding)

I have to say it basically kills every 'skillful encounter in the game'.

 

For people that don't know how it looks like: it shows this sign/indicator constantly on your screen:

and it updates itself on a frequent basis.

 

The problem:

 

BB vs DD/CA is basically impossible for both of them. The BB player can preaim and adjust his ship movement according to the enemy position, a devastating strike is nearly impossible in one go this way.

 

Every good BB/CA player that is in  a 1vs1 situation will benefit an immense amount of this skill.

 

Take the german BBs for example: they have hydro, everyone has situation awareness to begin with and with the new 1 point skill Priority Target he even knows how many targets are aiming at him.

If you are a DD and rely on your stealthy torpedos, you are nearly useless and need to pray to actually get many hits in. The BB palyer will just angle towards you and give you a small silhouette -  that shouldn't be what we want to see 24/7.

 

During Cyclones:

 

During a cyclone this skill will take away the ambushing effect in a way that is quite worrying. If you as a player know where someone is and want to ambush him, he can just angle towards you and preaim - good ambush, especially if you are a squishy target to begin with.

 

Summary:

 

This skill should not be implemented into the game at all imho. It takes away a lot of skill and tactical options (not even for competitive but also for randoms) and if a player is actzally doing a good move and achieves to sneak behind an enemy line/flank he should get rewarded for that and not just be punished by being shown via an indicator for the nearest enemies. This completely removes  strategic gameplay parts of the game that should be in there.
 

I am speaking for myself and many other competitve players and we are really worried about that skill. We hereby declare that we would like to see this skill being removed from the game since it takes away a lot of strategic approaches, depth of the game(-mechanics) and playerskill.

 

 

 

+1

 

Can't add much more, it is an absolute disaster for the game.


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loppantorkel #15 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:29 PM

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View Postollonborre, on 29 December 2016 - 02:43 PM, said:

The radio positioning skill is not what this game needs. Even a vague 180 degree direction is still too much of an advantage, as it removes ambush gameplay of all classes, but mainly DD's and cruisers.

 

The counter argument is that it is only visible to you, but all it does is limiting your personal situational awarness, thus limiting the skillcap. Not to mention there is still a chat, and if you are in a division on voice coms it's even easier.

 

WG, you changed your mind about the secondary module, so we know that sometimes you listen. Please see that the amount of flak given by the playerbase is an indication that this is not something we want.

Maybe if it only was available to cruisers and only functioning on open water, but at a lower cost?



krautjaeger #16 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:30 PM

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After playing around with this a bit now, I'd say wait a while and work on these skills more. It seems rushed, and not so well thought through. You got core packages split up, you got superskills that pinpoint. This needs further looking in to. Perhaps a survey to the entire community by email, as skills are possibly one if not the most important bit in the game. Here's me praying and having a new year wish that this be postponed a bit.

Srle_Vigilante #17 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:35 PM

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Hon hon hon.... i dono what side of the smoke he is... hmmmmmm

Ow wait...

Spoiler

 

Ow yea and make it permanently on, because why not you know.

Spoiler

I swear if this skill passes 1 more testing phase im going to uninstall the game the second the patch hits the servers.


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Gendomaoken #18 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:36 PM

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View PostUSS_Trump, on 29 December 2016 - 05:24 PM, said:

Feedback considering the skill Radio positioning Finding by competitive players:

Okay so I tested a bit with different people in the training room (especially the Radio positioning Finding)

I have to say it basically kills every 'skillful encounter in the game'.

 

For people that don't know how it looks like: it shows this sign/indicator constantly on your screen:

and it updates itself on a frequent basis.

 

The problem:

 

BB vs DD/CA is basically impossible for both of them. The BB player can preaim and adjust his ship movement according to the enemy position, a devastating strike is nearly impossible in one go this way.

 

Every good BB/CA player that is in  a 1vs1 situation will benefit an immense amount of this skill.

 

Take the german BBs for example: they have hydro, everyone has situation awareness to begin with and with the new 1 point skill Priority Target he even knows how many targets are aiming at him.

If you are a DD and rely on your stealthy torpedos, you are nearly useless and need to pray to actually get many hits in. The BB palyer will just angle towards you and give you a small silhouette -  that shouldn't be what we want to see 24/7.

 

During Cyclones:

 

During a cyclone this skill will take away the ambushing effect in a way that is quite worrying. If you as a player know where someone is and want to ambush him, he can just angle towards you and preaim - good ambush, especially if you are a squishy target to begin with.

 

Summary:

 

This skill should not be implemented into the game at all imho. It takes away a lot of skill and tactical options (not even for competitive but also for randoms) and if a player is actzally doing a good move and achieves to sneak behind an enemy line/flank he should get rewarded for that and not just be punished by being shown via an indicator for the nearest enemies. This completely removes  strategic gameplay parts of the game that should be in there.
 

I am speaking for myself and many other competitve players  (many OMNI players for now that are testing right now) and we are really worried about that skill. We hereby declare that we would like to see this skill being removed from the game since it takes away a lot of strategic approaches, depth of the game(-mechanics) and playerskill.

 

 

 

 

Exacly my experience. This ability removes player skill from gameplay. It should never be implemented. If WG wants to remove invisifire, than REMOVE INVISIFIRE, not give out position of the DDs tailing the player...



JG4_sKylon #19 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:41 PM

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View PostJG4_sKylon, on 29 December 2016 - 05:32 PM, said:

Played a few matches with DD, skilled RDF.

 

Game starting, the line below the countdown is the RDF indicator showing direction of nearest enemy.

Spoiler

 

If you are RDF "spotted", there is an indicator at the upper right.

Spoiler

 

First enemy contact, a Nurnberg 11.0km away.

The RDF indicator ist not directly above the Nurnberg, but slightly off to the left. This indicates an enemy closer to me than 11km, but still unspotted. Checking the lineup it has to be a DD

 
Spoiler

 

 

A few seconds later. You can clearly see that the RDF indicator moved further to the right and is right of the Nurnberg. The DD is trackable in realtime, no delay!

Spoiler

 

 

The enemy DD opens fire and gets spotted. Please check his position and the position of the RDF indicator

Spoiler

 

 

It is clear that this skill does not only show a indifferent vector! I was able to preaim my guns almost pinpoint to the enemy DDs position.

THIS SKILL HAS TO BE DELETED!

 


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Patch 0.6.0: giant Buff for BBs

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NO TO RADIO POSITION FINDING!!


mtm78 #20 Posted 29 December 2016 - 05:47 PM

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I wonder if you replace the indicator ( like in the past with WoT incoming fire indicator ) you could just get a simple pointy arrow.......  

"First they nerfed the carriers and I didn't speak out because I didn't play carriers.                                    Then they nerfed the torpedoes and I didn't speak out because I didn't play IJN DDs.

Then they nerfed cruiser HE and I didn't speak out because I didn't spam HE.                                             Then they nerved concealment on every class except BB's, and I didn't speak out because I didn't have common sense

Then the BBabies came for me, and there was no one left to speak out for me."        

 





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